1904 Mordecai Brown,

$8,708,490

As it appears that this theme is going to be kicked to the curb (vote is 16-4) I would like to state that I am part of the minority opinion. I feel as though I found a rare book. I have been reading this book, and, though it is not the best written book, it is still highly entertaining and I can't stop turning the pages. But while I'm reading it, someone enters the room, grabs the book out my hands, and throws it into the fireplace, and I will never read the ending.

I'm not about to leave the tournament over this, but I can't really see playing in next year's tournament either.

It was a difficult decision to even put it up for a vote, as I too love the theme and want to see the ending, but I do feel it's better for the tournament both this year specifically and in general.

We could always keep the draft going to prove out the disaster, then maybe even play it as a seventh league but only award a few points, like 10 or 20 to thise that make the playoffs. Probably too much work, but throwing it out there.

I would be up for continuing to run the draft, maybe without timeslots and as a separate league from the WISC (no points, just for fun)

I’ll continue.

I have put so much time into this theme and with me leaving for vacation in 4 days, I do not see me be able to meet the first deadline with 3 teams without this theme since this team is over half constructed and one of the teams I was counting on to meet the first deadline since it would be self completing at the end of the draft. I would also question whether I could complete a brand new theme from scratch with my vacation and Thanksgiving coming up and have 6 teams entered by the second deadline to keep from incurring penalty points, so I voted an emphatic no.

Although, the draft became a train wreck really quickly and I have made no secret that I am not a fan of these trades. But the trades are within the rules so I do not have to be a fan. I just did not envision that many people trading. This theme will leave a bad taste most peoples mouths and might be one of the most noncompetitive themes in the history of WISC but we all knew the rules, if not completely understand how this theme would truly work, before we gave confirmation that we would play in Round 2.

As an aside, I did make a trade with Donbrough. We swapped our picks in the later rounds but those swaps were for picks in the same round. That was to make it easier for me to draft since I will be on vacation at Disney World and it would be very difficult for me to draft in the middle of the day. The way this draft is going, proxy drafting is not a viable option. My biggest thanks to Donbrough, who I have competed against many times over the years. You have my most sincere respect. He was the only player out of everyone I reached out requesting multiple days same round swap and explaining my situation of why I wanted them who agreed to help me out on this clearly neutral trade. Everyone else I reached out to, turned me down flat. Most likely because it did not help them gain the competitive advantage they were looking for and were or are hoping to get.

I see several owners not having competitive teams because of bad drafting (which occurred irregardless of trades). There are a lot of players that have been drafted that have no business being in a $255M league and that was before any trades were made. Although, it was a stroke of genius to pick some low priced versions of star players in the early rounds to eliminate them from the game. It would create an element of more strategic drafting. After all in a $255M league you can live with 2-3 non functional players.

But when the trades started with players moving up and getting multiple picks in the draft, that changed. Those that move up, no longer had to draft smarter as they had their pick of the better players. Those not making any trades, had to draft for survival picking behind those players who were 1 and at the end of this draft, 2 draft picks ahead. Those that moved backwards, drafting whatever is left. I am not sure why anyone would think it would be a good idea to skip a round and get multiple picks in a later round but there were several willing participants. While it sounds good up front that you are getting multiple picks at a higher salary level round, the actuality is you are being left behind and have to pick lower level players first to catch up and then when you do catch up, you are left with whatever players are left.

I think that anyone who made trades to move backwards and skipped rounds will be at a competitive disadvantage because they are left behind and have to fill hitter needs with hitters at a lower salary level because hitters in the higher salary levels have all but disappeared. They will never be able to catch up. Those that moved up with multiple early picks have a huge advantage by filling needs early and moving into the higher salary levels in rounds earlier than anyone else would be able to safely do so. Thus, leaving those in the middle behind to fill our hitter needs before we can venture safely into the higher salary levels as hitters have been rapidly disappearing at the higher salary levels. And, those that are finishing the draft up early have a huge advantage as they will have their pick of the elite high priced pitching before those of us who didn't trade up to end our draft early are able to pick at those levels.

^ To answer two of your concerns. This is not a normal $255m league. There are a limited number of players suitable for $255m play, spread between 24 teams means we have to dig deeper to fill roster spots.
I traded down twice and believe I got good deals. There aren't enough good pitchers so by trading up in the pitching rounds I would be able to draft a better pitching staff. Trading down did not hurt my hitting much, it's only a problem for the people who jumped too far ahead. They were desperate so they made deals that I believe favored those who could afford to trade down.

Posted by Donburgh on 11/10/2018 10:35:00 PM (view original):
As it appears that this theme is going to be kicked to the curb (vote is 16-4) I would like to state that I am part of the minority opinion. I feel as though I found a rare book. I have been reading this book, and, though it is not the best written book, it is still highly entertaining and I can't stop turning the pages. But while I'm reading it, someone enters the room, grabs the book out my hands, and throws it into the fireplace, and I will never read the ending.

I'm not about to leave the tournament over this, but I can't really see playing in next year's tournament either.

I'm so happy that I jumped in this year's tournament, and will happily and with joy, see through all of the leagues, but I'm with you, I can't even imagine doing this again. The owners at the top just whine about something and then it changes. It's impossible to try to keep up with all of the changes that are made to suite them. I won't ever do this again.

One thing for sure: we need all 24 owners to compete in good faith and not quit halfway through the final round. If one or two people throw in the towel, it screws up the whole tournament.

Posted by bothways on 11/11/2018 1:19:00 AM (view original):

Posted by Donburgh on 11/10/2018 10:35:00 PM (view original):
As it appears that this theme is going to be kicked to the curb (vote is 16-4) I would like to state that I am part of the minority opinion. I feel as though I found a rare book. I have been reading this book, and, though it is not the best written book, it is still highly entertaining and I can't stop turning the pages. But while I'm reading it, someone enters the room, grabs the book out my hands, and throws it into the fireplace, and I will never read the ending.

I'm not about to leave the tournament over this, but I can't really see playing in next year's tournament either.

I'm so happy that I jumped in this year's tournament, and will happily and with joy, see through all of the leagues, but I'm with you, I can't even imagine doing this again. The owners at the top just whine about something and then it changes. It's impossible to try to keep up with all of the changes that are made to suite them. I won't ever do this again.

People took advantage of rules that probably shouldn't have been there, but no rules were changed in response to whining. Just the opposite, lots of people including me disliked the rules and said so but none of them were "changed'. What happened was people found unanticipated strategies then others noticed and piled on.

Posted by rbow923 on 11/11/2018 1:30:00 AM (view original):

Posted by bothways on 11/11/2018 1:19:00 AM (view original):

Posted by Donburgh on 11/10/2018 10:35:00 PM (view original):
As it appears that this theme is going to be kicked to the curb (vote is 16-4) I would like to state that I am part of the minority opinion. I feel as though I found a rare book. I have been reading this book, and, though it is not the best written book, it is still highly entertaining and I can't stop turning the pages. But while I'm reading it, someone enters the room, grabs the book out my hands, and throws it into the fireplace, and I will never read the ending.

I'm not about to leave the tournament over this, but I can't really see playing in next year's tournament either.

I'm so happy that I jumped in this year's tournament, and will happily and with joy, see through all of the leagues, but I'm with you, I can't even imagine doing this again. The owners at the top just whine about something and then it changes. It's impossible to try to keep up with all of the changes that are made to suite them. I won't ever do this again.

People took advantage of rules that probably shouldn't have been there, but no rules were changed in response to whining. Just the opposite, lots of people including me disliked the rules and said so but none of them were "changed'. What happened was people found unanticipated strategies then others noticed and piled on.

We will have to agree to disagree. I look forward to competing against you.

I’ll continue as well.

Other than actually abolishing the theme - perhaps bothways is pointing to the draft center cheat issue that was brought up earlier - as I believe he was against the cheat and ozo ruled it as allowed. Sometimes issues like that happen where not everyone will be happy and you just move on and respect the commissioner's decision.

As for cancelling the theme - I think ozo is not left with much choice to provide that option when owners like buddhagamer (and to a lesser extent jmissirlis) are threatening the integrity of the tournament as a whole because things did not turn out their way. It seems they are far from the only ones who want this theme scrapped as it turns out, however I do understand people who are ticked off at how it all played out. I voted "No" because I think my team will dominate. But I get that it's likely in the best interest of the tournament to make this switch.

I am about to have yet another day of travel and am not sure how much I will be online (I just updated the draft board and will do the taken players list later). I would ask that people be respectful both towards the tournament and each other. You can't please everyone. I think I am generally pretty open to discussing things in the forums but this has gotten a bit out of hand here. Let's just be prepared to move forward and keep picking in the meantime.