Brilliant or dirty? Topic

MikeT23
Posts: 58012 (0)
Hall of Famer
87 1 47 1 189
Prospect
Truth is, I don't trade Carter for Polonia if not for the extenuating circumstances.   I don't even consider it.   Polonia has a season and a half of "meh" and a good season on his resume'.    Carter has been well above average his entire career.
7/16/2015 10:37 AM
willsauve
Posts: 2255 (0)
Hall of Famer
168 1 1 1 200
Prospect
Posted by hockey1984 on 7/16/2015 8:45:00 AM (view original):
People do it to themselves. The person who made you the deal gave you waaaay too much.

I see someone say 'I meant to put those guys on the block' I respond with 'I made a claim but I'm not sure I will get them. Here is an offer below market value. Take it or leave it'.

Owners love to compete against each other and shoot themselves in the foot. I think this move is brilliant because it's a gamble. You could have lost both players and gotten nothing in return. I'm guessing it's the owner of Colorado that is made at you because they got taken?
I like the SP better than the LF.. 
7/16/2015 10:54 AM
bighead34
Posts: 143 (0)
Hall of Famer
1 78
Prospect
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2015 10:37:00 AM (view original):
Truth is, I don't trade Carter for Polonia if not for the extenuating circumstances.   I don't even consider it.   Polonia has a season and a half of "meh" and a good season on his resume'.    Carter has been well above average his entire career.
the average obp/slg in the AL in your world has been pretty much .320/.400, which makes carter look pretty squarely average, especially when taking into account his pitcher friendly ballpark in Florida...polonia career mark is already slightly above average even with those "meh" seasons, but his ballpark drags him down to average as well, however considering how small his sample is still, i would bet that he'll post considerably better numbers going forward based on his ratings...worst case scenario from your standpoint is that they are equally valuable pieces on the field, but once you take into account their contract situations, i find it impossible to believe you didn't win this trade whether you realize it or not
7/16/2015 11:30 AM
hockey1984
Posts: 2748 (0)
Hall of Famer
1 1 7 172 106 3 108
Prospect
I don't know about win, but I look at the deal, a young fielding prospect who looks pretty good and will play at least another 10 years for a 30 year old pitcher who's lifetime ERA is above 4. That's a deal that I would make without the owner being handcuffed.

For a guy going through waivers, I'd offer you a bench and setup guy and I'd take the salary. Nothing more.

But then, each world has it's own odd quirks.

In Reily I just say a 30 year old 30-30 RF go for a max contract and a SP3 get 77 million over 5 years.
7/16/2015 11:43 AM (edited)
joshkvt
Posts: 6200 (0)
Hall of Famer
664 99
All Star
I was splitting hairs, which is why I said I could be persuaded it's not dirty abnd that even if it were, it wouldn't rise to the level of being worth caring about. If that's the biggest problem an owner sees in a world, it's damn sure a world worth staying in. I never pay attention to the commentary anyway. If someone posts a player as available, his ratings matter and the rationale does not.
7/16/2015 11:44 AM (edited)
MikeT23
Posts: 58012 (0)
Hall of Famer
87 1 47 1 189
Prospect
Posted by hockey1984 on 7/16/2015 11:43:00 AM (view original):
I don't know about win, but I look at the deal, a young fielding prospect who looks pretty good and will play at least another 10 years for a 30 year old pitcher who's lifetime ERA is above 4. That's a deal that I would make without the owner being handcuffed.

For a guy going through waivers, I'd offer you a bench and setup guy and I'd take the salary. Nothing more.

But then, each world has it's own odd quirks.

In Reily I just say a 30 year old 30-30 RF go for a max contract and a SP3 get 77 million over 5 years.
Huh?

Polonia is 27 and not really much of a fielder.  The fact that he is 27 with only 1300 AB indicates that I'm not the only one thinking he's nothing special.  A season and a half of sub .310 OBP and sub .400 SLG doesn't look like LF #s to me.   And he had a good season.   The fact that he's LH with a high VR gives him value but he looks like a 2 arb guy to me.

Carter is 30 with more than 1500 better than league average innings.   In one of the better "pitching" worlds, where 1.3/4.00 is average, he surpasses that almost every season.   Being a pitcher, he'll hold his ratings for another 7-8 years.    Polonia will have been retired for a couple of seasons before Carter can't pitch 180 innings a season. 

IMO, I lost that deal in a vacuum.   The fact that it allowed to me offer The Great Jimmy Powell a max deal, that he signed, is a HUGE win for me.
7/16/2015 12:01 PM
mbriese
Posts: 1091 (0)
Hall of Famer
227 75 121
Prospect
Posted by MikeT23 on 7/16/2015 9:37:00 AM (view original):
That said, I'm sure the 11 who have voted "dirty" are 100% truthful in trade talks.   Never try to sell their turd as better than he is.   Saints, they are.   Saints, I say!!!
Oh, I always try and give the hard sell about players I'm trading (ex: "with his makeup he should still have 4 or 5 good seasons left"), but I use the same information that they already have - it's not like I can lie and say "don't trust his statistics - this guy actually bat .350 and hit 60 HRs last season!". I guess it's irrelevant if it didn't affect the trade in the end anyways, but I think there's a big difference between lying outright and trying to talk up one of your players.
7/16/2015 12:16 PM
MikeT23
Posts: 58012 (0)
Hall of Famer
87 1 47 1 189
Prospect

The lie wasn't about the players.  It was about how they ended up on the WW.    My guess is it plays out the same way if I had said "I waived these two guys.   If I get a decent offer, I'll accept at 3 PM today."    But, IMO, that doesn't create the same situation.   Saying I screwed up made it sound, to me, that I was desperate to get something in return.  Truth is, I just about lied twice.   When I got the Polonia offer, much better than the 4 I rejected, I almost accepted it immediately because I was afraid someone would figure it out and the offer would be pulled.

One owner called bullshit and said he knew exactly what I was doing.  I called bullshit and said he'd have outed me if he did.   Only he really knows.

7/16/2015 12:28 PM
willsauve
Posts: 2255 (0)
Hall of Famer
168 1 1 1 200
Prospect
You didnt do anything wrong.. I think the only thing you did that was bad was perhaps brag about how clever you thought you were.. The people complaining are probably just bitter that they didnt get to sign the SP.. 
7/16/2015 1:33 PM
willsauve
Posts: 2255 (0)
Hall of Famer
168 1 1 1 200
Prospect
I just read some of you world chat.. I dont agree with the main complainers opinion that since you're the commish you shouldnt be able to use the world chat for deception.. The commish is entitled to the same WC usage as anyone else,  just because you get $5 and spend time recruiting, you shouldnt  have a world chat disadvantage.. 
7/16/2015 1:38 PM
MikeT23
Posts: 58012 (0)
Hall of Famer
87 1 47 1 189
Prospect

Well, I bragged because I got half a dozen "Hahaha!!! You moron!!!  I'm gonna claim your players!!!!" responses.   I deemed it necessary to say "IN YOUR BIG, STUPID FACE!!!!" once I completed the deal. 

The only reason I seriously addressed it, I agree with you in that the commish is also an owner who shouldn't restrict himself as long as he's not harming the world, is because he was a Season 1 owner.   If he felt I gained an "advantage", it had to be addressed.   I don't feel I gained an advantage but needed to make that clear. 

7/16/2015 2:04 PM
willsauve
Posts: 2255 (0)
Hall of Famer
168 1 1 1 200
Prospect
In all likelihood the guy was probably already going to leave and now he's going to use this as his reason to leave..
7/16/2015 2:08 PM
MikeT23
Posts: 58012 (0)
Hall of Famer
87 1 47 1 189
Prospect
Well, he's probably going to miss the MWR but that's why I offered to send him a GC and replace him.   First, if an owner is "uncomfortable" in a world I commish, I'd prefer to make him "comfortable" or buy him out.   Second, if an owner doesn't care how he performs down the stretch, I don't want him.    If he's lame duck with 30 games left whether it's losing or indifference because he's leaving, that's bad for the world. 
7/16/2015 2:28 PM
jamier2003
Posts: 208 (0)
Hall of Famer
14 172 34 213 2
Prospect
I'm going with a MikeT ism:  If you have to ask the question then you know the answer.  
7/16/2015 3:04 PM
MikeT23
Posts: 58012 (0)
Hall of Famer
87 1 47 1 189
Prospect
Yeah, the answer is "brilliant". 
7/16/2015 3:16 PM
◂ Prev 123456 Next ▸
Brilliant or dirty? Topic
△Top△Bottom

Search Criteria

Terms of Use Customer Support Privacy Statement

© 1999-2026 WhatIfSports.com, Inc. All rights reserved. WhatIfSports is a trademark of WhatIfSports.com, Inc. SimLeague, SimMatchup and iSimNow are trademarks or registered trademarks of Electronic Arts, Inc. Used under license. The names of actual companies and products mentioned herein may be the trademarks of their respective owners.