If I play a 2-3 zone against my opponent, will my starting PF automatically guard my opponents starting PF? Or are defense ratings averaged together?

My opponent today has a beast PF, and i want to put my better defending big man on him, but in a 2-3 zone does that make a difference?

Unless something has changed in the engine that I haven't seen, when you play a zone your defenders ratings are averaged together to form the effectiveness. There is no way to create defensive matchups while running a zone defense.

Posted by jswag1343 on 4/3/2012 2:10:00 PM (view original):
Unless something has changed in the engine that I haven't seen, when you play a zone your defenders ratings are averaged together to form the effectiveness. There is no way to create defensive matchups while running a zone defense.

Some of the forum discussions over the years have tossed around theories as to how it works, but to my knowledge no CS or Admin people have ever really explained it. Two of the most common theories (and just how different these two are is a discussion of its own):

1) As jswag says, your defenders ratings are averaged and this combined-rating is used in the engine as the defender on a particular play. It isn't clear which defenders are being included in that average, but it has been suggested that the position of the offensive player may play some role (e.g., if a PF is shooting and you are in a 2-3, the average of the 3 guys playing non-perimeter (so your 3, 4, and 5) will be taken and used). That may or may not be the case.

2) It has also been suggested that, on any particular play, one of the included defenders (so one of 2, or of 3, or of 5 depending on what you believe) is randomly selected to be matched up with the offensive player on that particular sequence/shot. Again, which defenders are included isn't *known* that I am aware of.

Also, keep in mind that double-teaming is an option in zone, though precisely what RL counterpart that would work like is another unknown.

The short answer is no, it doesn't make a difference.

If you want to stop a particular player, you'll have to set up your zone defense to that player's tendencies.  For instance, a stud post player you want to stop may force you to a -2 setting.  However, I'm not sure how effective that is. Or you could double team, as zbrent mentioned.

In my opinion, the zone does a pretty decent job stopping inside play no matter what you do, assuming you have good defenders (by which I mean good SPD, ATH, DEF and IQ for your particular level).  This makes sense, it is what it is designed to do.  The problem is usually decided how far to extend the zone to stop outside shooting, which the zone can be susceptible to, especially if you have perimeter defenders (everyone but the C) who are relatively slow for their level.

How do double teams work in a zone?

Same way they work in man...  That player will be double-teamed for a good number of his shots, but if he can pass you'll see more open looks for teammates.

It used to be it you always double-teamed a guy you would be running a box-and-1.  For two guys always DT, a triangle-and-2.  Not sure if this is still true or not.  Don't use DTs.

Posted by eanerlihp on 4/4/2012 1:08:00 AM (view original):
It used to be it you always double-teamed a guy you would be running a box-and-1.  For two guys always DT, a triangle-and-2.  Not sure if this is still true or not.  Don't use DTs.

Since I began HD 22 seasons ago, this has never been the case. I don't have the exchange or thread available offhand, but I did have that confirmed by Admin/support at one point.

This is one of the few things I am sure of regarding the zone, since I have been eagerly awaiting an engine update that creates a box-and-1 option/functionality since I've been playing.

If it did, in fact, work that way once and then they got rid of it... well, that would just suck.

Posted by eanerlihp on 4/4/2012 1:08:00 AM (view original):
It used to be it you always double-teamed a guy you would be running a box-and-1.  For two guys always DT, a triangle-and-2.  Not sure if this is still true or not.  Don't use DTs.

I know I read the same thing over a year ago about triangle-and-2, but I can't find it.  Anyone know if it was changed?

I haven't kept up with it because it failed pretty miserably when I tried it for about half of a season.

From Developer Chat on Friday, August 05, 2005:

with the description of double teaming out of a zone to be a box and one, does man to man IQ have any bearing on how productive the double team will be or is it all based on zone IQ? (thethrill10 - Hall of Famer - 3:57 PM)

It's all still based on zone - the "one" in the box and one has only one responsibility and that's to follow that player wherever he goes.

From Developer Chat on Thursday, May 24, 2007:

Defensive Alignment: Is a zone with 1 double team REALLY equal to a match up zone, or is it a box and 1? I've heard different answers from all parties. (mlatsko1 - Hall of Famer - 4:29 PM)

A zone with double-teams treated by the engine as a matchup zone (unlike a box and 1 where the keyed player is guarded man to man for the entire possession).

From Developer Chat on Thursday, November 04, 2010:

Will we ever see a box-and-one or triangle-and-two option for the zone defense? Perhaps not as base defenses, but as the defense played when an opponent is double-teamed in a zone, but with the ability to dictate who the "one" is or "two" are in a zone? (zbrent716- Hall of Famer - 2:15 PM)

That's an interesting idea. I would like to make some changes to gameplanning at some point, but right now there are higher priority items on the list. I will make a note of the suggestion.

Hmm, maybe what I remember reading was a forum post that interpreted things incorrectly.

I'd personally love to run a 1-3-1 zone more than a 2-3

Many moons ago, when I played HD under a different alias, I distinctly remember that DT's in a zone was described as a box and one or a matchup zone depending on situation. Whether the engine has been changed, or simply the way it has been described, I can't say. But once upon a time, that was considered fairly common knowledge.

When double teaming in a zone I always then sway my defense the opposite direction.  For example if I am DT on a SG I will move my D to a - setting, while if I DT a post I move my setting to a +.  I really don't know if that helps or not as I only have a small sample size but in my head that makes the most sense.