And how do "we" do it?

Candidates on both sides of the aisle pay lip service to this concept, but neither really defines how they will address this.  Is this something that can be accomplished through government in the first place?  If so, how?  If not, then why not (and how)?

When the press talks about a particular candidate (who, by the way will never be middle class themselves) appealing to the "middle class", what does this really mean?

Interested both sides' opinion on this (with the standard disclaimer that I am a "radical religious right wing nut job" according to my liberal friends, and a regular dude to my conservative friends - yes I have both....).  I am also smack in the middle of the middle class myself.

Stop squeezing the middle class by taking their money and giving it to the non working class (old people ex workers not included). Also stop increasing the minimum wage. It moves the middle class closer to the poverty level.

"Restore the middle class" means nothing unless you define "middle class".    It was easy 50 years ago.   Dad put on the suit and tie went to work.  Mom stayed home and tended to the house/kids.   They had a car and a TV.     Upper class had a maid and lower class put on blue jeans, grabbed a bag lunch and got their hands dirty.  None of that applies now.

No one wants a lower class, and it is not defined the same as it was 50 years ago, and virtually everyone wants to drag the upper class down.    You can't restore what doesn't exist.

The minimum wage isn't designed to be a living wage.   It's an entry level pay that you are supposed to aspire to exceed.  That's what people fail to understand.  It's really simple math.

I make $10 an hour.  My hamburger costs $5.  Burger Joint owner makes $3 off that burger.    My burgerflipper makes $7 an hour.   Burgerflipper has a pay increase to $12 per hour.   Burger Joint owner is STILL going to make $3 on that burger.   Where does it come from?   He raises price of burger.   In order to be able to afford that burger, I need to make more.  Well, since min wage is now $12, I tell my boss I should make $16.    He agrees.    Now, the $1 widget I make will cost $1.75 because my boss is STILL going to make .75 off that damn widget.   Widget buyers need more money now. 

It's just a stupid cycle.   If you want to make more money, be more valuable to society. 

Posted by raucous on 1/5/2016 7:51:00 AM (view original):
Stop squeezing the middle class by taking their money and giving it to the non working class (old people ex workers not included). Also stop increasing the minimum wage. It moves the middle class closer to the poverty level.

No matter what, always find a way to blame poor people. Immigrants too, if possible.

"Restore the Middle Class" means:

Vote for me so I can screw you dumba$$'s over when I get into office.

Think about it, every politician says it in every election.... If any of them worthless SOB's could actually Restore the Middle-Class they wouldn't need to keep restoring it.

That is one of Hillary's big themes, "Restore the Middle Class" !!! Yet she proposes to continue the ways of Obama. If Obama's way is so darn good then she shouldn't have to restore it. It already would be great....

Posted by bad_luck on 1/5/2016 6:22:00 PM (view original):

Posted by raucous on 1/5/2016 7:51:00 AM (view original):
Stop squeezing the middle class by taking their money and giving it to the non working class (old people ex workers not included). Also stop increasing the minimum wage. It moves the middle class closer to the poverty level.

No matter what, always find a way to blame poor people. Immigrants too, if possible.

Since when do poor people make policy for the government?

What the government does is raise the minimum wage and that creates more poor people.

The poor burger flipper makes $8/hr.  He worked hard and received a pay raise now making $10/hr.  Meanwhile Gov. Liberal wants to "help the poor" and increases minimum wage to $10/hr..  The burger flipper falls back into poor status at minimum wage because all of the prices of the goods he was able to purchase has gone up to meet the new labor costs.  Also anyone else making between $8-10/hr also joins him at being poor and no one can get out of this vicious cycle and they start to consume the "middle class".

Hey bad, who "blames the poor"?  I understand some make illegal immigrants into scapegoats, but that doesn't address the issue.  How can a politician (or government) "restore" the middle class, and can they?  Can they legislate opportunity and fairness?

What does it even mean?  How did the "middle class" get created in the first place?

I know for me, I would love to work up and out of it if possible, but I'm not sure I have the necessary dedication to that above other things (like family time and support and creative enough ideas to climb that ladder).

Don't bother trying to engage BL in anything resembling serious discussion.  He's just a mouthpiece for lefty rhetoric.

Has he blamed RACIST!!!! cops yet?   Because, if he hasn't, he will.

Posted by silentpadna on 1/7/2016 7:23:00 AM (view original):
Hey bad, who "blames the poor"?  I understand some make illegal immigrants into scapegoats, but that doesn't address the issue.  How can a politician (or government) "restore" the middle class, and can they?  Can they legislate opportunity and fairness?

What does it even mean?  How did the "middle class" get created in the first place?

I know for me, I would love to work up and out of it if possible, but I'm not sure I have the necessary dedication to that above other things (like family time and support and creative enough ideas to climb that ladder).

I was responding specifically to raucous, who said something to the effect of, "stop taking money from the middle class and giving it to the poor." Which is something people say, in one form or another, pretty often.

And it's ridiculous.

First of all, the middle class isn't shrinking because money is moving from the middle down. People in the middle are getting poorer and people in the bottom are getting poorer. While people at the top are getting wealthier. Money is moving from the middle and bottom to the top. A lot of that is directly related to government policy, so raucous is partly right. But not in the way he thinks.

Basic safety nets for non-elderly aren't where the vast majority of the tax dollars go. So even if we stopped spending 11% of the federal budget on programs designed, for example, to keep very poor people from starving to death, taxes on the middle class wouldn't be impacted. At least not to a degree that would impact whether or not a family stayed in the middle class.

But there are policy choices that do impact the middle class. Shifting the tax burden from the upper income brackets to a flatter, less progressive system has a negative effect on the middle and lower classes. Anyone who argues for a flat tax or a 9-9-9 plan etc., is saying that the rich should pay a smaller share of the taxes. Fine, if that's their argument. But they usually hide behind rhetoric about being fair or bullshit about how their plan would actually help the middle class. It's trickle down bullshit with a different label.

On the other hand, reducing the tax burden on the middle class, strengthening labor laws*, increasing inflation (most inflation is wages), and reducing unemployment, would help people in the lower and middle classes and reduce the concentration of wealth at the upper percentiles.

*did you know that under federal law, it's illegal for employers to punish/fire employees for discussing their pay? Yet, the penalties for violating the law are so toothless that employers do it on a wide scale.

  How are people on the bottom getting poorer?  Who are these people?  Why aren't there more jobs?  Who is getting jobs?  Why aren't legal citizens getting jobs?  Who is running this thing?  Why do governmental job salaries increase by law every year while the rest of us are left to fall down and support the mandatory government increase supported by only one party and their President against the will of the American people?  

  I'm beginning to understand how all the people get weaker and poorer while the politicians get richer because they control everything and leave you helpless.