Agreed.  Fatigue is no longer a major factor. 

considering he's averaging more points and rebounds in the games he doesn't play 40 minutes, i would say there are pretty obvious adverse effects.

edit: he DID get very tired in one of those games, confusing things more.

I don't know why THAT GUY never reached 'Very tired' but looking around games in Phelan at all divisions . . . I see a good number of players in the seventies in stamina who DO reach very tired at least once if not multiple times a game.

I much prefer the system of fatigue before this recent update.  As things are currently, I don't see any reason to have 12 scholarship players.

Under the old version of fatigue quite a few people decided not to carry 12 scholarship players.

Posted by drsnell on 2/26/2011 11:11:00 PM (view original):
I much prefer the system of fatigue before this recent update.  As things are currently, I don't see any reason to have 12 scholarship players.

One of the things I've noticed most since getting back to DI is teams carrying just 9 players now.

Walk on penalty?  With tope players already maxing out quickly who cares if there is slower growth.
Fatigue penatly?  Not anymore.  Just line up 8 players and have them run the entire game.
Players complaining about PT?  With 3 walkons you dont have to worry about them anymore.


IMO this recent change is one opf those moves by HD where they change just one aspect of the game in an attempt to get more realistic but lose sight of the bigger picture and how that change affects every other part of a game which really doesn't match real life.   Bad move for the game ...and one of those changes put in the NO ONE  was clamoring for in the forums.

mully - I sort of get this one & I am OK with this ... it has allowed in d1 two strategies to be elite, one is take fewer walkon's and have a deep roster that goes fast, the second would be try for all 800's and play with 7 or 8 or 9 and go slower.

I am near sure, seble originally planned on making fatigue less important when he decided to drop d1 ratings, then reconsidered when coaches complained, and then when the d1 game sort of struggled, he implmented what amounted to his original plan.  I say this, because in beta testing, one thing I told seble was the large number of 40 & 50 stamina players would change the game more than anything he has done, his answer was, yea, but I want to make stamina less important, which should make it a wash, but noone seems to want that.

One thing I liked about tarek, he often did what was best for the game, even when not popular, I think lessening the role of fatigue is best for the game, even if not popular.  Tarek said one other thing to me in a ticket, something along the lines, when in doubt, I make my decisions based on is this more real life or not.  In the case of fatigue, it is more real life, going to take some getting used to, but I like it.

Plus, I have been helping lots of coaches lately thru mentorship, new d3 coaches almost all play their favorite players too much, too long, this fatigue change will make that intuitive action more effective, again, real life, help the new coaches, help the star player rack up stats by staying in the game longer, I see it as a win.

"Plus, I have been helping lots of coaches lately thru mentorship, new d3 coaches almost all play their favorite players too much, too long, this fatigue change will make that intuitive action more effective, again, real life, help the new coaches, help the star player rack up stats by staying in the game longer, I see it as a win."


In a way it also could be taken as "dumbing down the game".     Sometimes "best for the game" and "mirroring real life" don't go together.  I think this is one of those cases.  Remember most important, the example above is a 77 STA player.   You are OK with sub 80 STA players going a full game without seeing very tired effects?

I don't know, but I'm about to try running my NCSU team with a super-short bench and see what happens with 6 studs...     

Posted by mullycj on 2/27/2011 10:52:00 AM (view original):
"Plus, I have been helping lots of coaches lately thru mentorship, new d3 coaches almost all play their favorite players too much, too long, this fatigue change will make that intuitive action more effective, again, real life, help the new coaches, help the star player rack up stats by staying in the game longer, I see it as a win."


In a way it also could be taken as "dumbing down the game".     Sometimes "best for the game" and "mirroring real life" don't go together.  I think this is one of those cases.  Remember most important, the example above is a 77 STA player.   You are OK with sub 80 STA players going a full game without seeing very tired effects?

sorry mully - I have ten teams - that isn't happening to any of my teams, I must just be stupid, my 77 stamina guys are getting tired

Also, you don't really have a minute by minute fatigue record in the play by play.  you have, what, four a half?  So every five minutes?  And say someone who showed as tired got to very tired, the team calls a timeout before the next time the fatigue shows. . he will have been at 'Very tired' but you will have never seen it.

I personally think he needs to make an adjustment that makes press teams get tired faster than they currently do.  That's my biggest problem.  I think a lot of college players (ones who probably have 80ish stamina) can play 35-40 minutes without needing an oxygen tank, so long as they're playing at a normal tempo on both ends.  They won't be great by the end, but they won't literally be dead, either.

But no one can play for too long at an uptempo pace, pressing after makes and misses, and constantly trapping.  So, make press teams get tired faster, because that's also realistic.  That's one way to lessen the effects, making it more fair for non-press teams.

Posted by arssanguinus on 2/27/2011 12:30:00 PM (view original):
Also, you don't really have a minute by minute fatigue record in the play by play.  you have, what, four a half?  So every five minutes?  And say someone who showed as tired got to very tired, the team calls a timeout before the next time the fatigue shows. . he will have been at 'Very tired' but you will have never seen it.

Well in his most recent 40 minute game he made it all the way to the 3:18 min mark before hitting "Tired"  so if he indeed ever reached  "very tired" status it was probably in the last few mins of the game.

Posted by oldresorter on 2/27/2011 10:31:00 AM (view original):
mully - I sort of get this one & I am OK with this ... it has allowed in d1 two strategies to be elite, one is take fewer walkon's and have a deep roster that goes fast, the second would be try for all 800's and play with 7 or 8 or 9 and go slower.

I am near sure, seble originally planned on making fatigue less important when he decided to drop d1 ratings, then reconsidered when coaches complained, and then when the d1 game sort of struggled, he implmented what amounted to his original plan.  I say this, because in beta testing, one thing I told seble was the large number of 40 & 50 stamina players would change the game more than anything he has done, his answer was, yea, but I want to make stamina less important, which should make it a wash, but noone seems to want that.

One thing I liked about tarek, he often did what was best for the game, even when not popular, I think lessening the role of fatigue is best for the game, even if not popular.  Tarek said one other thing to me in a ticket, something along the lines, when in doubt, I make my decisions based on is this more real life or not.  In the case of fatigue, it is more real life, going to take some getting used to, but I like it.

Plus, I have been helping lots of coaches lately thru mentorship, new d3 coaches almost all play their favorite players too much, too long, this fatigue change will make that intuitive action more effective, again, real life, help the new coaches, help the star player rack up stats by staying in the game longer, I see it as a win.

OR, what I think makes things silly is that he decreased the effect on fatigue to make things a little more like real life ... but that has begat teams taking numerous walk-ons and only 8 or 9 scholarship players, which is nothing like real life whatsoever.

So the end result of his change makes the game less like real life not more. Not to mention it lessen the value of some of the really important areas related to straetegy -- such as recruiting/team building/depth chart/etc.

Bad change.