Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 6:31:00 PM (view original):
Why, in your mind, did no D1 or D2 humans go after him? I'm looking at what his initial ratings and (minimum) potentials were and I can't see any reason whatsoever why a D2 school wouldn't have wanted him. He could have had as little as 56 ATH, which is obviously low for that level, but given his combination of offensive, defensive, and rebounding potentials he was obviously going to be able to compensate for that. I've had numerous less desirable recruits get scooped out from under me by ACC schools. And frankly, as a 6th man, he would be a useful contributor even in high D1.

Which brings up what I don't like about the current recruiting system. Somebody earlier congratulated his coach on "good recruiting." To me, you can give some props for aiming high, but overwhelmingly the ability to recruit a player of that caliber in D3 comes down to luck. The guy was a top 50 player at his position, from the continental United States. For him to slip through the cracks with so much high-high potential is a rare event that just happened to break this coach's way this time. But most times you'll just surrender all the resources you've spent on a player like this when D1 comes knocking. That said, I'd fight a D2 to the very end for a player like that unless I had extremely ugly preference match.

I’m certainly not making the argument that he’s not good enough to play D1. I’ve got a very similar player as a senior at Oregon. Simply pointing out the fact, the reason he’s playing on a D3 team is because in this case, no higher level team tried very hard to get him. Is that luck? Not really. It’s the sum of a number of gameplay choices. The D3 certainly took on some risk. I took Liberatore from a D2 in similar fashion. This recruiting system is about knowing probabilities, taking calculated risks, and preparing contingencies, if desired.

The same player can be a D3 star, a solid 3-year starter at D2, and a bench contributor after a few years at higher D1 teams.

Posted by shoe3 on 3/23/2018 8:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 6:31:00 PM (view original):
Why, in your mind, did no D1 or D2 humans go after him? I'm looking at what his initial ratings and (minimum) potentials were and I can't see any reason whatsoever why a D2 school wouldn't have wanted him. He could have had as little as 56 ATH, which is obviously low for that level, but given his combination of offensive, defensive, and rebounding potentials he was obviously going to be able to compensate for that. I've had numerous less desirable recruits get scooped out from under me by ACC schools. And frankly, as a 6th man, he would be a useful contributor even in high D1.

Which brings up what I don't like about the current recruiting system. Somebody earlier congratulated his coach on "good recruiting." To me, you can give some props for aiming high, but overwhelmingly the ability to recruit a player of that caliber in D3 comes down to luck. The guy was a top 50 player at his position, from the continental United States. For him to slip through the cracks with so much high-high potential is a rare event that just happened to break this coach's way this time. But most times you'll just surrender all the resources you've spent on a player like this when D1 comes knocking. That said, I'd fight a D2 to the very end for a player like that unless I had extremely ugly preference match.

I’m certainly not making the argument that he’s not good enough to play D1. I’ve got a very similar player as a senior at Oregon. Simply pointing out the fact, the reason he’s playing on a D3 team is because in this case, no higher level team tried very hard to get him. Is that luck? Not really. It’s the sum of a number of gameplay choices. The D3 certainly took on some risk. I took Liberatore from a D2 in similar fashion. This recruiting system is about knowing probabilities, taking calculated risks, and preparing contingencies, if desired.

The same player can be a D3 star, a solid 3-year starter at D2, and a bench contributor after a few years at higher D1 teams.

This argument doesn't wash. The reason he is playing on a DIII team is because the system is broken. Even if he was not recruited by a single human DI coach, there are 300? DI SIMS that should have grabbed him...or 250ish DII SIMS.

Posted by gomiami1972 on 3/25/2018 10:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 3/23/2018 8:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 6:31:00 PM (view original):
Why, in your mind, did no D1 or D2 humans go after him? I'm looking at what his initial ratings and (minimum) potentials were and I can't see any reason whatsoever why a D2 school wouldn't have wanted him. He could have had as little as 56 ATH, which is obviously low for that level, but given his combination of offensive, defensive, and rebounding potentials he was obviously going to be able to compensate for that. I've had numerous less desirable recruits get scooped out from under me by ACC schools. And frankly, as a 6th man, he would be a useful contributor even in high D1.

Which brings up what I don't like about the current recruiting system. Somebody earlier congratulated his coach on "good recruiting." To me, you can give some props for aiming high, but overwhelmingly the ability to recruit a player of that caliber in D3 comes down to luck. The guy was a top 50 player at his position, from the continental United States. For him to slip through the cracks with so much high-high potential is a rare event that just happened to break this coach's way this time. But most times you'll just surrender all the resources you've spent on a player like this when D1 comes knocking. That said, I'd fight a D2 to the very end for a player like that unless I had extremely ugly preference match.

I’m certainly not making the argument that he’s not good enough to play D1. I’ve got a very similar player as a senior at Oregon. Simply pointing out the fact, the reason he’s playing on a D3 team is because in this case, no higher level team tried very hard to get him. Is that luck? Not really. It’s the sum of a number of gameplay choices. The D3 certainly took on some risk. I took Liberatore from a D2 in similar fashion. This recruiting system is about knowing probabilities, taking calculated risks, and preparing contingencies, if desired.

The same player can be a D3 star, a solid 3-year starter at D2, and a bench contributor after a few years at higher D1 teams.

This argument doesn't wash. The reason he is playing on a DIII team is because the system is broken. Even if he was not recruited by a single human DI coach, there are 300? DI SIMS that should have grabbed him...or 250ish DII SIMS.

I don’t necessarily disagree, but why? How would it make the game better? Why is the game “broken” because every single D3 school has access to him, if other humans pass on him? As I’ve said before, I think a case could be made for a chance this type of player goes juco instead of drops, and probably a weaker case that the game would be better served if sims recruited harder and were more likely to snatch these guys away. I’ve yet to see anyone seriously try to make that case, but I’m open to it. Although I doubt either of those options makes D3 more fun to play.

Posted by shoe3 on 3/25/2018 10:47:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 3/25/2018 10:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 3/23/2018 8:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 6:31:00 PM (view original):
Why, in your mind, did no D1 or D2 humans go after him? I'm looking at what his initial ratings and (minimum) potentials were and I can't see any reason whatsoever why a D2 school wouldn't have wanted him. He could have had as little as 56 ATH, which is obviously low for that level, but given his combination of offensive, defensive, and rebounding potentials he was obviously going to be able to compensate for that. I've had numerous less desirable recruits get scooped out from under me by ACC schools. And frankly, as a 6th man, he would be a useful contributor even in high D1.

Which brings up what I don't like about the current recruiting system. Somebody earlier congratulated his coach on "good recruiting." To me, you can give some props for aiming high, but overwhelmingly the ability to recruit a player of that caliber in D3 comes down to luck. The guy was a top 50 player at his position, from the continental United States. For him to slip through the cracks with so much high-high potential is a rare event that just happened to break this coach's way this time. But most times you'll just surrender all the resources you've spent on a player like this when D1 comes knocking. That said, I'd fight a D2 to the very end for a player like that unless I had extremely ugly preference match.

I’m certainly not making the argument that he’s not good enough to play D1. I’ve got a very similar player as a senior at Oregon. Simply pointing out the fact, the reason he’s playing on a D3 team is because in this case, no higher level team tried very hard to get him. Is that luck? Not really. It’s the sum of a number of gameplay choices. The D3 certainly took on some risk. I took Liberatore from a D2 in similar fashion. This recruiting system is about knowing probabilities, taking calculated risks, and preparing contingencies, if desired.

The same player can be a D3 star, a solid 3-year starter at D2, and a bench contributor after a few years at higher D1 teams.

This argument doesn't wash. The reason he is playing on a DIII team is because the system is broken. Even if he was not recruited by a single human DI coach, there are 300? DI SIMS that should have grabbed him...or 250ish DII SIMS.

I don’t necessarily disagree, but why? How would it make the game better? Why is the game “broken” because every single D3 school has access to him, if other humans pass on him? As I’ve said before, I think a case could be made for a chance this type of player goes juco instead of drops, and probably a weaker case that the game would be better served if sims recruited harder and were more likely to snatch these guys away. I’ve yet to see anyone seriously try to make that case, but I’m open to it. Although I doubt either of those options makes D3 more fun to play.

Nice try, shoe. I did not state the game is broken because every DIII school has access to him or because all upper-division humans pass on him. The game is broken because DI talent should be pursued by DI SIM schools and, since the vast majority of DI schools are SIM, the game is broken to allow that type of player to fall to DIII. How would that make the game better? For those looking to move up to DI (or move up within DI,) every DI SIM school wouldn't be a dumpster fire with garbage talent. DI SIMS are taking walkons, sometimes many walkons, each season. This DIII player is exactly the type of player DI SIM teams should be signing...unwanted for whatever reason by other DI human coaches and good enough to give an applying human coach some semblance of roster talent when the job window opens.

Posted by gomiami1972 on 3/26/2018 5:21:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 3/25/2018 10:47:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 3/25/2018 10:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 3/23/2018 8:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 6:31:00 PM (view original):
Why, in your mind, did no D1 or D2 humans go after him? I'm looking at what his initial ratings and (minimum) potentials were and I can't see any reason whatsoever why a D2 school wouldn't have wanted him. He could have had as little as 56 ATH, which is obviously low for that level, but given his combination of offensive, defensive, and rebounding potentials he was obviously going to be able to compensate for that. I've had numerous less desirable recruits get scooped out from under me by ACC schools. And frankly, as a 6th man, he would be a useful contributor even in high D1.

Which brings up what I don't like about the current recruiting system. Somebody earlier congratulated his coach on "good recruiting." To me, you can give some props for aiming high, but overwhelmingly the ability to recruit a player of that caliber in D3 comes down to luck. The guy was a top 50 player at his position, from the continental United States. For him to slip through the cracks with so much high-high potential is a rare event that just happened to break this coach's way this time. But most times you'll just surrender all the resources you've spent on a player like this when D1 comes knocking. That said, I'd fight a D2 to the very end for a player like that unless I had extremely ugly preference match.

I’m certainly not making the argument that he’s not good enough to play D1. I’ve got a very similar player as a senior at Oregon. Simply pointing out the fact, the reason he’s playing on a D3 team is because in this case, no higher level team tried very hard to get him. Is that luck? Not really. It’s the sum of a number of gameplay choices. The D3 certainly took on some risk. I took Liberatore from a D2 in similar fashion. This recruiting system is about knowing probabilities, taking calculated risks, and preparing contingencies, if desired.

The same player can be a D3 star, a solid 3-year starter at D2, and a bench contributor after a few years at higher D1 teams.

This argument doesn't wash. The reason he is playing on a DIII team is because the system is broken. Even if he was not recruited by a single human DI coach, there are 300? DI SIMS that should have grabbed him...or 250ish DII SIMS.

I don’t necessarily disagree, but why? How would it make the game better? Why is the game “broken” because every single D3 school has access to him, if other humans pass on him? As I’ve said before, I think a case could be made for a chance this type of player goes juco instead of drops, and probably a weaker case that the game would be better served if sims recruited harder and were more likely to snatch these guys away. I’ve yet to see anyone seriously try to make that case, but I’m open to it. Although I doubt either of those options makes D3 more fun to play.

Nice try, shoe. I did not state the game is broken because every DIII school has access to him or because all upper-division humans pass on him. The game is broken because DI talent should be pursued by DI SIM schools and, since the vast majority of DI schools are SIM, the game is broken to allow that type of player to fall to DIII. How would that make the game better? For those looking to move up to DI (or move up within DI,) every DI SIM school wouldn't be a dumpster fire with garbage talent. DI SIMS are taking walkons, sometimes many walkons, each season. This DIII player is exactly the type of player DI SIM teams should be signing...unwanted for whatever reason by other DI human coaches and good enough to give an applying human coach some semblance of roster talent when the job window opens.

D1 sims do sign this kind of player all the time, when humans don’t push/keep them off. What you’re talking about is having sims recruit more intelligently and more aggressively. I’m fine with it. I highly doubt most people playing this game would find that more enjoyable, however.

Thats why I said it’s a weaker case than could be made for assigning these higher division players a probability or tendency to choose juco rather than dropping. Maybe start an A+ D2 at 80% and move down 1% each 1/3 grade, so an A+ D3 team would have a 68% chance of getting him on campus. It would be interesting to try in a beta, but I suspect it would suppress people reaching up, making for a less competitive game (which is, of course, why some people would like it).

Posted by shoe3 on 3/26/2018 10:28:00 AM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 3/26/2018 5:21:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 3/25/2018 10:47:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 3/25/2018 10:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 3/23/2018 8:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 6:31:00 PM (view original):
Why, in your mind, did no D1 or D2 humans go after him? I'm looking at what his initial ratings and (minimum) potentials were and I can't see any reason whatsoever why a D2 school wouldn't have wanted him. He could have had as little as 56 ATH, which is obviously low for that level, but given his combination of offensive, defensive, and rebounding potentials he was obviously going to be able to compensate for that. I've had numerous less desirable recruits get scooped out from under me by ACC schools. And frankly, as a 6th man, he would be a useful contributor even in high D1.

Which brings up what I don't like about the current recruiting system. Somebody earlier congratulated his coach on "good recruiting." To me, you can give some props for aiming high, but overwhelmingly the ability to recruit a player of that caliber in D3 comes down to luck. The guy was a top 50 player at his position, from the continental United States. For him to slip through the cracks with so much high-high potential is a rare event that just happened to break this coach's way this time. But most times you'll just surrender all the resources you've spent on a player like this when D1 comes knocking. That said, I'd fight a D2 to the very end for a player like that unless I had extremely ugly preference match.

I’m certainly not making the argument that he’s not good enough to play D1. I’ve got a very similar player as a senior at Oregon. Simply pointing out the fact, the reason he’s playing on a D3 team is because in this case, no higher level team tried very hard to get him. Is that luck? Not really. It’s the sum of a number of gameplay choices. The D3 certainly took on some risk. I took Liberatore from a D2 in similar fashion. This recruiting system is about knowing probabilities, taking calculated risks, and preparing contingencies, if desired.

The same player can be a D3 star, a solid 3-year starter at D2, and a bench contributor after a few years at higher D1 teams.

This argument doesn't wash. The reason he is playing on a DIII team is because the system is broken. Even if he was not recruited by a single human DI coach, there are 300? DI SIMS that should have grabbed him...or 250ish DII SIMS.

I don’t necessarily disagree, but why? How would it make the game better? Why is the game “broken” because every single D3 school has access to him, if other humans pass on him? As I’ve said before, I think a case could be made for a chance this type of player goes juco instead of drops, and probably a weaker case that the game would be better served if sims recruited harder and were more likely to snatch these guys away. I’ve yet to see anyone seriously try to make that case, but I’m open to it. Although I doubt either of those options makes D3 more fun to play.

Nice try, shoe. I did not state the game is broken because every DIII school has access to him or because all upper-division humans pass on him. The game is broken because DI talent should be pursued by DI SIM schools and, since the vast majority of DI schools are SIM, the game is broken to allow that type of player to fall to DIII. How would that make the game better? For those looking to move up to DI (or move up within DI,) every DI SIM school wouldn't be a dumpster fire with garbage talent. DI SIMS are taking walkons, sometimes many walkons, each season. This DIII player is exactly the type of player DI SIM teams should be signing...unwanted for whatever reason by other DI human coaches and good enough to give an applying human coach some semblance of roster talent when the job window opens.

D1 sims do sign this kind of player all the time, when humans don’t push/keep them off. What you’re talking about is having sims recruit more intelligently and more aggressively. I’m fine with it. I highly doubt most people playing this game would find that more enjoyable, however.

Thats why I said it’s a weaker case than could be made for assigning these higher division players a probability or tendency to choose juco rather than dropping. Maybe start an A+ D2 at 80% and move down 1% each 1/3 grade, so an A+ D3 team would have a 68% chance of getting him on campus. It would be interesting to try in a beta, but I suspect it would suppress people reaching up, making for a less competitive game (which is, of course, why some people would like it).

OK, we'll just somewhat disagree. I think we are fairly close in thought despite the back and forth.

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 7:58:00 AM (view original):
What I find surprising is how generally mediocre his stat line looks. I mean it's obviously not bad, but his rebounds are pretty average (not shocking) and his shooting percentages are somewhat below average. Maybe he's just shooting too much for the flex offense?

It's called great coaching honestly that newbie is using him very very well.

Posted by cubcub113 on 3/26/2018 5:49:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 7:58:00 AM (view original):
What I find surprising is how generally mediocre his stat line looks. I mean it's obviously not bad, but his rebounds are pretty average (not shocking) and his shooting percentages are somewhat below average. Maybe he's just shooting too much for the flex offense?

It's called great coaching honestly that newbie is using him very very well.

Why do you say that?

Posted by Trentonjoe on 3/26/2018 7:35:00 PM (view original):

Posted by cubcub113 on 3/26/2018 5:49:00 PM (view original):

Posted by dahsdebater on 3/23/2018 7:58:00 AM (view original):
What I find surprising is how generally mediocre his stat line looks. I mean it's obviously not bad, but his rebounds are pretty average (not shocking) and his shooting percentages are somewhat below average. Maybe he's just shooting too much for the flex offense?

It's called great coaching honestly that newbie is using him very very well.

Why do you say that?

4 RPI with a very solid DIII team? 95% of coaches would overuse Crampton to death!

I don't know, he's taking twice as many shots as option 2 and 3 in a motion and option 2 and 3 are very good as well. I think it was dahs who said he is in the worst possible O/D situation and he has almost no team passing. Even with that being said I am shocked he's not shooting over 50%. I don't know if it's usage, or schedule, or fatigue, or team passing or (most likely) the combination of some of those factors.

I think the Texas Tyler coach is doing a great job winning but I feel like this guys results are pretty far from optimal.

I agree, TJ. The team is winning, but it could certainly be more efficient, IMO. I would guess the distribution for the starters are some variation of 10-5-5-2-1, which would be fine in triangle or flex, but isn’t ideal for motion or fast break. I’d be personally looking for closer to 10-8-7-5-1. I would want him closer 55% shooting for better efficiency, and I suspect he could still average 16+ ppg, with options 2 and 3 more than making up that difference without losing efficiency.

Posted by Trentonjoe on 3/26/2018 8:27:00 PM (view original):
I don't know, he's taking twice as many shots as option 2 and 3 in a motion and option 2 and 3 are very good as well. I think it was dahs who said he is in the worst possible O/D situation and he has almost no team passing. Even with that being said I am shocked he's not shooting over 50%. I don't know if it's usage, or schedule, or fatigue, or team passing or (most likely) the combination of some of those factors.

I think the Texas Tyler coach is doing a great job winning but I feel like this guys results are pretty far from optimal.

Its fatigue.

Posted by Benis on 3/26/2018 9:12:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Trentonjoe on 3/26/2018 8:27:00 PM (view original):
I don't know, he's taking twice as many shots as option 2 and 3 in a motion and option 2 and 3 are very good as well. I think it was dahs who said he is in the worst possible O/D situation and he has almost no team passing. Even with that being said I am shocked he's not shooting over 50%. I don't know if it's usage, or schedule, or fatigue, or team passing or (most likely) the combination of some of those factors.

I think the Texas Tyler coach is doing a great job winning but I feel like this guys results are pretty far from optimal.

Its fatigue.

That's what I was going to say.

He was drafted 52nd by the Utah Jazz.

https://www.whatifsports.com/hd/TeamProfile/Drafted.aspx?tid=6763

Nice!