Theories....... and tips please Topic

All right, so I have been looking at quite a few statistics lately and I am finding that players with higher +/- tend to have a higher salary. A great example is Ken Klee 98-99 a -9 and $1,170,717 and 99-00 a +8 and $3,311,299 the only other number different is the D. Players from before the recording of +/- tend to be given 0 auto.(Some Exceptions)

What I would like to know is how is the D calculated? Could it be based on annual team performance and then player performance on the team based on their production totals and compared to teamates?? It is obviously some sort of algo.

Also, if anyone is willing to share how best to use the checking, conservative, medium and aggressive functions would be appreciated, I am still trying to figure this out!
Any other advanced strategies or tips is appreciated.

Polly
4/11/2018 2:03 PM
Here is more to think on
Washington Caps 98-99 GF 200 GA 218 (Klee bad), and in 99-00 GF 227 GA 194 (Klee good)

in 02-03 Klee is a +/- +22 Caps record GF 224 and GA 220 almost even Klee is 66 on D

I have spazzed out enough on this puzzle!
4/11/2018 4:06 PM
Found this on WIS developer chat, confirms some of my thinking.
https://www.whatifsports.com/devchat/devchat.asp?chatid=18
Wish I saw this before burning up brain cells thinking about it. DOH!
4/11/2018 8:33 PM
WiS players historically complained about huge “Defensive” ratings for unremarkable players. It is a team related stat. I have usually said to think of it more as a “Dominance” rating.

Also, as my mentor used to say, remember that the basis for all these games is Sim Matchup, which is team based. So the individual players have to reflect their team’s performance in each given season.

Now take a look at the database itself. Where do you see the huge defensive ratings? The 30s and 40s, and the 70s. Eras in which not only great teams existed but which were counterbalanced by the presence of terrible teams, too.

Today’s players are rated wrong in relation to the rest of the database IMO. They tweaked the formula about eight years ago. It kind of threw today’s defensemen out of whack.

4/11/2018 9:26 PM
do you think the hockey database is due for a retool?
4/11/2018 11:21 PM
That'd be a huge undertaking. While I have my complaints about the current pricing, the game works pretty much the way the developers wanted it to. That's one reason why they never touched it after the last rework. (The other, of course, is that the guy(s) who did it aren't here anymore.)

4/12/2018 7:19 AM
Damag is right about the team Def. effect.

Here is my analysis on Justin Faulk's 80 D year with low salary. Carolina's spread between Goals for and Goals against was -38 Faulk was a -19 as a result his defense was much better but because he is a negative +/- it impacts his salary.

Another analysis is of D. Schultz he has a butt load of penaties but because he played on a strong Def. Philiy team his D stats are high for an enforcer

4/12/2018 8:37 AM
Hi Polly!

To answer your questions about d ratings, when you initially draft a player, his real life +/- ratings mean nothing. The sim bases the player based on the rating he was assigned. There has been much discussion on this previously, as Dan Hamhuis and his 99 d rating will show. Anyone who knows hockey knows that in no way, shape, or form was he the best defensive defenseman to ever play the game, regardless of his WIS rating. Also, you will notice how few owners will use some of the all-time great players to ever play the game (Howe, Richard, Bathgate, etc..) as most of those players had stats that did not translate well to the "modern day" NHL. Much debate about that has gone on in the past as well. Regardless, games played, shooting % and shots per game, pim per game, d rating, and to a lesser extent assists per game is what you want to look for when drafting a player. All of that is taken into consideration when WIS assigns a salary to a player.
As far as user settings go, aggressive is a sure way to lose. I occasionally use aggressive on my power play, and sometimes (depending on my opponent) in the last minute of the game. The best way to figure out settings is to experiment with them in ten game cycles. See how your team performs against your opponents, but keep in mind if you play weaker teams the results may be skewered slightly. Most players though use a mix of conservative and checking, with some medium thrown in.
This is the WIS description: https://www.whatifsports.com/knowledgebase/KB_Article_Details.aspx?kbid=192

As you may have noticed, there are some advanced settings in the Coach's Office that will allow you to set a specific style based on certain criteria. The "Default Offensive Style" is the style the line plays if none of your advanced criteria is met. Aggressive means that your line will play an aggressive forecheck, increasing your likelihood of scoring but at also increases the chances of your opponent scoring on you. Medium means that your line will not be as aggressive and your defense will be more solid as well. Conservative means that your line will focus on defense and not try hard to score goals. Checking means your line will play a more physical game, hitting harder. The effects are that the line focuses less on offense and more on playing defense and getting turnovers. The checking style can also fatigue the opponents (in-game) slightly more, but also makes your line slightly more likely to commit penalties since they are playing more physically.

Hope that helps to answer your question!
4/12/2018 11:51 AM
Thank you Chuckinrip, Lucko and Damag.

I am still seeing the same with Hamhuis, although I agree that he is not the best D ever. Here are the numbers if anyone is curios, Hamhuis was a + 29 and a 99D and a 94D both years and played for canucks 2010-2011 Team all time best record of 117 pts and 2011-2012 second best team record of 111 pts. The team effect raises his D higher and his +/- makes it that much better and raises his $ unlike what happened with Faulk whose $ stays low because of his -19.

Also, I agree with you Chuckinrip the real life +/- means nothing to the game play, but I think that the +/- along with other stats are used to develop the ratings to create the assigned numbers.

I hope the league I am in drafts soon so I can stop all this thinking about how the game is developed!lol
4/12/2018 2:52 PM
The Goalie Theory
Quite simple really the only 2 stats that I can see that are a factor are the save % and number of games. When it comes to the price of the goalie the save percentage is set to a factor or base rate and then multiplied by the number of games they played to create the salary.

You can see it by searching for a goalie and setting the search terms for Save % then divide the goalies Salary by number of games played. Since the Save % search term is constant you will see the base rate factor or per game rate for a goalie of that save %.

When all seasons are set to 82 constant. Do a search for 90% All goalies will have a per game constant of $45858 and change salary( if you use a different save % the per game constant changes). Garth Snow played 65 games one season with a 90.0 Save %. If you multiple 65 by 45858 and change you get his salary. If you multiple by 82 this will give you the cap for the said Save %

Wins and losses do not matter in the Salary just games and Save %. One could in theory pick 2 goalies whose total games add up to 82 to maximize the amount of cash spent on goal. So cash is not just sitting on the bench or wasted.

What have your experiences been with goalies and the Wins -Losses statistic? I am curios to know the impact it has if any! also the 3rd goalie scenario is interesting and the theory of having one well rested for the playoffs.






4/13/2018 11:04 AM
Here is an interesting observation about a player who was traded, I was looking at the player for the up coming draft in the league I am in
Todd Gill 98-99 St. Louis played 28 games with a salary of $576,924 and 98-99 Detroit played 23 with a salary of $622,416
St. Louis added to Detroit numbers yield 51 games and combined salary $1199340 but the combined stat from WIS for 51 games shows $1160637!?!
One would think when Data is combined that the parts would equal the whole but in this case the parts are more than the whole.

I have noticed this with other players too! Is this just a rounding error? Why the difference?
Or are Aliens among us?lol
4/15/2018 1:07 PM
Some guys just are calculated wrong polly. Letang and Doughty are two that come to mind. They should be much higher salary-wise than they are based on normal calculations, but for some reason they came in cheaper than they should have (2014-15 versions). Another is Gostisbehere (2106-17). Klingberg (2014-15) is another example. The data is entered by hand so perhaps there was an input error on the part of Mike Welch when he did it? Who knows? We are just thankful for that gift! ;^)
4/16/2018 8:48 AM
Thanks Chuckinrip! I love the game I used to work with statistics and process (quality) control, finding variations and trying to determine why is great fun for me. As is Hockey! As weird as it may seem I really get my geek on when Hockey and stats are combined.
4/16/2018 1:32 PM
What is the purpose behind having multiple accounts on What if Sports? Is it just to erase a previous bad record??
4/19/2018 2:23 PM
Some people have a second and third account so they can join the same league under different names. Sometimes it is to start over, sometimes it is to remain anonymous. You'd have to ask the people with multiple accounts though for their reasoning. (I don't have one so I am just speculating)
4/19/2018 2:58 PM
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