I’m sure this has been discussed before, but I wasn’t able to find any threads on it.

Are there any schools in D2 with the same level of isolation that PBAU and Colorado have in D3?

I feel like Hawaii could be good if there is no D1 coach. I also am pretty sure Alaska is horrible since there are rarely any D1 recruits.

Hawaii Pacific in Tark just got a 3 star this last cycle with no D1 Hawaii school, so you're right about that.

Posted by billscnb on 5/15/2018 10:14:00 PM (view original):
Hawaii Pacific in Tark just got a 3 star this last cycle with no D1 Hawaii school, so you're right about that.

Just checked that out, that dude is going to tear up D2 by the time he is an upperclassman.

D2 Hawaii can be very good if D1 Hawaii is SIM, but it can be pretty hit or miss depending on recruit generation. Next season I may have zero players on my roster from Hawaii because there have been no good local players the past several years.

Truly Isolated -

DII Hawaii. If you are the only coach and the DI school is either SIM or a good human coach, this is a great location.

Puerto Rico. If you are the only one, this is a fantastic location...maybe the best of the truly isolated spots.

Alaska. You must be the only one and, even then, your options are International/Calgary, ON and whatever you can scrap from the mainland.

Partially Isolated -

Montana State-Billings. A very good location to grab up Big Sky country, especially if NW Nazarene is SIM.

NW Nazarene. If MSU-Billings is SIM, another good location but not as desirable since the Pacific NW schools are close enough to bother you.

Grand Canyon. Almost always taken by humans...for a good reason. It's the best partially isolated DII school.

I imagine the internal conversation someone has when applying for D1 Hawaii goes something like

"Its lower prestige makes me eligible. It's in a power conference. I'll have the islands all to myself. I'll learn to be skillful at landing internationals. I've always wanted to live in Hawaii, even virtually. I know nearly everyone has complained about the difficulties, but I'll be the guy who makes this work! It'll take a few seasons, but I'm all in."

Fast forward a few seasons

"This is harder than I thought. I knew there wouldn't be a ton of recruits in the area, but this has been ridiculous. And I have no edge on internationals because we're all paying the same rate and at least someone seems to be on every good one. Well, I can always move back to the mainland."

Repeat with new guy taking over Hawaii.

Posted by gomiami1972 on 5/16/2018 8:17:00 AM (view original):
Truly Isolated -

DII Hawaii. If you are the only coach and the DI school is either SIM or a good human coach, this is a great location.

Puerto Rico. If you are the only one, this is a fantastic location...maybe the best of the truly isolated spots.

Alaska. You must be the only one and, even then, your options are International/Calgary, ON and whatever you can scrap from the mainland.

Partially Isolated -

Montana State-Billings. A very good location to grab up Big Sky country, especially if NW Nazarene is SIM.

NW Nazarene. If MSU-Billings is SIM, another good location but not as desirable since the Pacific NW schools are close enough to bother you.

Grand Canyon. Almost always taken by humans...for a good reason. It's the best partially isolated DII school.

Puerto Rico seems really lucrative, but I wonder if it is viable to recruit the east coast US if there aren’t many options in the PR class.

The MSU-Billings and NW Nazarene makes sense, but how many recruits really generate up there?

I have had good success both in Alaska (9 seasons, a final four, elite 8, COY, and 8 straight NT seasons before I left) with my main account and a defunct alias I spent a few seasons at UPRB with. The AP system in 3.0 makes it a lot easier to recruit mainland recruits in addition to internationals. I did find it helpful to try and have larger recruiting classes though to max out resources because scouting from a distance does get expensive, and also signed a bunch of recruits with lower levels of scouting. From Puerto Rico you can easily recruit Florida too, which is rich in talent and depending on the world only having a few human coaches. Ultimately the reason I left Alaska wasn't because talent wasn't available, but because I wanted a conference with more active chat. I did only ever recruit 1 Alaskan player though because they don't generate a lot of good ones up there, so you gotta be prepared to recruit at distance, ie. lots of AP and casting a very wide net and not getting into too many battles.

Posted by jaxorbetter on 5/16/2018 9:07:00 AM (view original):
I imagine the internal conversation someone has when applying for D1 Hawaii goes something like

"Its lower prestige makes me eligible. It's in a power conference. I'll have the islands all to myself. I'll learn to be skillful at landing internationals. I've always wanted to live in Hawaii, even virtually. I know nearly everyone has complained about the difficulties, but I'll be the guy who makes this work! It'll take a few seasons, but I'm all in."

Fast forward a few seasons

"This is harder than I thought. I knew there wouldn't be a ton of recruits in the area, but this has been ridiculous. And I have no edge on internationals because we're all paying the same rate and at least someone seems to be on every good one. Well, I can always move back to the mainland."

Repeat with new guy taking over Hawaii.

Yep, more of this is dead on than I'd care to admit.

I was at Hawaii Tark last season and was VH for that late-preference kid who ultimately went D2. After one season on the islands, I wasn't feeling it and I moved back to the mainland.

I had lots of fun coaching Chaminade. But D1 is different.

I liked my time at Hawaii, I had a really good team put together but I left for VT because I went there. I advise Triangle Zone so you only need 7 players. And you need to fight anybody who tries to recruit the island.

Posted by Wales_ on 5/16/2018 9:47:00 AM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 5/16/2018 8:17:00 AM (view original):
Truly Isolated -

DII Hawaii. If you are the only coach and the DI school is either SIM or a good human coach, this is a great location.

Puerto Rico. If you are the only one, this is a fantastic location...maybe the best of the truly isolated spots.

Alaska. You must be the only one and, even then, your options are International/Calgary, ON and whatever you can scrap from the mainland.

Partially Isolated -

Montana State-Billings. A very good location to grab up Big Sky country, especially if NW Nazarene is SIM.

NW Nazarene. If MSU-Billings is SIM, another good location but not as desirable since the Pacific NW schools are close enough to bother you.

Grand Canyon. Almost always taken by humans...for a good reason. It's the best partially isolated DII school.

Puerto Rico seems really lucrative, but I wonder if it is viable to recruit the east coast US if there aren’t many options in the PR class.

The MSU-Billings and NW Nazarene makes sense, but how many recruits really generate up there?

That's the downside of being at an isolated school. You have a distinct advantage for any local recruits but the number of local recruits is low. You have to be smart with your scouting money so you can venture outside your neighborhood if the local recruits are bad.

I love coaching Hawaii Pacific in Rupp - built that team up pretty quickly. Hawaii has a very top-notch coach in D1 though, so it's hard to get Hawaiian players that are steals, but we can recruit any leftovers that a in the b doesn't want and we are likely to get them.

Delta State is the only D2 in Mississippi

Maybe i recruit different (or recruit wrong), but at D2, none of this isolation stuff matters. Now, i understand the benefit to it in theory. But for me, I hop around with recruits non stop. Especially with poaching. It's not surprising for me to have 12 guys from 12 different states.

It reminds me of Mike Tyson's famous quote.... "Everybody has a game plan 'til they get hit in the mouth"

I can scout and prepare for days. And aim for local guys in an attempt to get the best and closest talent. And two cycles into recruiting, here comes D1 humans, or multiple A+ D2 prestige humans fighting for the same guys (whether the coaches are local or not).

For me, recruiting NEVER goes to plan. If I have 4 openings, I may have 20 targets that stand out above the rest. And when it's over, I'll sign 4 and possibly none are from my original targets. And often they are better players. Guys that are being overlooked.

When you're in an isolated location, sure, there may be less to choose from and less competition. But I've never had a recruiting session yet where I set out for "these 4 guys" and end up signing "these 4 guys".

(I've never played in Hawaii. So I'm sure that's a lot different. But a place like Grand Canyon for example, there's PLENTY of states nearby to get players that are equal or better than the locals. And the budget allows that)

I would also think by now, this has a reverse effect. "Well there's only 1 D2 school in Arizona, let's see what that state has to offer this season since i won't have to battle very many schools"..... says 20 coaches from California.

Am i wrong here?

You’re not wrong.

Geography is important, but “isolation” gets a little overplayed. Saturation of humans in a region is a tough environment to deal with, especially if you need to rebuild. The important thing to know is where the dead spots are in a world. If one of the Big 6 conferences is weak, scout that area, because chances are good that some B- level D1 recruits may fall through the human net. Same concept at D3, make note of where D2 conferences are weak, and scout those areas. Scouting the D2 pool as a D3 is super efficient, even at long distances, if you know what you’re doing.

Knowledge of geography is more important than having your own slice of property all to yourself.