Posted by tecwrg on 6/4/2012 3:51:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:40:00 PM (view original):
Methinks somebody needs to look up "tradition".

Or at least stop spitting in it's face.

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 3:52:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:40:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 1:38:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 1:35:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 1:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 1:19:00 PM (view original):
1.  So you agree that this is a false statement?  "If a gay person remains single, they will still need health care."  

The increased cost comes with being added to a spouse's company insurance.

2.  I think it will.  You seemed to think that drug use and/or suicide would not.   Remember?  I called you a moron for your mentally deficient stance on legalizing both on the grounds that it doesn't affect anyone else.

1. Last I checked there is no "free coverage for spouses" from insurance companies.  They still charge premium.  It's up to the employer to decide how much of the cost they choose to pay for spousal coverage.

There is nothing false about the statement.  Everyone in their lifetime will need health care of some sort.  Everybody gets sick.

2.  I said suicide should be legal without commenting on its affect on others.  You made the argument that it affects others.  I agree it does affect others and is therefore not analogous to gay marriage.

1.  Try getting independent health coverage.  Compare the cost of being added to your spouse's company coverage and get back to me.

Maybe.  But the guy with no insurance will be responsible for his visits out of pocket.

2.   Then why were you for legalizing suicide?

1.  Yes, for two reasons.  You're getting a group rate and it is often subsidized by the employer.

2. Because I think terminally ill people should be able to end their life when they are in pain.

1.  So you agree that healthcare costs would go up because the gay spouse has coverage from his significant other's employer?

2.  If you successfully kill yourself, I don't think it matters if it's legal or not.    It's those who suck at suicide who need to be discouraged from trying it.

1. Why would healthcare costs go up because someone is married?

2.  You brought up suicide.  Do I need to show you the link?

mike: suicide doesn't affect anyone
me: I'm ok with legalizing suicide
mike: what??? legalizing suicide will result in taxpayers taking care of people who try and fail
me: um, ok. I guess it does affect others and isn't relevant to the gay marriage discussion.

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 3:54:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 6/4/2012 3:51:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:40:00 PM (view original):
Methinks somebody needs to look up "tradition".

Or at least stop spitting in it's face.

If the tradition is so great, and so deep seated in our culture, shouldn't it survive just fine?  No one is outlawing straight marriage.  Just including others in the tradition.

Definition of TRADITION

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:56:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 3:52:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:40:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 1:38:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 1:35:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 1:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 1:19:00 PM (view original):
1.  So you agree that this is a false statement?  "If a gay person remains single, they will still need health care."  

The increased cost comes with being added to a spouse's company insurance.

2.  I think it will.  You seemed to think that drug use and/or suicide would not.   Remember?  I called you a moron for your mentally deficient stance on legalizing both on the grounds that it doesn't affect anyone else.

1. Last I checked there is no "free coverage for spouses" from insurance companies.  They still charge premium.  It's up to the employer to decide how much of the cost they choose to pay for spousal coverage.

There is nothing false about the statement.  Everyone in their lifetime will need health care of some sort.  Everybody gets sick.

2.  I said suicide should be legal without commenting on its affect on others.  You made the argument that it affects others.  I agree it does affect others and is therefore not analogous to gay marriage.

1.  Try getting independent health coverage.  Compare the cost of being added to your spouse's company coverage and get back to me.

Maybe.  But the guy with no insurance will be responsible for his visits out of pocket.

2.   Then why were you for legalizing suicide?

1.  Yes, for two reasons.  You're getting a group rate and it is often subsidized by the employer.

2. Because I think terminally ill people should be able to end their life when they are in pain.

1.  So you agree that healthcare costs would go up because the gay spouse has coverage from his significant other's employer?

2.  If you successfully kill yourself, I don't think it matters if it's legal or not.    It's those who suck at suicide who need to be discouraged from trying it.

1. Why would healthcare costs go up because someone is married?

2.  You brought up suicide.  Do I need to show you the link?

mike: suicide doesn't affect anyone
me: I'm ok with legalizing suicide
mike: what??? legalizing suicide will result in taxpayers taking care of people who try and fail
me: um, ok. I guess it does affect others and isn't relevant to the gay marriage discussion.

1.  Because they're now eligible to piggyback on their spouse's insurance(which you agreed would be cheaper because it's subsidized by their employer).   Single people can't do that.  Duh.

2.    You seemed to think SSM, drug use and suicide do not affect anyone else.  Therefore, from your previous posts, they should be individual, untouchable rights.  I disagree.

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:56:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 3:54:00 PM (view original):

Posted by tecwrg on 6/4/2012 3:51:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:40:00 PM (view original):
Methinks somebody needs to look up "tradition".

Or at least stop spitting in it's face.

If the tradition is so great, and so deep seated in our culture, shouldn't it survive just fine?  No one is outlawing straight marriage.  Just including others in the tradition.

Definition of TRADITION

1

a : an inherited, established, or customary pattern of thought, action, or behavior (as a religious practice or a social custom) b : a belief or story or a body of beliefs or stories relating to the past that are commonly accepted as historical though not verifiable

2

: the handing down of information, beliefs, and customs by word of mouth or by example from one generation to another without written instruction

3

: cultural continuity in social attitudes, customs, and institutions

4

: characteristic manner, method, or style <in the best liberal tradition>

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 3:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:56:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 3:52:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 3:40:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 1:38:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 1:35:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 1:29:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 1:19:00 PM (view original):
1.  So you agree that this is a false statement?  "If a gay person remains single, they will still need health care."  

The increased cost comes with being added to a spouse's company insurance.

2.  I think it will.  You seemed to think that drug use and/or suicide would not.   Remember?  I called you a moron for your mentally deficient stance on legalizing both on the grounds that it doesn't affect anyone else.

1. Last I checked there is no "free coverage for spouses" from insurance companies.  They still charge premium.  It's up to the employer to decide how much of the cost they choose to pay for spousal coverage.

There is nothing false about the statement.  Everyone in their lifetime will need health care of some sort.  Everybody gets sick.

2.  I said suicide should be legal without commenting on its affect on others.  You made the argument that it affects others.  I agree it does affect others and is therefore not analogous to gay marriage.

1.  Try getting independent health coverage.  Compare the cost of being added to your spouse's company coverage and get back to me.

Maybe.  But the guy with no insurance will be responsible for his visits out of pocket.

2.   Then why were you for legalizing suicide?

1.  Yes, for two reasons.  You're getting a group rate and it is often subsidized by the employer.

2. Because I think terminally ill people should be able to end their life when they are in pain.

1.  So you agree that healthcare costs would go up because the gay spouse has coverage from his significant other's employer?

2.  If you successfully kill yourself, I don't think it matters if it's legal or not.    It's those who suck at suicide who need to be discouraged from trying it.

1. Why would healthcare costs go up because someone is married?

2.  You brought up suicide.  Do I need to show you the link?

mike: suicide doesn't affect anyone
me: I'm ok with legalizing suicide
mike: what??? legalizing suicide will result in taxpayers taking care of people who try and fail
me: um, ok. I guess it does affect others and isn't relevant to the gay marriage discussion.

1.  Because they're now eligible to piggyback on their spouse's insurance(which you agreed would be cheaper because it's subsidized by their employer).   Single people can't do that.  Duh.

2.    You seemed to think SSM, drug use and suicide do not affect anyone else.  Therefore, from your previous posts, they should be individual, untouchable rights.  I disagree.

But it's up to the employer whether or not they subsidize spousal coverage.  That isn't a gay marriage issue, just an employer choice issue.  The cost of healthcare won't go up for anyone that doesn't want it to.

I never argued that suicide doesn't affect anyone.  You did.  Then three posts later you argued that it does affect others.  If you want to have an argument with yourself, fine, you don't have to include me in it.

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 11:06:00 AM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 11:00:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 10:58:00 AM (view original):
What interest do you have in SSM?

They want to. Since allowing it doesn't harm me or anyone else, I'm not going to tell someone else how to live their life.

Same can be said for drug use or suicide.   Legalize both?

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 11:18:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 11:16:00 AM (view original):
Seems like a pretty small sample size. 

Anyway, should we legalize drug use and suicide since neither would have any affect on others?

Wait, so what's your sample size for the big increase in benefit payments?

I think we should legalize drug use and suicide.

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 11:31:00 AM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 11:18:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 11:16:00 AM (view original):
Seems like a pretty small sample size. 

Anyway, should we legalize drug use and suicide since neither would have any affect on others?

Wait, so what's your sample size for the big increase in benefit payments?

I think we should legalize drug use and suicide.

Well, since married folk are eligible for benefits from their spouse, it stands to reason that allowing another subset of society to marry will increase payouts.   No?

Fair enough.  You're a moron but I think most of us felt that way already.    I know I want to be killed by some guy legally tweaking on meth and/or pay medical bills for years on people who can't quite get suicide right.

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 1:19:00 PM (view original):
1.  So you agree that this is a false statement?  "If a gay person remains single, they will still need health care."  

The increased cost comes with being added to a spouse's company insurance.

2.  I think it will.  You seemed to think that drug use and/or suicide would not.   Remember?  I called you a moron for your mentally deficient stance on legalizing both on the grounds that it doesn't affect anyone else.

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 4:16:00 PM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 11:06:00 AM (view original):

Posted by jrd_x on 6/4/2012 11:00:00 AM (view original):

Posted by MikeT23 on 6/4/2012 10:58:00 AM (view original):
What interest do you have in SSM?

They want to. Since allowing it doesn't harm me or anyone else, I'm not going to tell someone else how to live their life.

Same can be said for drug use or suicide.   Legalize both?

This is the post where you brought up suicide, saying that it doesn't harm anyone else.

Get it now?   Build government suicide houses?    Plunk down your money and have Uncle Sam oversee your suicide?