A general question, but in this case I'm asking about William Journey.  He was average in D when I signed him and just about immediately went red.  He's never going to get above 51 or 52 in defense.  His speed, however, is going to be at least in the mid- to upper-80s, maybe 90s.  Low ath - 38 and not going anywhere.  Is he going to be a crappy, average, or better defensive player?

D2, by the way.

I'd say slightly below average. Still looks to be a pretty good player though.

He'll be okay, but he'll never be a defensive stopper.  If his Ath was higher, it would certainly help out with the lower Def rating, but since he's got low potential there, he is what he is.  Looks like your team runs M2M, so if I were you, I wouldn't be having him guard the other team's studs, even when he's a senior.  You should be okay with matching him up against your opponent's weaker of their two guards though. 

I'd say below average..I consider a combined 210 in SPD, ATH and DEF to be the low end of good on the defensive spectrum for perimeter players.  I consider a combined 240 exceptional.  To be as low as 180, he would need to be a pretty effective scorer for me to play him. 

So you would consider Beedle: - an exceptional defender for d2?

 

Name	Yr.	Pos.	A	SPD	REB	DE	BLK	LP	PE	BH	P	WE	ST	DU	FT	TOT
Clarence Beedle	So.	PG	76	75	1	99	2	24	70	68	64	84	85	25	C-	673

Posted by arssanguinus on 6/7/2012 9:41:00 AM (view original):

So you would consider Beedle: - an exceptional defender for d2?

 

Name	Yr.	Pos.	A	SPD	REB	DE	BLK	LP	PE	BH	P	WE	ST	DU	FT	TOT
Clarence Beedle	So.	PG	76	75	1	99	2	24	70	68	64	84	85	25	C-	673

Are you saying that he's not?  Or is this more of a "look at me, look at me, look how good my player is" post?  Because you know he's an exceptional defender for D2.

um yeah!  I would consider him a stud...

Posted by Trentonjoe on 6/7/2012 9:23:00 AM (view original):
I'd say below average..I consider a combined 210 in SPD, ATH and DEF to be the low end of good on the defensive spectrum for perimeter players.  I consider a combined 240 exceptional.  To be as low as 180, he would need to be a pretty effective scorer for me to play him. 

I think I should qualify my statement....I think 210 is the low end for effective for a team with NT hopes.

Posted by Trentonjoe on 6/7/2012 9:23:00 AM (view original):
I'd say below average..I consider a combined 210 in SPD, ATH and DEF to be the low end of good on the defensive spectrum for perimeter players.  I consider a combined 240 exceptional.  To be as low as 180, he would need to be a pretty effective scorer for me to play him. 

I wanted him to run point by the time he was a Junior.  Doesn't look good for that now - he looks more like a career backup.  I rolled the dice, hoping that average D might get him up around 60.

Posted by dcy0827 on 6/7/2012 9:58:00 AM (view original):

Posted by arssanguinus on 6/7/2012 9:41:00 AM (view original):

So you would consider Beedle: - an exceptional defender for d2?

 

Name	Yr.	Pos.	A	SPD	REB	DE	BLK	LP	PE	BH	P	WE	ST	DU	FT	TOT
Clarence Beedle	So.	PG	76	75	1	99	2	24	70	68	64	84	85	25	C-	673

Are you saying that he's not?  Or is this more of a "look at me, look at me, look how good my player is" post?  Because you know he's an exceptional defender for D2.

That's undoubtedly a not-so-humble brag.

Posted by isack24 on 6/7/2012 10:15:00 AM (view original):

Posted by dcy0827 on 6/7/2012 9:58:00 AM (view original):

Posted by arssanguinus on 6/7/2012 9:41:00 AM (view original):

So you would consider Beedle: - an exceptional defender for d2?

 

Name	Yr.	Pos.	A	SPD	REB	DE	BLK	LP	PE	BH	P	WE	ST	DU	FT	TOT
Clarence Beedle	So.	PG	76	75	1	99	2	24	70	68	64	84	85	25	C-	673

Are you saying that he's not?  Or is this more of a "look at me, look at me, look how good my player is" post?  Because you know he's an exceptional defender for D2.

That's undoubtedly a not-so-humble brag.

There's #humblebrag... and then there's just #brag.

Posted by llamanunts on 6/7/2012 10:12:00 AM (view original):

Posted by Trentonjoe on 6/7/2012 9:23:00 AM (view original):
I'd say below average..I consider a combined 210 in SPD, ATH and DEF to be the low end of good on the defensive spectrum for perimeter players.  I consider a combined 240 exceptional.  To be as low as 180, he would need to be a pretty effective scorer for me to play him. 

I wanted him to run point by the time he was a Junior.  Doesn't look good for that now - he looks more like a career backup.  I rolled the dice, hoping that average D might get him up around 60.

I recruit using the aejones method....defense first.  Most of the time.

I try to make sure I have 9-10 superior defensive players on my teams at all times.   This leaves me 1-2 spots for RS/ineligible and then 1 or 2 "special players".

I consider a SPECIAL player a PG (80+ PASS and 80+ BH) and then a scoring guard (80+ PER or 50+ LP with good FT).   

It doesn't always work out that way...

I was actually somewhat serious there.  His speed is a little lower than I would like in a guard ... as are, actually, all of my guards right now.  But as you say - really can't complain, especially since he was the fallback position ... and ended up better than the guy I was aiming at.

But on a separate note - what would your 'formula' be for a post defender, and do you consider SF defenders to have a defensive formula more akin to Posts or guards?

And are you one of those that discounts shot blocking entirely(Which I see with some) Or is it valued?

 

For a DII post defender I look for 70 ATH and 70 DEF.....I kinda half *** look at SB...If it is good I value it, if it isn't I ignore it....I guess my formula would be 

ATH+DEF+(SB-70)  if that is over 140 I am happy...it is over 160, I figure I have a GREAT defensive low post guy.

I treat the SF as if he were a guard, usually ONE of my guards has like a 30 REB, and it's not like people routinely get 10+ rpg from the 3 position.   

I should add to all of this that I am no superstar at this game.

'sallright.  Not claiming to be myself.  Just interested in seeing other people's thought processes.  Won't always agree, but sometimes can make me think differently about what I am doing.