I think in most cases, since it makes sense to use the fatigue settings for your depth chart, as opposed to using targeted minutes, I would like to see a setting for each player, if promised a certain amount of minutes, you should have the option to try to hit that player's targeted minutes. Seble obviously changed something, the 90% rule, which was changed to 80% and now it's totally nonexistent. I've gotten complaints for guys playing 23 and 24 minutes, where there have been games where they've fouled out or gotten into foul trouble, which lowered their minutes per game, to no fault of the coach.

Are you saying you promised a player 25 minutes and they are complaining because they average only 23 or 24?

Posted by gomiami1972 on 6/21/2018 8:19:00 PM (view original):
Are you saying you promised a player 25 minutes and they are complaining because they average only 23 or 24?

Yes, and quite often since 3.0 came out. Not really this season for my team, but at least a handful of times in the past. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has seen this. It usually happens if they are at like maybe 23.5 and they haven't reached their target minutes (25) in 3 consecutive games.

For instance, you could have a guy that was promised 25 minutes, have him foul out one game, lose minutes because of foul trouble for another game and maybe not reach 25 because of his stamina, as freshman usually have low stamina ratings or just the pace of the game.

Damn, I never promise that many minutes so I haven't noticed it. While the fouling out thing I don't have too much sympathy for (that's the risk of promising serious playing time to somebody with bad IQ,) the elimination of wiggle room (80-90%) seems like a very bad idea. The two, in combo, is stupid. The game is not that sophisticated to have such exacting standards.

Theres nothing wrong with using target minutes, and it’s a good strategy when you’re keeping a promise, or have a full roster of players to keep happy.

If you really hate it, you can set the player to getting tired or tired using fatigue, which is essentially no different from what you’re asking for here.

Yes the 80% rule doesn't seem to always work now.

Posted by gomiami1972 on 6/21/2018 8:31:00 PM (view original):
Damn, I never promise that many minutes so I haven't noticed it. While the fouling out thing I don't have too much sympathy for (that's the risk of promising serious playing time to somebody with bad IQ,) the elimination of wiggle room (80-90%) seems like a very bad idea. The two, in combo, is stupid. The game is not that sophisticated to have such exacting standards.

I don’t get the reasoning for a distinction here. It’s all part of the cost of promising minutes. Promises will help you get good players, but then you have to keep them. I have no idea if “wiggle room” has been adjusted (I’m certain it hasn’t been eliminated, but it may have been tweaked). I do think players probably bump up against it more often, because they’re more likely to need to make promises to compete for the players they recruit. There’s always been some variance on how much below the promise you can dip before they get mad.

Posted by texrangers18 on 6/21/2018 8:35:00 PM (view original):
Yes the 80% rule doesn't seem to always work now.

Not towards you, rangers, but how the hell does something not always work? Are we talking about a programming bug that needs a ticket sent in? I can't imagine selbe would program the game to randomly enforce playing time promises...

Posted by shoe3 on 6/21/2018 8:38:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 6/21/2018 8:31:00 PM (view original):
Damn, I never promise that many minutes so I haven't noticed it. While the fouling out thing I don't have too much sympathy for (that's the risk of promising serious playing time to somebody with bad IQ,) the elimination of wiggle room (80-90%) seems like a very bad idea. The two, in combo, is stupid. The game is not that sophisticated to have such exacting standards.

I don’t get the reasoning for a distinction here. It’s all part of the cost of promising minutes. Promises will help you get good players, but then you have to keep them. I have no idea if “wiggle room” has been adjusted (I’m certain it hasn’t been eliminated, but it may have been tweaked). I do think players probably bump up against it more often, because they’re more likely to need to make promises to compete for the players they recruit. There’s always been some variance on how much below the promise you can dip before they get mad.

wizard stated that there is 0 room. Promise 20 minutes and, if he gets 19 because he fouled out, you are slammed...I think. That now makes promises an individual game requirement. Promises used to be based on groups of games.

My point is, I can average 20 minutes a game and drop below it for an individual contest. That is the only logical way of doing it. If what wizard says is true, you either stay at or above the promise, for every game, or the kid gets ****** off. Maybe I'm saying this badly...

Posted by gomiami1972 on 6/21/2018 8:39:00 PM (view original):

Posted by texrangers18 on 6/21/2018 8:35:00 PM (view original):
Yes the 80% rule doesn't seem to always work now.

Not towards you, rangers, but how the hell does something not always work? Are we talking about a programming bug that needs a ticket sent in? I can't imagine selbe would program the game to randomly enforce playing time promises...

It’s not a bug, it’s probability. I’m pretty sure the “80% rule” was never a rule in the first place, since people have reported players getting mad in just the way wiz talks about from a long time ago.

Posted by gomiami1972 on 6/21/2018 8:46:00 PM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 6/21/2018 8:38:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 6/21/2018 8:31:00 PM (view original):
Damn, I never promise that many minutes so I haven't noticed it. While the fouling out thing I don't have too much sympathy for (that's the risk of promising serious playing time to somebody with bad IQ,) the elimination of wiggle room (80-90%) seems like a very bad idea. The two, in combo, is stupid. The game is not that sophisticated to have such exacting standards.

I don’t get the reasoning for a distinction here. It’s all part of the cost of promising minutes. Promises will help you get good players, but then you have to keep them. I have no idea if “wiggle room” has been adjusted (I’m certain it hasn’t been eliminated, but it may have been tweaked). I do think players probably bump up against it more often, because they’re more likely to need to make promises to compete for the players they recruit. There’s always been some variance on how much below the promise you can dip before they get mad.

wizard stated that there is 0 room. Promise 20 minutes and, if he gets 19 because he fouled out, you are slammed...I think. That now makes promises an individual game requirement. Promises used to be based on groups of games.

My point is, I can average 20 minutes a game and drop below it for an individual contest. That is the only logical way of doing it. If what wizard says is true, you either stay at or above the promise, for every game, or the kid gets ****** off. Maybe I'm saying this badly...

I don’t think that’s what he’s saying, and if it is what he’s saying, he’s wrong.

IMO, the “80%” thing was a “rule of thumb”. It wasn’t hard and fast, it just represented the point at which people were usually ok. People have reported losing players for just missing their promises since before 3.0.

The so called 80% rule, back in the day or whatever you want to call it, I used to abuse the heck out of that. Never received a complaint once. I couldn't tell you exactly how long this went on, but know it was at least several months.

I have no problem, if you promise 25 minutes, you should live up to that promise with the exception of, fouling out, being taken into consideration. If you don't agree, then I'm ok with that as well.

But, I think, as in the above situations, if you're going to make the rules so stringent, as to make sure you're hitting your target minutes, for a player not to complain and without any consideration to fouling out, I feel a coach, if using the stamina settings, should have more control over each individual's players's target minutes to make sure he's getting those minutes. One example is "if up or down by 10+ points, game is out of reach etc." then click box to keep player A in game, that way he can get his promised minutes. That's basically all I was really saying.

What I thought he was saying, and I made it dramatic to make a point, was this:

Player is promised 25 minutes - in the first three games he gets 25, 25 and 24...the last game he fouls out at 24 - player is ****** off because he was promised 75 minutes during that 3 game stretch and he only got 74 minutes.

If that is the case, it is stupid. That shifts promised minutes from a seasonal average to an individual game mandate.

To me, there is no difference between a four game stretch that is 10, 10, 40, 40 or one that is 25, 25, 25, 25. Both equal 100 and, divided by four, average 25 minutes per game. If the program now sees a distinction, that is asinine.