I'll add that the stat guys like to say "Advanced metrics" because it sounds more complicated and, if you dismiss FIP, they can say "Well, it's just because you don't really understand."    Which is pretty ******* annoying.   

BL says it's because you don't really understand it.

Being over 40, I dispute the characterization that older fans "reject" the advanced metrics currently being touted (stupid **** like BABIP or FiP).  I think the older fans recognize that stats can give the wrong impression, and that sometimes, the Eye test tells you who the good ballplayers are.

Just for an explanation Detroit is at .326 and the Angels are .281.

Why do you think that is?

Posted by dahsdebater on 8/5/2015 3:24:00 PM (view original):
FIP is dumb as ****.

I disagree. If you only look at DIP stats you aren't getting a complete picture, but it's definitely useful in some cases.

The idea that major league pitchers have little to no control over what balls in play become hits and what balls in play become outs is pretty easy to see. 

Told ya'.

Posted by dahsdebater on 8/5/2015 7:43:00 PM (view original):
If you're a dumbass.

How is that dumb?

We know that, for the most part, major league pitchers don't have control over whether or not a given ball in play is a hit or an out.

The amount of control that they do have over the quality of contact isn't measurable by play by play data. DIP stats simply remove it, reasoning that if you can't separate the pitching performance from the fielders performance, ignoring that piece is a viable option.

I don't think anyone considers it s be all/end all, but it's useful when used correctly.

Posted by dahsdebater on 8/5/2015 7:45:00 PM (view original):
You can find well-hit percentages for hitters with no difficulty.  That means the data exists to compute well-hit against rates for pitchers.  If you want to compute a pitching metric using the 3 true outcomes + well-hit percentage, then ok.  But pretending that we can't say anything about how hard a pitcher gets hit, or that the pitcher has no control over what happens on a ball in play, just feels ignorant.

Ww have quality of contact stats, but only a few year's worth, and it's a proprietary algorithm that spits out three categories--soft%, med%, hard%.

Doesn't really help if you're talking about a player pre-2010. Or if you want any sort of specifics.

Hopefully the statcast data gets released soon.

Posted by bad_luck on 8/5/2015 4:57:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 8/5/2015 3:24:00 PM (view original):
FIP is dumb as ****.

I disagree. If you only look at DIP stats you aren't getting a complete picture, but it's definitely useful in some cases.

The idea that major league pitchers have little to no control over what balls in play become hits and what balls in play become outs is pretty easy to see. 

FIP is the more retarded cousin of the only slightly less retarded BABIP.

???

What's retarded about BABIP?