What payroll structure do you use and why? Topic

dedelman
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0 adv and 20 training are given.  Medical will be 13 +/- 1, and coaches 10 +/- 1 (depends on whether the FC re-signs, but I will always bust my *** to get a good one).  Either HS or COL wil be 18 +/- 2 (my choice is COL, but I inherited a team with 20 HS and I've rolled with it OK).

At this point I ask the question, am I competing for a title, or am I tanking rebuilding?  If I am destined to suck rebuilding to where I expect a top 10 draft pick next season then I'll bump the other one of HS/COL up 4; otherwise it's at zero, or I drop it 4 from where it is.  After that, I determine how much salary money I need to field the team I want, and put the rest into prospects and INTL. I first put 6 into prospects because I have to, then I boost INTL to 6 so I am reasonably likely to see at least 2-3 solid INTLs, then I run prospect up to 20, then the remainder goes into INTL.

It's a consistent process, but it leads to a wide variety of budgets, with salary ranging from $70 - $110M.
9/28/2010 5:00 PM
deanod
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Posted by iain on 9/28/2010 4:55:00 PM (view original):
Dino was talking about having 2/3 budgeted, which is a complete waste of time.
Well, you can't go from 10/10 to 0/0 overnight.

And 15/0 is likely better than 7/8- you see the same (or maybe a few less, I'm not sure) prospects with more accurate projections.  The only issue is that if you underperform and get a top 10 pick the following season, I'd take 11/12 over 19/0, but I guess it's not a huge difference.
9/28/2010 5:01 PM
MikeT23
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Posted by shobob on 9/28/2010 4:56:00 PM (view original):
1 is better than 0 I'd say.

I'd rather have 0 gators chewing on my leg than 1 gator chewing on my legs.   I guess it depends on the situation.

9/28/2010 5:02 PM
iain
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In terms of value, I think that $1M in payroll or in training/medical is better than HS or college scouting.

I tend to think the value of each interval decreases as you get lower, and increases as you get higher.

The difference from 18 to 20 for me is more significant than the difference from 6 to 8.

I might be waaaaaaaaay off, but that's my reasoning.
9/28/2010 5:05 PM
iain
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Posted by deanod on 9/28/2010 5:01:00 PM (view original):
Posted by iain on 9/28/2010 4:55:00 PM (view original):
Dino was talking about having 2/3 budgeted, which is a complete waste of time.
Well, you can't go from 10/10 to 0/0 overnight.

And 15/0 is likely better than 7/8- you see the same (or maybe a few less, I'm not sure) prospects with more accurate projections.  The only issue is that if you underperform and get a top 10 pick the following season, I'd take 11/12 over 19/0, but I guess it's not a huge difference.
For reasons stated above, I'd much prefer 19/0... and I'm actually running something like that in one world... maybe two.

EDIT: And for a Top 10 pick, I'd much rather have accurate projections to deal with.... maybe fewer players, but better information on which to base my decision.
9/28/2010 5:11 PM (edited)
iain
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Posted by MikeT23 on 9/28/2010 5:02:00 PM (view original):
Posted by shobob on 9/28/2010 4:56:00 PM (view original):
1 is better than 0 I'd say.

I'd rather have 0 gators chewing on my leg than 1 gator chewing on my legs.   I guess it depends on the situation.

For we non-gator hunters in cold climates, your analogy seems strange and random.
9/28/2010 5:09 PM
mhulshult
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Posted by iain on 9/28/2010 5:05:00 PM (view original):
In terms of value, I think that $1M in payroll or in training/medical is better than HS or college scouting.

I tend to think the value of each interval decreases as you get lower, and increases as you get higher.

The difference from 18 to 20 for me is more significant than the difference from 6 to 8.

I might be waaaaaaaaay off, but that's my reasoning.
I get what you're saying (because I feel the same way), but I think that's just a perception.  When you go from 6 to 8 you're thinking "well, it's still a crappy amount, so that 2MM didn't get me anywhere," but when you go from 18 to 20, it feels more productive because 20 is as high as you can go.  If the max were 25, I'm guessing you wouldn't feel the same as you do about the move from 18 to 20.  Or maybe I'm the one who's way off.
9/28/2010 5:10 PM
iain
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Posted by mhulshult on 9/28/2010 5:10:00 PM (view original):
Posted by iain on 9/28/2010 5:05:00 PM (view original):
In terms of value, I think that $1M in payroll or in training/medical is better than HS or college scouting.

I tend to think the value of each interval decreases as you get lower, and increases as you get higher.

The difference from 18 to 20 for me is more significant than the difference from 6 to 8.

I might be waaaaaaaaay off, but that's my reasoning.
I get what you're saying (because I feel the same way), but I think that's just a perception.  When you go from 6 to 8 you're thinking "well, it's still a crappy amount, so that 2MM didn't get me anywhere," but when you go from 18 to 20, it feels more productive because 20 is as high as you can go.  If the max were 25, I'm guessing you wouldn't feel the same as you do about the move from 18 to 20.  Or maybe I'm the one who's way off.
I think we're on the same page here... maybe it's because of their insistance that ratings are percentiles that I'm getting hung up on outliers, bell curves, and such.....?

I guess I'm trying to say that 6 gets you crap, 8  is still crap, 10 might not be totally useless,, but 12 is starting to get mildly useful (in terms of scouting, mostly).  I tend to start trusting projections over current + my gut feeling somewhere around 14.
9/28/2010 5:14 PM
shobob
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Posted by iain on 9/28/2010 5:05:00 PM (view original):
In terms of value, I think that $1M in payroll or in training/medical is better than HS or college scouting.

I tend to think the value of each interval decreases as you get lower, and increases as you get higher.

The difference from 18 to 20 for me is more significant than the difference from 6 to 8.

I might be waaaaaaaaay off, but that's my reasoning.
I say 1 is better than 0 for IFA, col and HS scouting because it's the difference between seeing some players and seeing NONE, and I find you can make a somewhat reasonable guess as to the player's future value based on current ratings.
9/28/2010 5:19 PM
deathinahole
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Ah, but that's where the bell curve Q comes in.

Are you seeing 5% (straight line) or are you seeing 2ish% (bell curve) with a 1 budget?

If the latter, then the cutoff should be 10 (assuming a symetrical curve).

I don't pretend to know the answer. I'm lucky I knew that.
9/28/2010 5:24 PM
iain
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Posted by shobob on 9/28/2010 5:21:00 PM (view original):
Posted by iain on 9/28/2010 5:05:00 PM (view original):
In terms of value, I think that $1M in payroll or in training/medical is better than HS or college scouting.

I tend to think the value of each interval decreases as you get lower, and increases as you get higher.

The difference from 18 to 20 for me is more significant than the difference from 6 to 8.

I might be waaaaaaaaay off, but that's my reasoning.
I say 1 is better than 0 for IFA, col and HS scouting because it's the difference between seeing some players and seeing NONE, and I find you can make a somewhat reasonable guess as to the player's future value based on current ratings.
1 in IFA is just a tease.  I don't bother with IFA unless I have money to burn.

I'll buy it a bit for HS/college... but I'll rarely zero both at the same time, so I can't say what happens.  I'll zero one of the two plenty, tho, and I don't think it's a big deal.
9/28/2010 5:24 PM
iain
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Posted by deathinahole on 9/28/2010 5:24:00 PM (view original):
Ah, but that's where the bell curve Q comes in.

Are you seeing 5% (straight line) or are you seeing 2ish% (bell curve) with a 1 budget?

If the latter, then the cutoff should be 10 (assuming a symetrical curve).

I don't pretend to know the answer. I'm lucky I knew that.
I'm looking at it as I'm either in the meaty part of the curve while hedging or in transition, at the bottom end where the info is all but useless, or at the top where I'm getting a maximum return.
9/28/2010 5:26 PM
deathinahole
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That, oddly, makes we want to ravage my wife tonight.
9/28/2010 5:29 PM
tecwrg
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Posted by deathinahole on 9/28/2010 5:29:00 PM (view original):
That, oddly, makes we want to ravage my wife tonight.
You misspelled "moose".
9/28/2010 5:32 PM
deathinahole
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I have no idea why you'd want a moose to ravage my wife, you sick, demented jackass.
9/28/2010 5:33 PM
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What payroll structure do you use and why? Topic
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