Haven't you been around these forums? "Individual awards" in baseball are team awards.

Twitter even forgot to mention that Votto played in every game (Goldy played 155) and beat Goldschmidt by 28 points of OPS+, 140 to 168.

But what about WAR and productive outs?!?!?!?!

Posted by dahsdebater on 11/10/2017 11:35:00 AM (view original):
Haven't you been around these forums? "Individual awards" in baseball are team awards.

Troll alert.

You're well aware that the debate you speak of is over ONE award, and the use of the word "value". Everyone knows Silver Sluggers are to be based purely on offensive stats.

Which makes Goldschmidt's win very puzzling.

The Twitter post already pointed out that Goldschmidt struck out more. Like 80% more IIRC.

Take that.

Posted by Jtpsops on 11/10/2017 11:48:00 AM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 11/10/2017 11:35:00 AM (view original):
Haven't you been around these forums? "Individual awards" in baseball are team awards.

Troll alert.

You're well aware that the debate you speak of is over ONE award, and the use of the word "value". Everyone knows Silver Sluggers are to be based purely on offensive stats.

Which makes Goldschmidt's win very puzzling.

It's not about one award.

If you look at RBI and runs very much for SS, they become team awards. Goldschmidt played on a better offensive team in a better hitters' park, so he had more RBI and runs even though he was a distinctly inferior hitter. That makes it, on some level, at least partially a team award.

Same thing happens when you look at wins and losses for Cy Young voting.

They should really establish a SABR set of awards, if only to point out how lame ALL awards are. This way, the stat-heads can have their awards shows, the sportswriters can have their own, the players/coaches can have their own show, and each individual network can have their own show.

Then NONE of them would matter... but everyone would have one set that matches their personal bias.

Problem solved.

They should just give awards to whoever BL and dahs deem most worthy for each one.

They're obviously the smartest people in whatever room they're in.

Would the room implode if they were in it and disagreed?

Posted by MikeT23 on 11/10/2017 5:14:00 PM (view original):
Would the room implode if they were in it and disagreed?

It would be worth a try...

Posted by dahsdebater on 11/10/2017 11:50:00 AM (view original):

Posted by Jtpsops on 11/10/2017 11:48:00 AM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 11/10/2017 11:35:00 AM (view original):
Haven't you been around these forums? "Individual awards" in baseball are team awards.

Troll alert.

You're well aware that the debate you speak of is over ONE award, and the use of the word "value". Everyone knows Silver Sluggers are to be based purely on offensive stats.

Which makes Goldschmidt's win very puzzling.

It's not about one award.

If you look at RBI and runs very much for SS, they become team awards. Goldschmidt played on a better offensive team in a better hitters' park, so he had more RBI and runs even though he was a distinctly inferior hitter. That makes it, on some level, at least partially a team award.

Same thing happens when you look at wins and losses for Cy Young voting.

I kinda think this particular example is pretty heinous tbh.

It's pretty standard. I don't think it's substantially worse than Porcello - a 20-win pitcher from a good team - beating Verlander and Kluber in the Cy Young balloting last season.