And show me where people are complaining about losing a player to EE?

You CLEARLY are not understanding what people are saying when they say "fix EEs". But that's okay. Keep doing your thing bud.

I'm well aware of why they're complaining. They don't know til the 2nd session.

Users who lose out in recruiting in the manner you suggest may not get a 2nd session to replace a recruit.

You CLEARLY have no idea why that's a bad thing, pal.

CLEARLY, friend.

I'm not your guy, buddy! I'm not your buddy, guy!

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2016 3:07:00 PM (view original):
Conversely, the player you sign might declare early. The player isn't guaranteed to stay for 4 seasons. EE 101.

Thems the breaks.

in 2.0, one had a reasonable shot at replacing the EE with at least an okay DI player

3.0 makes it darn hard to replace EEs - especially unexpected or hard to predict EEs with a player who is even playable in DI

the lack of any transition adjustment should trouble folks whose core answer on the EE topic is - thems the breaks, plan for it - recruited under one expectation - 3.0 created a radically different environment - and WIS decided to take zero mitigating action.

I certainly don't want to rehash my thoughts on EEs. Basically, it will take care of itself in a few seasons. No one should be recruiting now and thinking "WifS is gonna go something."

My "gripe" and the reason I compared it to EE is the belief by some that UNC should be able to show up on the next to last cycle and take a recruit from a low level D1 like Elon who has been dumping resources into said recruit on every cycle. Now maybe that happens in real life, except UNC would have had some contact with the player beforehand, but it's a terrible model for this game. Elon is not a college in NC. It's a paying customer who just had a recruit taken from him on the last cycle and has to take a walk-on. Benis' response was "Thems the breaks."

I think there is some similarity between the two. In fact, I think the situations are more alike than unalike. Hence my "Thems the breaks".

Posted by metsmax on 12/5/2016 4:20:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2016 3:07:00 PM (view original):
Conversely, the player you sign might declare early. The player isn't guaranteed to stay for 4 seasons. EE 101.

Thems the breaks.

in 2.0, one had a reasonable shot at replacing the EE with at least an okay DI player

3.0 makes it darn hard to replace EEs - especially unexpected or hard to predict EEs with a player who is even playable in DI

the lack of any transition adjustment should trouble folks whose core answer on the EE topic is - thems the breaks, plan for it - recruited under one expectation - 3.0 created a radically different environment - and WIS decided to take zero mitigating action.

There are always surprises when it comes to college players declaring for the draft, recruits in real life don't always wait to see if a spot on a team opens up by a player declaring for a draft. If you are recruiting talented enough players that they might be NBA ready in 2-3 seasons, then that is a risk you have to take. There are teams in real life like Kentucky that are filled with one and dones then there are teams like Gonzaga and Iowa who develop 4 year players. Just a thought...it seems like 3.0 was used to bring HD to a more realistic simulation.

Mike,

i dont think anyone believes poaching is socially redeemable. Most of us in the "fix it" camp are not saying we want to revert to 2.0. All we want is that EEs not occur so late in the game that resources were previously allocated and the cakes are baked. This could be (I) eliminating EEs, (I) shifting timelines (either announcement or recruiting) so that the EE decision occurs before assets (such as AP are allocated) or it could be (iii) allocating resources based on projected departures, understanding there won't be a match. What I (and I believe others) find unacceptable is using EE "penalties" to punish successful coaches to flatten out game results.

But continue believing your failures are because of rules rather than your general incompetence.

Lakevin, please, I beg of you, know what you're talking about BEFORE throwing insults. Insulting without knowledge makes you look small and stupid.

I haven't played in 10 years. This is my first season back. I haven't had any issues with recruiting. My failures don't exist yet. I was simply pointing out to those who think the big schools should have all the recruiting advantages are mistaken. It's not a school that gets screwed, it's a user. It's bad business to allow a user to dump all his resources into a player then have him taken by a team that hadn't even contacted the player before the next to last cycle.

Now, if you would, why do you think YOU DESERVE a different response than what you've gotten, or perceive to have gotten, from WifS?

Posted by timjmiller on 12/5/2016 4:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by metsmax on 12/5/2016 4:20:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 12/5/2016 3:07:00 PM (view original):
Conversely, the player you sign might declare early. The player isn't guaranteed to stay for 4 seasons. EE 101.

Thems the breaks.

in 2.0, one had a reasonable shot at replacing the EE with at least an okay DI player

3.0 makes it darn hard to replace EEs - especially unexpected or hard to predict EEs with a player who is even playable in DI

the lack of any transition adjustment should trouble folks whose core answer on the EE topic is - thems the breaks, plan for it - recruited under one expectation - 3.0 created a radically different environment - and WIS decided to take zero mitigating action.

There are always surprises when it comes to college players declaring for the draft, recruits in real life don't always wait to see if a spot on a team opens up by a player declaring for a draft. If you are recruiting talented enough players that they might be NBA ready in 2-3 seasons, then that is a risk you have to take. There are teams in real life like Kentucky that are filled with one and dones then there are teams like Gonzaga and Iowa who develop 4 year players. Just a thought...it seems like 3.0 was used to bring HD to a more realistic simulation.

in real life, when more of your team EE's than expected or when both guards leave early, you usually can land guys capable of playing DI ball

very hard here

especially hard in the TRANSITION which is my point of emphasis - in the long term, it will be an issue but less of an issue - in the short term, WIS decided it was okay shaft some customers. Those customers dont like it.

Am I missing something about EEs? Isn't the simplest solution be to tell coaches at the beginning of Session 1 that players are leaving early, and giving them resources as if the player is graduating? I'm sure people have mentioned that a million different times, but I don't know what the argument against it is. Logically, the current system is punishing you for having good players, as if losing one of your best players before their senior year isn't punishment enough.

Unless people are just arguing because, like me, they're procrastinating at work. If that's the case, please proceed.

I don't think anyone is really arguing about EEs. I was just poking at Benis for saying "Thems the breaks" when users are dealt a tough hand in other aspects of the game.

Posted by mbriese on 12/5/2016 5:02:00 PM (view original):
Am I missing something about EEs? Isn't the simplest solution be to tell coaches at the beginning of Session 1 that players are leaving early, and giving them resources as if the player is graduating? I'm sure people have mentioned that a million different times, but I don't know what the argument against it is. Logically, the current system is punishing you for having good players, as if losing one of your best players before their senior year isn't punishment enough.

Unless people are just arguing because, like me, they're procrastinating at work. If that's the case, please proceed.

Exactly. This is the best solution in my opinion. It really doesn't harm anyone. EEs still carry the risk of losing a player early. That's all the penalty there should be.

And yes, Mike is arguing for the sake of arguing.

Oh, thanks for catching the South Park reference!

Posted by mbriese on 12/5/2016 5:02:00 PM (view original):
Am I missing something about EEs? Isn't the simplest solution be to tell coaches at the beginning of Session 1 that players are leaving early, and giving them resources as if the player is graduating? I'm sure people have mentioned that a million different times, but I don't know what the argument against it is. Logically, the current system is punishing you for having good players, as if losing one of your best players before their senior year isn't punishment enough.

Unless people are just arguing because, like me, they're procrastinating at work. If that's the case, please proceed.

pay no attention to any possible solutions - seble wasnt interested - and little sign of interest now at WIS

Posted by mamxet on 12/5/2016 5:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mbriese on 12/5/2016 5:02:00 PM (view original):
Am I missing something about EEs? Isn't the simplest solution be to tell coaches at the beginning of Session 1 that players are leaving early, and giving them resources as if the player is graduating? I'm sure people have mentioned that a million different times, but I don't know what the argument against it is. Logically, the current system is punishing you for having good players, as if losing one of your best players before their senior year isn't punishment enough.

Unless people are just arguing because, like me, they're procrastinating at work. If that's the case, please proceed.

pay no attention to any possible solutions - seble wasnt interested - and little sign of interest now at WIS

They've already announced a little bit of what they're going to do. EEs are going to announce earlier. We don't know when that update will happen, nor do we know if it means coaches will get resources when announced. But coaches will know who is leaving.

The argument against giving out the full resources at the start of recruiting is that it makes it easier for elite teams to replenish elite players, effectively lowering the cost and volatility of EEs in 3.0. Possumfiend has written a number of good posts explaining why this may not be good for the game overall, and I generally agree with him.