Hey all! Long-time lurker, first-time (I think?) poster.

TL;DR - I'm hitting a recruiting wall at DIII; should I be recruiting DII guys?

I'm coaching Manhattanville (DIII) in the Wooden world. I've coached a handful of seasons and brought the team up to respectability. Despite having built an algorithm to help predict skill rating maximums and doing what I think to be a good job recruiting (high-potential, high-work ethic guys), my team is fundamentally lower skilled than many other human-led teams. Mount Saint Mary, for example, is the only other human-led team in my league and his lowest-rated freshman has a higher total rating than my highest freshman, and with a high work ethic to boot.

I suspect that I'm missing the mark in my recruiting strategy, so I thought I'd lay out my general plan and get some feedback. I scout (only DIII) players within a reasonable distance (<360 and <180 miles) of my school. From there, I order by skills (generally work ethic, but I've experimented with others). I pick a number I'm interested in, scout to level 2. I narrow, scout to level three and so on. I then prioritize and begin recruiting. I don't really have much of a problem signing my targets, and I offer my targets scholarships as early as possible. Seeing as my guys are so much less talented than other human players, I suspect something is off in the earlier stages of my recruiting.

Should I be targeting DII guys? Should I be waiting until later (second recruiting period?) to sign guys? What am I missing?

Also, apologies if this has been asked before. I searched around and couldn't find anything useful. If you have a link, I'm happy to read a breakdown somewhere else.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Yeah, you should be scouting and recruiting D2 and D1 guys.

Ordering by WE isn't the best strategy IMO, but I have seen worse. I would suggest think about core stats for each role. For example:

Need a PG- rank by speed, BH and pass
Need a shooter- PER, SPD, BH
Need a rebounder- ATH and REB

That's how I prioritize.

Successful D3 coaches are generally recruiting low level D1 players. Players 100+, or maybe 150+, ranked at their position. It's sort of a find and hide game. I've recruited some D2 as well.

Posted by Trentonjoe on 8/1/2017 10:50:00 AM (view original):
Yeah, you should be scouting and recruiting D2 and D1 guys.

Ordering by WE isn't the best strategy IMO, but I have seen worse. I would suggest think about core stats for each role. For example:

Need a PG- rank by speed, BH and pass
Need a shooter- PER, SPD, BH
Need a rebounder- ATH and REB

That's how I prioritize.

Right, right. When using the recruiting tool, though, you have to choose one to order by. So I've either used a core skill (ATH for PG, for example, or PER for SG) and then used WE as a complement or I've ordered on WE and looked for the best core skill set. Like, I feel like I'm finding/getting the best guys I see and yet I'm still way, way below other human players.

It should be noted, I suppose, that all I do is the scouting service and only scout the states around me. I usually have a lot of scouting money left over. Maybe I'm not scouting enough?

Posted by MikeT23 on 8/1/2017 10:51:00 AM (view original):
Successful D3 coaches are generally recruiting low level D1 players. Players 100+, or maybe 150+, ranked at their position. It's sort of a find and hide game. I've recruited some D2 as well.

How does that work? Do you lurk until the second recruiting sesh and then pounce on the players that no coaches have picked up on?

I seldom commit anything more than AP during the first session. D1 won't sign until last day of RS2 so dumping HV/CV on them before then is a fool's game, IMO. Unless, of course, you're trying to scare off another D3. D2 will sign on first cycle of RS2.

I pretty much recruit D2 only at D3 and my teams are pretty decent. I'd start by going for D2. Much easier to get than D1.

youre missing the camp. ALWAYS do a home camp. Best bang for your buck.

sitemail me if you want and I'll help you out.

Posted by MikeT23 on 8/1/2017 10:56:00 AM (view original):
I seldom commit anything more than AP during the first session. D1 won't sign until last day of RS2 so dumping HV/CV on them before then is a fool's game, IMO. Unless, of course, you're trying to scare off another D3. D2 will sign on first cycle of RS2.

That's good info. Do you hold off on recruiting/offering DIII players until the second session too? Or do you ignore DIII altogether?

Posted by Benis on 8/1/2017 10:57:00 AM (view original):
I pretty much recruit D2 only at D3 and my teams are pretty decent.

youre missing the camp. ALWAYS do a home camp. Best bang for your buck.

sitemail me if you want and I'll help you out.

Thanks, will do!

Posted by kaw_86 on 8/1/2017 10:58:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 8/1/2017 10:56:00 AM (view original):
I seldom commit anything more than AP during the first session. D1 won't sign until last day of RS2 so dumping HV/CV on them before then is a fool's game, IMO. Unless, of course, you're trying to scare off another D3. D2 will sign on first cycle of RS2.

That's good info. Do you hold off on recruiting/offering DIII players until the second session too? Or do you ignore DIII altogether?

I've not been forced to recruit D3 players since my first season. There's a gamble in recruiting up. You might get shut out. I usually use D2 as my back-up plan but I run zone so taking a walk-on isn't death to me.

Posted by gomiami1972 on 8/1/2017 11:02:00 AM (view original):

Posted by kaw_86 on 8/1/2017 10:58:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 8/1/2017 10:56:00 AM (view original):
I seldom commit anything more than AP during the first session. D1 won't sign until last day of RS2 so dumping HV/CV on them before then is a fool's game, IMO. Unless, of course, you're trying to scare off another D3. D2 will sign on first cycle of RS2.

That's good info. Do you hold off on recruiting/offering DIII players until the second session too? Or do you ignore DIII altogether?

There are so many DI and DII players available due to low human populations that recruiting DIII players is probably not necessary.

Well, that's a big change. That explains why I'm getting what I think to be some of the better DIII guys and not competing. Lol.

At Ferrum, I don't even scout D3 any more. D2 and D1 only. Use the loop hole they have given us.

Piece of huge advice:
In all levels, Athleticism and Defense are critical. In D-3, each should be at a minimum of 50. Defense in the teens will make your team struggle.

I'd recommend saving a pocket ($5,000+) of money for the second recruiting cycle to use on scouting undecided D1 players in CA, TX, and FL (with a small budget you might just want to start with one of them). Every season there are players nobody goes after in both states that can be huge difference makers on a DIII team, and you can usually sign them without having to battle.

Posted by npb7768 on 8/1/2017 11:28:00 AM (view original):
Piece of huge advice:
In all levels, Athleticism and Defense are critical. In D-3, each should be at a minimum of 50. Defense in the teens will make your team struggle.

Gotcha. Do you mean minimum of 50 by the end of their careers, or minimum of 50 as a recruit?