Silver Slugger Rant Topic

Jtpsops
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I need to get this off my chest, because I think it's absolutly ridiculous that Silver Sluggers are awarded purely based on RC/27 and park factor.

I just had a player, Carl Riley, lose the SS to Lance Wirth in Upper Deck. Riley has HUGE leads over Wirth in 2B, HR, RBI, XBH and SLG, and moderate leads in runs, OPS and RC. But because Wirth has a higher RC/27 and plays in a more pitcher friendly ballpark, he automatically wins. It baffles me as to how, in determining a slugging award, they seem to exclude EVERY statistical category that has to do with slugging. I can see considering park factor, but RC/27 takes into account singles and steals, which have nothing to do with slugging. And how are HR, XBH and SLG not even factors for a slugging award?

Again, I know I'm ranting here, but it just seems to be an absolutely ridiculous selection criteria.

7/8/2012 8:31 PM
details5252
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You are aware that the Silver Slugger goes (in theory) to the best offensive player and has nothing to do with Slugging Percentage, right?
7/8/2012 8:40 PM
Jtpsops
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Yeah, I got off track a bit in my focus there. Point is, how do you look at one stat in determining who the best player at a position is? Maybe I'm ranting more against the RC stat itself than the choosing of the award, but Wirth had almost 200 fewer ABs than Riley, and Riley had significant leads in all the categories I listed. It just seems really bizarre to me to claim that Wirth is the better offensive player. This is why I'm not a stat geek - you cannot crunch a player's overall value into one stat. Just doesn't work.
7/8/2012 8:51 PM
tomhighway
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Isn't the creation of runs important?
7/8/2012 8:53 PM
tedwmoore
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You know that XBH, slug percentage, OPS, RC, and everything else you listed as evidence of your guy's dominance are stats, right?
7/8/2012 8:54 PM
Jtpsops
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You know I mentioned like 10 different stat categories and not just one, right? I said you can't reduce a players value to one stat...and then I named 10 stat categories, 7 of which Riley is leading Wirth in (and by no small margin). I would argue the RC formula is severely flawed.
7/8/2012 8:59 PM (edited)
Jtpsops
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Posted by tomhighway on 7/8/2012 8:53:00 PM (view original):
Isn't the creation of runs important?
Of course it is. But RC doesn't take lineup into consideration.

What good are singles and SB if the guys around you aren't driving you in? It just so happens that Wirth is playing on a much better offensive team than Riley. So Wirth gets credit for playing in a pitchers park, but Riley gets no credit for playing with fewer tools around him.

I'll take 60+ HR and 135 RBI over a singles/SB guy any day of the week.
7/8/2012 8:57 PM
tedwmoore
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The more stat categories you mention, the more of a stat geek you appear to be. You see what I am driving at here?
7/8/2012 8:58 PM
Jtpsops
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No, I don't. Stat geeks are always after the super stat - trying to crunch a players value into one all encompassing number. Obviously in HBD, you have to go by stats since we can't "watch" the players play. But I'm not trying to reduce anyone's value to one number. Anyone who looks at their stat lines can see in about .0001 seconds that Riley had the better offensive year, and I guarantee 98% of owners out there would rather have Riley's season than Wirth's.
7/8/2012 9:00 PM
details5252
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Dude, they have the same OPS but Wirth's OBP is 40 points higher and he has 45 more SB (with only 2 more CS). Wirth was the better offensive player. Riley had 150 more PA. That's his only advantage
7/8/2012 9:01 PM
tedwmoore
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In other words, being a stat geek has nothing to do with praising one stat above all others, and in fact that is the opposite approach advocated by saber metrics. Some might be more valuable than others, but elevating one stat above all others is nit the defining characteristic of being a stat geek. Also, when people say things like "I am not a stat geek" and then rattle off a ton of stats to support their argument, I laugh a bit to myself.
7/8/2012 9:01 PM
jsturgis5866
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Riley wasn't eligible for the LF award because he is assigned to 1B. And it's RC, not RC27 that's used.

It looks like owner error to me.
7/8/2012 9:03 PM
Jtpsops
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So Wirth's edge in Walks (21) and Steals (45) is worth more than Riley's edge in Doubles (10) and HRs (27)?

7/8/2012 9:03 PM
Jtpsops
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Posted by jsturgis5866 on 7/8/2012 9:03:00 PM (view original):
Riley wasn't eligible for the LF award because he is assigned to 1B. And it's RC, not RC27 that's used.

It looks like owner error to me.
Incorrect. Riley and Wirth have been flipflopping for the last few weeks under LF SS in the Awards page. Riley was also an All-Star in LF.
7/8/2012 9:04 PM
tedwmoore
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Yeah, I didn't even look at the players.

Player A: 291/357/632 with 15/2 SB/CS
Player B: 300/396/590 with 60/4 SB/CS

Then mention this:

Player A: bats left in Arizona
Player B: bats right in San Francisco
7/8/2012 9:06 PM
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