I have two teams in Phelan D1, one made the PIT, one made the NT.

These teams are all in the same tourney together - Kentucky, Connecticut, Duke, Kansas, Cal, Florida, Purdue, Illinois, Wake Forest, Pitt, Memphis - wanna guess which one?

Indeed, the PIT.

Did a brief look at the top 32 teams in the NT (1-8 seeds)- of those 32, around 11 or so (excluding my own, Houston) are what you might call non-traditional NT schools, non-power conference schools. Of those 11 schools 8 run press or press combo (based on IQ), 3 don't press.

Draw your own conclusions...

That a lot of teams run press?

This means nothing unless you know how many teams run press overall.

Well is it that press is overpowering? or is it that the best coaches have found Press easier to recruit for?

Also, it could have something to do with how recruits max out in Speed most of the time. I would like to think that once the new recruit generation that is being worked on in the Beta is done that Speed will be reduced.

Once only certain teams have fast players possibly the number of press teams will go down?

Quote: Originally posted by isack24 on 1/07/2010That a lot of teams run press?This means nothing unless you know how many teams run press overall.

Well he is getting at the BEST teams run press though, meaning that possibly press is over valued.

Quote: Originally Posted By schroedess26 on 1/07/2010

Quote: Originally posted by isack24 on 1/07/2010
That a lot of teams run press?

This means nothing unless you know how many teams run press overall.

Well he is getting at the BEST teams run press though, meaning that possibly press is over valued

Not necessarily.

If 8 of 11 teams generally run press, and 8 of 11 teams that he looked at in the NT run press, then that's not indicative of anything.

isack, thanks for your theoretical sampling lesson in case any of us dont understand how the basic world works.

I don't know why you're taking offense. Schroedess apparently didn't understand, so I was responding to him. Your annoyance with the press is well-documented, and you might be right about all of it, but your original post doesn't support your assertion without more information.

Get pissy if you want, but that's just the way it is.

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Perhaps it's indicative of people overstating the effectiveness of the press, but not necessarily that the press is more effective. If a majority of the Senate thinks the health care bill is a good idea, does that actually make it a good idea?

Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, but that number, without anything else, means nothing more than that a lot of people run press.

Quote: Originally posted by isack24 on 1/07/2010I don't know why you're taking offense.  Schroedess apparently didn't understand, so I was responding to him.  Your annoyance with the press is well-documented, and you might be right about all of it, but your original post doesn't support your assertion without more information.Get pissy if you want, but that's just the way it is.

VD is very sensitive about the press. don't take it personally ;)

Haha, I know he is. I probably shouldn't have said anything. Personally, I have no idea if the press is overly-effective. It probably is (although I've never had a serious problem playing against it in D2/D3 - but it has forced me to recruit more passing than I otherwise would have). I just think that everyone started playing it because people thought it was some magic defense, which has led to A LOT of people playing it, even if it isn't doing anything for them.

Quote: Originally posted by isack24 on 1/07/2010Perhaps it's indicative of people overstating the effectiveness of the press, but not necessarily that the press is more effective.  If a majority of the Senate thinks the health care bill is a good idea, does that actually make it a good idea?Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, but that number, without anything else, means nothing more than that a lot of people run press.

you are leaving out 1 critical fact, which is that the community has some idea what works. there is not a complete disconnect between our perceptions of this game and this game. you could maybe make that claim about the senate, i don't care to weigh in on that. but it doesn't hold any water here.

Sure it does. People are followers. If they hear that a respected coach like VD thinks it's a world-beating defense, then they might jump on the bandwagon without having any idea. I would be willing to be that a lot of people run press without having any idea whether they would be able to do any better with another defense.

Quote: Originally posted by isack24 on 1/07/2010Sure it does.  People are followers.  If they hear that a respected coach like VD thinks it's a world-beating defense, then they might jump on the bandwagon without having any idea.  I would be willing to be that a lot of people run press without having any idea whether they would be able to do any better with another defense.

that is true to some extent, there are certainly some people who the complete disconnect exists for. but there are plenty who it doesn't. and even if a guy blindly follows a vet, that is just extending the impact of the opinion of a guy without the complete disconnect. so if 8 of 11 teams really played press, i maintain that would most certainly be an indication that the press was over powered.

As sick as some people are of people questioning the vets, I've been getting a lot "I know because I'm a vet, so listen to me" lately.

I'm not saying that's you, because you give an awful lot of great info, but this is just one of those situations where it isn't acceptable to say, "well...some vets think so, some people who have no idea just follow the vets, so that means that it is true." I'm sure that someone who is a lot smarter than me can prove that the press is overly-effective. This simply isn't proof.

Now, if 3 of 11 teams in Phelan run press, and yet 8 of 11 in the NT run press, well that's an indication. Even then, it's difficult to say because maybe it's just that the best coaches run press. And that may be because the press is more effective and they know it, or maybe it's just because that's what they picked.

The fact is, VD cherrypicked 11 of the 64 teams. Who cares about non-traditional teams? Those teams might be more talented than the traditional ones. It was an odd, small sample.

Like I said, he might be right, but this doesn't even come close to proving anything.