Posted by tecwrg on 3/13/2017 10:45:00 AM (view original):
Exactly.

I'm guessing that John Calipari is not throwing verbal tantrums on UK message boards when he loses a couple of one-and-done freshman after a good season. He knew what he was likely getting when he recruited them.

Yes, because at UK replacing them is easy. He just gets more of the same guys, no problem. WIS has a different system and it punishes squads like that.

The fair questions in my view are when should teams find out about EEs (admin said in November working on a change in announcement timing), is it too hard to replace some EEs with playable players (for good game play) and should there be lower limits on how many EEs go to NBA from one team in a season.

i dont think there is an abstract "right" answer to any of these - question should be what is good for the game.

Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 9:14:00 AM (view original):

Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 7:48:00 AM (view original):
Isenhour (on the fence), Williams(on the fence), Gridley (likely staying). I had 40 ap, first session and I replaced the player who was leaving (1 scholly). With about one day left, once I had signed my new player, I started building efforts with 20 ap on a late player (could not get to give a scholly). I decided Williams (guard) was the most likely to leave since he was on the board as a soph also.

This is dumb.

How am I suppose to accept my team goes from a potential NT contender to a pretender? What's the strat if your faith is a random thing?

I could accept this random if I had a chance to prepare for it. I don't. I won't be able to build any traction to more than one player...

Fix this. And face the facts, it's killing the game and the fun of the game.

If my math is right, you still have 8 returning players on your potential NT contender.

When you recruited those 3 did you think they had the potential to declare early?

It's not the point and it will derail the discussion.

Posted by tecwrg on 3/13/2017 10:30:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 3/13/2017 10:08:00 AM (view original):
If you look at the Big Board in Smith, you'll see that 5 of the 100 are sim school players. The other 95 are split between 41 users. If you remove the guys with only 1, you're looking at around 80 for 25 users. The users get virtually all of the top players so the users get hit with multiple EE.

Interesting numbers.

So all the best players are going to a relatively small handful of schools. And the best of the best become EE's and leave. And the relatively small group of coaches that are affected are crying abut it.

Seems like this is a self-inflicted problem, when you step back and look at the big picture.

False. I never had but once had a ee leave early until this disaster. You guys want a fair game where skills is involved or you want to punish those who are good at it! I don't mind losing ees since it's the way it's built, what I am saying is let me be able to replace them.

Posted by possumfiend on 3/13/2017 10:47:00 AM (view original):
This still comes down to a simple cost benefit analysis issue. There are costs and benefits of taking the stud 4 or 5 star recruit that is certain to leave early. And there are costs and benefits of taking the more modest, or possibly crappy, player that we all know will stay for four LONG seasons.

The argument for "fixing" the EE issue still comes down to saying the benefit for taking the EE caliber player isn't decisive enough and should be *more* clear and provide still *greater* benefit than it currently does.

Essentially you're going out and willingly paying market price for a luxury product and then sending the retailer and manufacturer letters saying "I really like your product but the price is too high ... fix it" as you walk up to the counter and buy two more at the market price.

At the end of the day if you're willing to pay the market price for a product because it's still the *better* value and alternative (in your own mind) then the price probably isn't too high.

This has nothing to do with this.

You won't win without multiple possible ees. So the outcome of them leaving makes it random as to which team can compete and which teams will suffer the bad luck. The only way you can go battling without ees is going to a heavy 6-6 or 6-0-6, class structure.

Posted by cburton23 on 3/13/2017 10:48:00 AM (view original):
This is why I left DI. The argument is to recruit worse players? That is what you should do when you get EEs, is make your team worse? If you don't see why this is stupid, I don't even know what to say, other than I'm becoming convinced Mike is in some way compensated by WIS for positive comments.

+1

Posted by mamxet on 3/13/2017 10:55:00 AM (view original):
The fair questions in my view are when should teams find out about EEs (admin said in November working on a change in announcement timing), is it too hard to replace some EEs with playable players (for good game play) and should there be lower limits on how many EEs go to NBA from one team in a season.

i dont think there is an abstract "right" answer to any of these - question should be what is good for the game.

I will try my hardest. And tell you how it went.

Posted by tecwrg on 3/13/2017 10:59:00 AM (view original):
One of the challenges of this game (and really, any game), is to understand the framework under which the game is designed to work, as well as understand the intended (and sometimes unintended) consequences that go along with it, and then do your best to succeed within that system.

Ignoring the consequences of how EE's are playing out within the current framework of HD 3.0 seems like a foolish way to go. Recruiting should be done with your eyes wide open if you're going after the best of the best recruits.

Again random will decide who wins not skills.

Posted by cburton23 on 3/13/2017 10:48:00 AM (view original):
This is why I left DI. The argument is to recruit worse players? That is what you should do when you get EEs, is make your team worse? If you don't see why this is stupid, I don't even know what to say, other than I'm becoming convinced Mike is in some way compensated by WIS for positive comments.

No, the argument is to expect great players to leave early. And, if that's a problem for you, you don't want those guys. Or too many of them.

You can recruit top 5 players at every position for all I care. I, and many others, just aren't going to be very sympathetic with your plight when they play 2 seasons and leave.

Why do so many people who don't play D1 care so much about rules pertaining to only D1?

Posted by zorzii on 3/13/2017 11:06:00 AM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 3/13/2017 10:59:00 AM (view original):
One of the challenges of this game (and really, any game), is to understand the framework under which the game is designed to work, as well as understand the intended (and sometimes unintended) consequences that go along with it, and then do your best to succeed within that system.

Ignoring the consequences of how EE's are playing out within the current framework of HD 3.0 seems like a foolish way to go. Recruiting should be done with your eyes wide open if you're going after the best of the best recruits.

Again random will decide who wins not skills.

How so?

Yes, zorzi, it is relevant. If you recruit guys, you should know they might declare early. It's a choice you're making. Now, if you want to say "I had no idea any of those three would declare early", I'm not going to believe you.

As someone mentioned earlier, you're buying a luxury product then complaining about the price. Yet head off to the store to buy another.

EE is not some great mystery. Everyone should know which players are likely to declare early. And they should know the consequences. This is no surprise today.

see, this is why i was getting feisty in the other thread. it's easy to say, if you recruit top 20 guys, then there is a chance they're gonna go EE. but that's not helpful information. the problem is predicting WHEN they'll go, ie, when you need to plan to replace them during recruiting. one year? two? three? that's the puzzle. that's what makes some of these EEs impossible to work with under HD3's current system.

Posted by Benis on 3/13/2017 11:21:00 AM (view original):
Why do so many people who don't play D1 care so much about rules pertaining to only D1?

I'll be there soon enough.

And, if I ever say "I had multiple EE. FIX THIS ****!!!", I'd like someone to hunt me down and beat me. The consequences of signing great players is not an unknown.