" increasing the appeal to potential new users and giving them options is a good thing, too. wouldn't you agree? "

Of course. But throwing them to the BIG sharks isn't what they have in mind, unless one or two of them are complete masochists. However, I can readily understand how the big sharks like the idea of fresh shark bait.

Posted by CoachSpud on 9/29/2016 2:27:00 PM (view original):
" increasing the appeal to potential new users and giving them options is a good thing, too. wouldn't you agree? "

Of course. But throwing them to the BIG sharks isn't what they have in mind, unless one or two of them are complete masochists. However, I can readily understand how the big sharks like the idea of fresh shark bait.

It feels like you were raised to believe your view of the world is the only view of the world that any rational person could possibly have. I feel sorry for you.

No offense to anyone... but some people are assuming that D1 coaches are the cream of the HD crop and I'm not sure that's true. You can get to low D1 pretty easily I think. There are D1 coaches who have never won a SINGLE NT game at D2 or D3 in their careers. There are plenty of D2 and D3 coaches who are better than a lot of coaches at D1.

They're totally different games at the 3 levels (or at least it used to be) so I suppose it's hard to compare how 'good' the coaches are at each level. But to say that new coaches would get eaten alive at D1 way more than at D3 (in the 3.0 at least) doesn't make sense to me. But I could be wrong, maybe I'm missing something.

What about the guys who already play D1 but who have largely avoided joining other worlds because they don't want to have to start all over in D3 in every world? People starting up in a new world aren't completely limited to new users in the game.

Posted by kcsundevil on 9/29/2016 2:47:00 PM (view original):

Posted by CoachSpud on 9/29/2016 2:27:00 PM (view original):
" increasing the appeal to potential new users and giving them options is a good thing, too. wouldn't you agree? "

Of course. But throwing them to the BIG sharks isn't what they have in mind, unless one or two of them are complete masochists. However, I can readily understand how the big sharks like the idea of fresh shark bait.

It feels like you were raised to believe your view of the world is the only view of the world that any rational person could possibly have. I feel sorry for you.

LOL. Au contraire. Not more than 30 or 60 minutes ago in another thread I just got done advocating looking at both sides of a coin, all sides of a situation. You go ahead and read anything into it that you want, though, and feel any way you want about your interpretation, it's your right to hold your view.

Posted by Benis on 9/29/2016 2:54:00 PM (view original):
No offense to anyone... but some people are assuming that D1 coaches are the cream of the HD crop and I'm not sure that's true. You can get to low D1 pretty easily I think. There are D1 coaches who have never won a SINGLE NT game at D2 or D3 in their careers. There are plenty of D2 and D3 coaches who are better than a lot of coaches at D1.

They're totally different games at the 3 levels (or at least it used to be) so I suppose it's hard to compare how 'good' the coaches are at each level. But to say that new coaches would get eaten alive at D1 way more than at D3 (in the 3.0 at least) doesn't make sense to me. But I could be wrong, maybe I'm missing something.

Such blasphemy! Don't you know that D1 coaches are the crème de la crème?

Posted by CoachSpud on 9/29/2016 3:14:00 PM (view original):

Posted by kcsundevil on 9/29/2016 2:47:00 PM (view original):

Posted by CoachSpud on 9/29/2016 2:27:00 PM (view original):
" increasing the appeal to potential new users and giving them options is a good thing, too. wouldn't you agree? "

Of course. But throwing them to the BIG sharks isn't what they have in mind, unless one or two of them are complete masochists. However, I can readily understand how the big sharks like the idea of fresh shark bait.

It feels like you were raised to believe your view of the world is the only view of the world that any rational person could possibly have. I feel sorry for you.

LOL. Au contraire. Not more than 30 or 60 minutes ago in another thread I just got done advocating looking at both sides of a coin, all sides of a situation. You go ahead and read anything into it that you want, though, and feel any way you want about your interpretation, it's your right to hold your view.

Hahahaha this doesn't help your case Spud. Trying to convince people to see the side of the coin you believe in doesn't make you willing to understand other peoples views. Wow.

Good logic. Being open minded doesn't help being open minded. Got it.

BTW, at least one other game that I know of has tried letting new coaches in at all levels, with disastrous results.

Posted by Benis on 9/29/2016 2:54:00 PM (view original):
No offense to anyone... but some people are assuming that D1 coaches are the cream of the HD crop and I'm not sure that's true. You can get to low D1 pretty easily I think. There are D1 coaches who have never won a SINGLE NT game at D2 or D3 in their careers. There are plenty of D2 and D3 coaches who are better than a lot of coaches at D1.

They're totally different games at the 3 levels (or at least it used to be) so I suppose it's hard to compare how 'good' the coaches are at each level. But to say that new coaches would get eaten alive at D1 way more than at D3 (in the 3.0 at least) doesn't make sense to me. But I could be wrong, maybe I'm missing something.

I agree that there are excellent coaches (and decent coaches) at all three levels. I think the difference is there are no truly horrendous coaches at D1 (and relatively few at D2). The worst of the worst start at D3, are terrible, don't learn from their mistakes, and never move upward. They also tend to not stick around for long.

To me, part of the reason to start everyone at D3 is what Spud pointed out. But the bigger issue is that starting at D3 gives you a gradual target to shoot for. I think most of us who've stuck around a long time (and therefore become profitable customers for WIS) like that challenge and appreciate that it's going to take a while to figure the puzzle out. People who would only be interested in HD if they can identify with the very first team they coach are likely to be too impatient to stick around anyway. The D1 "prize" is kinda lost on them.

Well, you've played 27 D1 games, tell us how D1 works? Or you know D3 from the 27 games you played there right? Oh no, it's the 150 games you played in D2, you're a D2 expert, right?

You should have no opinion on what D1 or D3 is, you've never played more than one season. In fact, you shouldn't have 403 posts about anything, you don't know much about anything about this game, other than your opinions, which matter exactly zero more than anyone else's.

Unless you had an ID before and won't own to it.

ETA: edited to add this is directed to Spud obviously.

Posted by CoachSpud on 9/29/2016 3:21:00 PM (view original):
Good logic. Being open minded doesn't help being open minded. Got it.

BTW, at least one other game that I know of has tried letting new coaches in at all levels, with disastrous results.

Are you sure you understand what open minded means? If someone says something you don't agree with and you tell them to look at it from another view point (yours) then that's not being open minded.

Anytime someone says something you don't agree with, you provide a smart *** and condescending remark and make insinuations into what that person really means. Do you ever try to understand why they said what they said or ask questions to understand where they're coming from?

Posted by bhansalid00 on 9/29/2016 3:24:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 9/29/2016 2:54:00 PM (view original):
No offense to anyone... but some people are assuming that D1 coaches are the cream of the HD crop and I'm not sure that's true. You can get to low D1 pretty easily I think. There are D1 coaches who have never won a SINGLE NT game at D2 or D3 in their careers. There are plenty of D2 and D3 coaches who are better than a lot of coaches at D1.

They're totally different games at the 3 levels (or at least it used to be) so I suppose it's hard to compare how 'good' the coaches are at each level. But to say that new coaches would get eaten alive at D1 way more than at D3 (in the 3.0 at least) doesn't make sense to me. But I could be wrong, maybe I'm missing something.

I agree that there are excellent coaches (and decent coaches) at all three levels. I think the difference is there are no truly horrendous coaches at D1 (and relatively few at D2). The worst of the worst start at D3, are terrible, don't learn from their mistakes, and never move upward. They also tend to not stick around for long.

To me, part of the reason to start everyone at D3 is what Spud pointed out. But the bigger issue is that starting at D3 gives you a gradual target to shoot for. I think most of us who've stuck around a long time (and therefore become profitable customers for WIS) like that challenge and appreciate that it's going to take a while to figure the puzzle out. People who would only be interested in HD if they can identify with the very first team they coach are likely to be too impatient to stick around anyway. The D1 "prize" is kinda lost on them.

This business model has proven to be a failure. HD is dying.

" I just got done advocating looking at both sides of a coin, all sides of a situation. "
" ... tell them to look at it from another view point (yours) then that's not being open minded."
Reading comprehension is your friend. Did bolding help?

Posted by CoachSpud on 9/29/2016 4:30:00 PM (view original):
" I just got done advocating looking at both sides of a coin, all sides of a situation. "
" ... tell them to look at it from another view point (yours) then that's not being open minded."
Reading comprehension is your friend. Did bolding help?

Here's what you said-

"To be fair and see both sides of the coin, we'd need to see what prompted it, too." Translation - WIS is justified in their response to AB because he said something first.

This not you advocating for anything. This is you believing that AB said something nasty to WIS first and that is why he received an unkind response. You already have this predisposition that coaches on here are whiners, crybabies, haters, etc and you defend WIS every chance you get. So OF COURSE you're going to say something like this. But it's not really encouraging others to have an open mind about anything. It's to prove your point about what you think the coaches around should or shouldn't say.

You're not fooling anyone Spud. Get off your high horse.

Posted by kcsundevil on 9/29/2016 3:36:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bhansalid00 on 9/29/2016 3:24:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 9/29/2016 2:54:00 PM (view original):
No offense to anyone... but some people are assuming that D1 coaches are the cream of the HD crop and I'm not sure that's true. You can get to low D1 pretty easily I think. There are D1 coaches who have never won a SINGLE NT game at D2 or D3 in their careers. There are plenty of D2 and D3 coaches who are better than a lot of coaches at D1.

They're totally different games at the 3 levels (or at least it used to be) so I suppose it's hard to compare how 'good' the coaches are at each level. But to say that new coaches would get eaten alive at D1 way more than at D3 (in the 3.0 at least) doesn't make sense to me. But I could be wrong, maybe I'm missing something.

I agree that there are excellent coaches (and decent coaches) at all three levels. I think the difference is there are no truly horrendous coaches at D1 (and relatively few at D2). The worst of the worst start at D3, are terrible, don't learn from their mistakes, and never move upward. They also tend to not stick around for long.

To me, part of the reason to start everyone at D3 is what Spud pointed out. But the bigger issue is that starting at D3 gives you a gradual target to shoot for. I think most of us who've stuck around a long time (and therefore become profitable customers for WIS) like that challenge and appreciate that it's going to take a while to figure the puzzle out. People who would only be interested in HD if they can identify with the very first team they coach are likely to be too impatient to stick around anyway. The D1 "prize" is kinda lost on them.

This business model has proven to be a failure. HD is dying.

Yeah. I mean, I get the idea of the D1 carrot, but as was mentioned earlier in the thread, it's a brave new world in 3.0, and maybe some thinking outside of the 2.0 box might be helpful. I could see opening up any jobs at or below D- at D1 as an idea worth considering.

That said, if we're considering it, we should consider the downside, which is that it could cause D3 to become a ghost town. New users are more likely to choose D1 than D2 or D3 unless they have a good reason to choose D2 or D3. Now there are good reasons to choose D2 or D3--they're different games than D1. But a total newb isn't going to know that.

This is total spitballing here, but I wonder if the HD folks could program a quick quiz for new players. I might look something like this:

1. Do you want a wide-open game where anybody can win, or one where the traditional powers are firmly entrenched and difficult to knock off?
a. wide open
b. firm hierarchy
c. don't care
Priority level for #1: low, medium, high

2. Do you want to take over a winner or build your own team from the dregs to the top?
a. take over a winner
b. rebuild a team myself
c. something in the middle
d. don't care
Priority level for #2: low, medium, or high

3. How competitive do you want your conference to be?
a. Ultra-competitive--bring it on!
b. Let me ease into it with an easier league
c. something in the middle
d. don't care
Priority level for #3: low, medium, or high

4. What area of the country would you like to coach in?
a. Northeast
b. Southeast
c. Midwest (Big-10 country)
d. Heartland (Big XII country)
e. West Coast
f. Don't care
Priority level for #4: low, medium, or high.


Based on the person's answers to the questions, WIS can suggest five teams that might make good matches, and the new player can decide to either pick one of the suggestions or decline the suggestions and create their own.

For instance, if they were joining Allen and wanted a wide open with an ultra-competitive conference in the Heartland, it might suggest Shenandoah (most competitive D3 conference), Grand Canyon (most competitive D2 conference), Michigan Tech (2nd most competitive D2, closer to Heartland than Grand Canyon), Rockhurst (decently competitive D2 Heartland), and Oklahoma Panhandle St (see: Rockhurst).

If they were joining Allen and wanted a successful team in a hierarchical world and a competitive conference in the Southeast, it could suggest Wichita St (D- prestige, competitive D1 conference), Radford (D- prestige, southeast D1 team), Barton (B- prestige, decently competitive D2 conference in the Southeast), New Haven (highest prestige D2 sim team), and Virginia Wesleyan (most successful D3 sim in the Southeast)