I'd like to add you can't educate those who don't want it. So, before dumping billions into education, make sure there's someone to educate.

Quite simply, everyone isn't college material. Some aren't high school material. ****, some aren't grade school material. They have no interest in sitting in a classroom while Mr. History drones on about 1776. What do you do with them? Because, quite frankly, they're going to be disruptive to the learning process. And, as you move along the education ladder, there are more of them. What do you do with them?

ARE YE SUGGESTING DRAFTING 9 YEAR OLDS?!??!?! THAT SEEMS A BIT EXTREME, IMO!!!!!!!

Posted by tecwrg on 9/28/2016 8:23:00 AM (view original):

Posted by sjpoker on 9/28/2016 5:38:00 AM (view original):

Posted by toddcommish on 9/28/2016 1:06:00 AM (view original):

Posted by The Taint on 9/28/2016 12:50:00 AM (view original):
Not to mention you start cutting programs like that and crime goes up.


Stop starting wars is another good start.

Oh, so if some people don't get government handouts, they'll resort to crime??!?!

WHY DON'T THEY JUST ******* GET A JOB OR LEARN A TRADE?!?!

I can't believe I have to say this....

BL is right

1) Flat tax plans shift the tax burden to the poor. This is true. Most of the poor in this country pay 10 - 15% taxes. While it is true that many super rich do in fact play close to zero in taxes, most do pay taxes. So if a guy who is in the highest bracket paying 40%, knocks that down to say 25% through deductions, if he reported $10 million, he paid $2.5 million. Assuming a 15% flat tax, he then pays what? $1.5 million. And - don't forget - he still has deductions. Maybe he knocks the rate down to 8%. Then he pays $800K. Yeah, flat taxes are not realistic.

2) I was going to address bheid408 but he didn't even read through the cut-and-paste article he threw up on this thread. If you read through all of it it contradicts everything he was trying to say. So I won't. At least DougOut's Rush posts are consistent with DougOut's views.

3) People who say 'Let them just get a job' ignores that there's few opportunities there for - ALL - poor people to advance. The solution long term isn't to cut hardship benefits. Its to increase education spending. And spending on research and development. And public construction. Those expenditures increase jobs. And if there are open jobs, people will take them.

4) The Taint is right. Where is starting wars making us safer or doing anything to help our way of life? My problem isn't so much what we did in the 2000s. Rather it was how we did it. When Reagan and Bush 1 employed troops, it generally had a direct purpose. A mission. I still don't know what the missions were for two wars we fought, but I do know it cost half a year's federal budget.

The mission for Afghanistan was to remove the government that supported and harbored the terrorist group responsible for 9/11 and to obliterate Al Qaeda, which had become the biggest threat to America's security.

The mission for Iraq was . . . umm . . . . uh . . . .

LOL.

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 7:20:00 AM (view original):
If Trump is paying nothing now, wouldn't he pay more with a flat tax? Let's just say "No" as BL stated. How about sales tax only? Trump buys a plane. He pay 20% tax(just picking a number). Is he paying more than ZERO now?

That falls into trickle down economics. Trump has more money as he saves it from taxes, therefore he spends more money. That's the theory. In practice, it doesn't turn out that way.

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 7:20:00 AM (view original):
If Trump is paying nothing now, wouldn't he pay more with a flat tax? Let's just say "No" as BL stated. How about sales tax only? Trump buys a plane. He pay 20% tax(just picking a number). Is he paying more than ZERO now?

What one person pays isn't the point. Most wealthy people pay a lot in taxes. Cutting their rate down to 20% (or whatever) and raising poor people's rate to 20% (or whatever) is a terrible idea.

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 8:33:00 AM (view original):
I'd like to add you can't educate those who don't want it. So, before dumping billions into education, make sure there's someone to educate.

Quite simply, everyone isn't college material. Some aren't high school material. ****, some aren't grade school material. They have no interest in sitting in a classroom while Mr. History drones on about 1776. What do you do with them? Because, quite frankly, they're going to be disruptive to the learning process. And, as you move along the education ladder, there are more of them. What do you do with them?

No easy to your answers here but I will say that if someone believes that school will not advanced them why would they go?

Does Trump not buy goods? Does he building magnificent buildings, the best buildings in the world, with happy thoughts?

Posted by bad_luck on 9/28/2016 9:03:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 7:20:00 AM (view original):
If Trump is paying nothing now, wouldn't he pay more with a flat tax? Let's just say "No" as BL stated. How about sales tax only? Trump buys a plane. He pay 20% tax(just picking a number). Is he paying more than ZERO now?

What one person pays isn't the point. Most wealthy people pay a lot in taxes. Cutting their rate down to 20% (or whatever) and raising poor people's rate to 20% (or whatever) is a terrible idea.

So Trump is the only rich person taking advantage of tax loopholes?

Posted by sjpoker on 9/28/2016 9:03:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 8:33:00 AM (view original):
I'd like to add you can't educate those who don't want it. So, before dumping billions into education, make sure there's someone to educate.

Quite simply, everyone isn't college material. Some aren't high school material. ****, some aren't grade school material. They have no interest in sitting in a classroom while Mr. History drones on about 1776. What do you do with them? Because, quite frankly, they're going to be disruptive to the learning process. And, as you move along the education ladder, there are more of them. What do you do with them?

No easy to your answers here but I will say that if someone believes that school will not advanced them why would they go?

So you went to schools where only people who wanted to learn were in class? How ******* white and rich are your parents?

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 9:05:00 AM (view original):

Posted by sjpoker on 9/28/2016 9:03:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 8:33:00 AM (view original):
I'd like to add you can't educate those who don't want it. So, before dumping billions into education, make sure there's someone to educate.

Quite simply, everyone isn't college material. Some aren't high school material. ****, some aren't grade school material. They have no interest in sitting in a classroom while Mr. History drones on about 1776. What do you do with them? Because, quite frankly, they're going to be disruptive to the learning process. And, as you move along the education ladder, there are more of them. What do you do with them?

No easy to your answers here but I will say that if someone believes that school will not advanced them why would they go?

So you went to schools where only people who wanted to learn were in class? How ******* white and rich are your parents?

Actually, this is a terrible question. I went to school with some very white and very rich kids(via parents) who had no interest in learning.

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 9:04:00 AM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 9/28/2016 9:03:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 7:20:00 AM (view original):
If Trump is paying nothing now, wouldn't he pay more with a flat tax? Let's just say "No" as BL stated. How about sales tax only? Trump buys a plane. He pay 20% tax(just picking a number). Is he paying more than ZERO now?

What one person pays isn't the point. Most wealthy people pay a lot in taxes. Cutting their rate down to 20% (or whatever) and raising poor people's rate to 20% (or whatever) is a terrible idea.

So Trump is the only rich person taking advantage of tax loopholes?

Because, if this is the case, he is smart. And probably should be President. He might be the smartest rich person on earth.

When most of us realize big tax savings, we spend it locally by perhaps buying a new car or getting our bathroom redone. Or we save it. All which helps employment and builds equity.

It doesn't make much sense for the super-rich to save money. And generally they are not buying consumer items like we are. They tend to spend that extra money in purchasing land or stocks. Generally none of those expenditures create jobs. They just increase the overall ownership of the super rich. Check out Gordon geckos Check out Gordon gekko's speech in Wall Street. He puts it out there.

So saving rich people money on their taxes generally does not have a positive impact on the economy. It just makes them more rich.

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 9:07:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 9:04:00 AM (view original):

Posted by bad_luck on 9/28/2016 9:03:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2016 7:20:00 AM (view original):
If Trump is paying nothing now, wouldn't he pay more with a flat tax? Let's just say "No" as BL stated. How about sales tax only? Trump buys a plane. He pay 20% tax(just picking a number). Is he paying more than ZERO now?

What one person pays isn't the point. Most wealthy people pay a lot in taxes. Cutting their rate down to 20% (or whatever) and raising poor people's rate to 20% (or whatever) is a terrible idea.

So Trump is the only rich person taking advantage of tax loopholes?

Because, if this is the case, he is smart. And probably should be President. He might be the smartest rich person on earth.

LOL he certainly thinks so.