How big of an impact is poor pitch quality? Im looking at a guy who looks pretty good, but his pitchs are all too low for comfort...

Relief pitcher with
90 control
70 durability
50 against ies
60 against righties

but his pitches are
65,56,44

Is he a AAAA guy or do you think he can do something in the big league level?

I believe he's a AAAA guy but I already told you that

He'll get blistered.

his splits alone make him a long relief b guy. adding his pitches only makes him worse

Quote: Originally Posted By sergei91 on 11/30/2009his splits alone make him a long relief b guy. adding his pitches only makes him wors

70 durability implies that he probably has a low stamina, which means he's a short reliever instead of a long reliever.

If he had long reliever durability/stamina, he'd probably be fine as a mopup pitcher, eating innings in blowouts.

30 stamina

Yeah. As a short reliever, he's crap.

agreed. not big league talent.

If he had a 90+ pitch, and an 80+ pitch, to go with that 90 controll, I would actuyally like him quite a bit, but those horribly low pitches combined with the low splits make him a career minor leauger for sure.

Quote: Originally posted by pieo on 12/01/2009If he had a 90+ pitch, and an 80+ pitch, to go with that 90 controll, I would actuyally like him quite a bit, but those horribly low pitches combined with the low splits make him a career minor leauger for sure.

Really? You would like a guy with a 90+ pitch and an 80+ pitch with 90 control? Why would you ever let anyone know your trade secrets?

I dont understand how a guy can be decent against ies and righties but have crappy pitches...alternatively I dont understand how a guy can be crappy against ies and righties but have great pitches

vsL and vsR and pitches are numbers slapped on to a bag of generally unquantifiable things. A guy can have a hot fastball or a Zito-esque curve (high pitch values), but if the fastball's flat, or the arm action with the curve is a clear tell, or the pitcher doesn't hide either, the great "stuff" of that pitch goes to waste.

In the same way, a pitcher that doesn't have great individual pitches can still be effective with great command and knowledge of pitching (G Maddux is an extreme example).

A.J. Burnett is a guy I can think of off the top of my head who would have a 90+ pitch (curveball) and a 75 or 80+ pitch (fastball) who is only a good-but-not-great pitcher because, at times, he doesn't work the edges of the strike zone and leaves good-looking pitches out over the middle and they still get hit hard.

Edwin Jackson also, especially earlier in his career seemed to have awesome stuff but would get hit hard.

Cliff Lee would be an example of a pitcher that doesn't have any great individual pitches but rarely serves up an easy one to drive. Greinke seems like a guy like this as well, although I haven't seen as much as him. His stuff seems good, but never as amazing as Lincecum or Verlander, etc.... but yet he's just as good or better than those guys.

You can be a perfectly good pitcher with those pitches-- but not with those pitches and those way-below-ML-average splits.

That said, I might roll the dice on him as an SuB if he had 100 GB/FB and a minimum salary, with the expectation of an ERA in the mid-to-high 4s; few walks and no homers can compensate for a pretty high OAV.

I could see two situations where that guy should be on an ML roster.

1.) As an injury fill-in.
2.) If he's 90+ in both GB/FB and Velocity and he has 30+ stamina he could be an 11th or 12th pitcher, set as a Mop-Up to eat some innings or as a last resort in extra innings. He could probably pitch to a low 5's ERA.

The problem is that he won't strike anybody out, so if you have a ****** defense behind him you don't stand a chance.