Should KC plunk Bautista because he's a jerk? Topic

MikeT23
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Like ice cream or candy.
7/1/2016 1:03 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by wylie715 on 7/1/2016 12:46:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 10:34:00 AM (view original):
Sure. But if he thinks the pitch is a ball, he should let it go.
doesn't matter what the hitter thinks. If the umpire thinks its a strike, its a strike regardless of what the hitter thinks. If I'm a hitter I'm taking into account how the ump has been calling balls & strikes. If its a close pitch I think is a ball, but I know the ump has been calling pitches like that strikes, I'm swinging.
Your statement should be if the hitter thinks the ump will call the pitch a ball, he should let it go.
Semantics.

If the hitter thinks the pitch is a ball, he thinks it will be called a ball.
7/1/2016 1:05 PM
tecwrg
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Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 1:03:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 12:13:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 12:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 11:56:00 AM (view original):
If it's a pitch that's generally regarded as "too close to take" with two strikes. and it's taken for called strike three, then it's difficult to insist that the hitter was "at the plate trying to get a hit".

Unless you can show me an example of a player getting a hit by not swinging.
So any player caught looking didn't go up to the plate with the intention to get a hit?
Maybe that's how they went up to the plate. But not how they left it.

Why do hitters take 3-0 pitches right down the middle?
I don't know. Why do hitters sometimes take strikes?
You don't know?

You can't think of a single reason why a hitter would take a 3-0 pitch right down the middle of the strike zone?
7/1/2016 1:06 PM
tecwrg
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Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 1:05:00 PM (view original):
Posted by wylie715 on 7/1/2016 12:46:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 10:34:00 AM (view original):
Sure. But if he thinks the pitch is a ball, he should let it go.
doesn't matter what the hitter thinks. If the umpire thinks its a strike, its a strike regardless of what the hitter thinks. If I'm a hitter I'm taking into account how the ump has been calling balls & strikes. If its a close pitch I think is a ball, but I know the ump has been calling pitches like that strikes, I'm swinging.
Your statement should be if the hitter thinks the ump will call the pitch a ball, he should let it go.
Semantics.

If the hitter thinks the pitch is a ball, he thinks it will be called a ball.
Good Lord.

It's not semantics. It's understanding the umpire's strike zone, not what the hitter thinks the strike zone should be.
7/1/2016 1:07 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 1:07:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 1:05:00 PM (view original):
Posted by wylie715 on 7/1/2016 12:46:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 10:34:00 AM (view original):
Sure. But if he thinks the pitch is a ball, he should let it go.
doesn't matter what the hitter thinks. If the umpire thinks its a strike, its a strike regardless of what the hitter thinks. If I'm a hitter I'm taking into account how the ump has been calling balls & strikes. If its a close pitch I think is a ball, but I know the ump has been calling pitches like that strikes, I'm swinging.
Your statement should be if the hitter thinks the ump will call the pitch a ball, he should let it go.
Semantics.

If the hitter thinks the pitch is a ball, he thinks it will be called a ball.
Good Lord.

It's not semantics. It's understanding the umpire's strike zone, not what the hitter thinks the strike zone should be.
Yes, it is. If a hitter thinks, "this pitch is a ball," it means he thinks the umpire will call it a ball. Otherwise, he'd think, "this pitch is a strike."
7/1/2016 1:11 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 1:06:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 1:03:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 12:13:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 12:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 11:56:00 AM (view original):
If it's a pitch that's generally regarded as "too close to take" with two strikes. and it's taken for called strike three, then it's difficult to insist that the hitter was "at the plate trying to get a hit".

Unless you can show me an example of a player getting a hit by not swinging.
So any player caught looking didn't go up to the plate with the intention to get a hit?
Maybe that's how they went up to the plate. But not how they left it.

Why do hitters take 3-0 pitches right down the middle?
I don't know. Why do hitters sometimes take strikes?
You don't know?

You can't think of a single reason why a hitter would take a 3-0 pitch right down the middle of the strike zone?
Do you know?

To me, that hitter decided to take the pitch before it was even thrown. The location was irrelevant.
7/1/2016 1:13 PM
tecwrg
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Do you think that "deciding to take a pitch before it is even thrown, location is irrelevant" is a good mindset for a hitter who comes up to the plate "looking for a hit" as you claim they always do?

Perhaps there's another reason why they would take that 3-0 pitch right down the middle?
7/1/2016 1:16 PM
tecwrg
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Do you understand baseball?
7/1/2016 1:17 PM
tecwrg
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Would you like to ask Edgar?
7/1/2016 1:19 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 1:18:00 PM (view original):
Do you think that "deciding to take a pitch before it is even thrown, location is irrelevant" is a good mindset for a hitter who comes up to the plate "looking for a hit" as you claim they always do?

Perhaps there's another reason why they would take that 3-0 pitch right down the middle?
Yes, it is a good mindset. The goal is to get a hit. But if the count is 3-0, taking a pitch is smart. Walks are a positive outcome.
7/1/2016 1:21 PM
bad_luck
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Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 1:19:00 PM (view original):
Would you like to ask Edgar?
Would he tell me that walks are a bad thing or is he, unlike you and Mike, not a dumbass?
7/1/2016 1:22 PM
tecwrg
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Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 1:21:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 1:18:00 PM (view original):
Do you think that "deciding to take a pitch before it is even thrown, location is irrelevant" is a good mindset for a hitter who comes up to the plate "looking for a hit" as you claim they always do?

Perhaps there's another reason why they would take that 3-0 pitch right down the middle?
Yes, it is a good mindset. The goal is to get a hit. But if the count is 3-0, taking a pitch is smart. Walks are a positive outcome.
So was the hitter "trying to get a hit" when he took that 3-0 pitch right down the middle of the plate?
7/1/2016 1:24 PM
bad_luck
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No, he was taking in this example because a walk is a guaranteed non-out while contact is only a non-out around 40% for the absolute best hitters.

7/1/2016 1:40 PM
bad_luck
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So, I guess you're right. Sometimes hitters take a pitch if they think it will get them on base.

Cool.
7/1/2016 1:41 PM
tecwrg
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Posted by bad_luck on 7/1/2016 8:40:00 AM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 7/1/2016 7:23:00 AM (view original):
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/1/2016 7:06:00 AM (view original):
What if it was Edgar Martinez instead of Mike Trout? Would you want him to try to get a hit or just take his walk?
This is where it gets really uncomfortable for BL. I expect him to either avoid the question, or try to divert the discussion.
Why would that uncomfortable? All hitters are at the plate trying to get a hit.
Actually, my point was to challenge this.

Apparently, all hitters at the plate are NOT trying to get a hit.

Sometimes, they are trying to get a walk (as evidenced by taking all the way on 3-0).
Sometimes, they are trying to make a productive out (as evidenced by sacrifice bunts).
7/1/2016 2:04 PM
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Should KC plunk Bautista because he's a jerk? Topic
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