Scoresheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1e1ZmgHlD13LHO6_WYWMds5hCVJxhut5qX3VREjj9Hpo/edit?usp=sharing


Rosters

1. pbandj - LeBron James, Dikembe Mutombo, Draymond Green, Robert Parish, Zach LaVine, Domantas Sabonis, Jose Calderon, Mikal Bridges, Tom Boerwinkle, Joe Ingles, Brandon Ingram, Mark Jackson

2. chewy3344 - Wilt Chamberlain, Paul George, Jerry Lucas, Montrezl Harrell, Mike Conley, Paul Pierce, Pascal Siakam, Fat Lever, David West, Mo Bamba, LaMelo Ball, Cole Aldrich

3. ty84moss - Steph Curry, Jrue Holiday, Jarrett Allen, Gerald Wallace, Emeka Okafor, Paul Millsap, Deandre Ayton, Ivica Zubac, Nate McMillan, Myles Turner, Tony Parker, Taj Gibson

4. jpevans31 - Michael Jordan, Bill Russell, Alonzo Mourning, Brent Barry, Mookie Blaylock, Dave Cowens, Desmond Bane, Lamar Odom, Amir Johnson, Toni Kukoc, Danny Granger, Larry Smith

5. dh555 - Shaquille O'Neal, Klay Thompson, Steve Nash, Donyell Marshall, Andrew Bogut, Kermit Washington, Terry Tyler, Rajon Rondo, Clifford Ray, Bob Lanier, Terrence Jones, Michael Redd

6. robusk - Giannis Antetokounmpo, Shawn Marion, Andrei Kirilenko, Jimmy Butler, Andre Iguodala, Amare Stoudemire, Michael Porter, Marcin Gortat, Kyle O'Quinn, George Hill, Mason Plumlee, Terrell Brandon

7. gerryred - Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Andre Drummond, Serge Ibaka, Sidney Moncrief, Mark Price, Derek Harper, Jakob Poeltl, Larry Nance Jr, Roy Tarpley, J.R. Smith, Patty Mills, Renaldo Balkman

8. jethroeg - David Robinson, Scottie Pippen, Buck Williams, Clyde Drexler, Mo Cheeks, Baron Davis, Eddie Jones, Alton Lister, Alex English, Maurice Lucas, Micheal Ray Richardson, T.J. McConnell

9. midge - Dwight Howard, Gary Payton, Elton Brand, Ray Allen, Kevin Love, Robert Williams, Kevin Johnson, Bill Bridges, Rodney McCray, Michael Cooper, Bob Pettit, Bailey Howell

10. albiband0 - Charles Barkley, Jason Kidd, Jonas Valanciunas, Christian Wood, Dale Davis, Khris Middleton, Bob Dandridge, Antonio McDyess, Dana Barros, George T. Johnson, Cheick Diallo, Nick Anderson

11. jhsukow - Chris Paul, Karl-Anthony Towns, Horace Grant, Pau Gasol, Otto Porter, Nicolas Batum, Tobias Harris, Arvydas Sabonis, Grant Hill, Mel Daniels, Derrick Rose, Joel Przybilla

12. 24kpyrite - Rudy Gobert, Damian Lillard, Bam Adebayo, Luka Doncic, Bob McAdoo, Tyrese Haliburton, Dan Roundfield, Victor Oladipo, De'Anthony Melton, Gary Payton II, Chris Webber, James Worthy

13. dbkc - Kevin Durant, Tyson Chandler, Bill Walton, Ben Simmons, Mitchell Robinson, Russell Westbrook, Andrew Bynum, Anthony Mason, Reggie Miller, Hot Rod Williams, Cedric Maxwell, Thaddeus Young

14. benhoidal - James Harden, Kevin McHale, Joel Embiid, Jerry West, Chris Andersen, Kevon Looney, Ed Davis, Jarred Vanderbilt, Charles Oakley, Dwight Powell, Bismack Biyombo, Pat Connaughton

15. raggedclaws - Anthony Davis, Clint Capela, Kyrie Irving, Danny Green, Al Horford, Bo Outlaw, Delon Wright, Walt Bellamy, Jaylen Brown, Gordon Hayward, Terry Rozier, Marquese Chriss

16. beloud - Karl Malone, Hassan Whiteside, Chauncey Billups, Nikola Vucevic, Marques Johnson, Chris Boucher, Bobby Portis, Dejounte Murray, Lonzo Ball, Marcus Smart, JaMychal Green, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander

17. jkaye24 - DeAndre Jordan, Magic Johnson, Patrick Ewing, Kyle Lowry, Robert Covington, Brandon Clarke, Paul Pressey, Andris Biedrins, Daniel Gafford, Yao Ming, Marvin Williams, Brad Daugherty

18. jcred5 - Kevin Garnett, Dwyane Wade, Larry Nance, Anfernee Hardaway, Willis Reed, Enes Kanter, Kyle Anderson, Wesley Person, D'Angelo Russell, Dewayne Dedmon, James Johnson, Ervin Johnson

19. berkelon - Larry Bird, Oscar Robertson, Marcus Camby, John Collins, JaVale McGee, Bradley Beal, John Henson, Patrick Beverley, Gheorghe Muresan, Buddy Hield, Larry Sanders, Shane Battier

20. edsortails - Kawhi Leonard, Artis Gilmore, Shawn Kemp, Tracy McGrady, Deron Williams, Alvin Robertson, Josh Smith, Kyle Korver, Zion Williamson, John Havlicek, Troy Murphy, Elvin Hayes

21. ashamael - Nikola Jokic, Ben Wallace, Walt Frazier, Derrick Favors, Jayson Tatum, Carlos Boozer, Brandan Wright, Kemba Walker, A.C. Green, Jamario Moon, Miles Bridges, Rasheed Wallace

22. amerk1180 - Dennis Rodman, Moses Malone, Kobe Bryant, Tree Rollins, Dirk Nowitzki, Terry Porter, Chris Mullin, Jameer Nelson, Theo Ratliff, Don Buse, Andrew Wiggins, Rick Barry

23. steelers821 - John Stockton, Tim Duncan, Manu Ginobili, Kenneth Faried, Richaun Holmes, Wes Unseld, Vince Carter, Charlie Ward. Anderson Varejao, Zelmo Beaty, Chris Bosh, Charlie Edge

24. 20ks - Julius Erving, Hakeem Olajuwon, Bobby Jones, Eric Bledsoe, Joakim Noah, Nerlens Noel, Samuel Dalembert, CJ McCollum, Carmelo Anthony, David Lee, Grant Williams, Paul Westphal

x

CLONE WARS!!!!!!!

So as I mentioned in last seasons commentary, I really want to try a Savage season where we allow clones. Here's what I'm thinking so far and I'd love to hear your input or interest in participating.

- This will not affect Savage X or Savage XI. Clone Wars is a Savage special edition and you won't lose your spot for Savage XI if you choose not to join Clone Wars. The plan is to try to start Clone Wars sometime after Savage X finishes drafting, depending on where the 52 draft is it. I don't want to wait until the Savage X season is over as that will push Savage XI back too far.

- There can be more than 1 clone. So LeBron can be drafted 3 times.

- No partial clones. If you draft a clone, they must have 5 available seasons to use. So you couldn't draft a Jokic clone since he only has 7 seasons.

- You may draft a clone of a player already on your team. So you can draft LeBron2 to backup LeBron1!

- Once a clone of one of your players has been drafted, you have 48 hours to announce the 5 seasons you will be using. So when LeBron2 gets drafted, the owner who has LeBron 1 will have 48 hours to announce the 5 seasons he is using. When LeBron3 gets drafted, the LeBron2 owner will have 48 hours to announce the 5 seasons he will be using.

This last point is the biggest problem I see. We can't wait until the end of the draft to announce what seasons of our cloned players we plan to use. It would take forever to start the season. I don't think assigning seasons to a player works either. We have no idea what players would be cloned and that seems like waaaay too much work to try assign seasons to every player eligible to be cloned. There's really not a good way to assign seasons anyway. Would it be the best 5(different opinions on that)? Would it be chronological? That's kinda lame and devalues most of the players.

I think the 48 hour rule would be the best way to do it. It also adds a little more strategy. If you see an owner who likes to use different seasons then most, maybe you target that clone thinking a great season or two of that player could still be available. The 5 seasons announcements will be kinda fun to see. I'm always surprised at some of the seasons owners don't use. If you wish to keep your team building a little more flexible, maybe you don't target cloneable players at all.

This will be pure chaos but also could be extremely fun. I have my doubts we will get to 24 owners but I wanted to give it a shot. Please let me know in the poll below if you have any interest in joining Savage: Clone Wars.

I’m not a big fan of the 48 hour rule. Just because what if two clones get picked back to back or something like that.

Either way I’d probably be in if I don’t get in this savage and probably won’t if I do make it.

Posted by steelers821 on 1/19/2023 7:35:00 PM (view original):
I’m not a big fan of the 48 hour rule. Just because what if two clones get picked back to back or something like that.

Either way I’d probably be in if I don’t get in this savage and probably won’t if I do make it.

It's highly likely that Lebron gets picked 1st & 2nd (or at least twice in the top 5 and 3x in the top 15) so that is an interesting thought.

IMO, 24 hours makes more sense than 48. No need to possibly lengthen the draft even more. In this league, we're already doing our research before our picks. We should already have a good idea of what our 5 seasons should be. And if someone has already picked a guy, that shortens the list of seasons you have to pick from. Besides that, 1 day to choose sounds more SAVAGE.

Posted by ashamael on 1/19/2023 7:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by steelers821 on 1/19/2023 7:35:00 PM (view original):
I’m not a big fan of the 48 hour rule. Just because what if two clones get picked back to back or something like that.

Either way I’d probably be in if I don’t get in this savage and probably won’t if I do make it.

It's highly likely that Lebron gets picked 1st & 2nd (or at least twice in the top 5 and 3x in the top 15) so that is an interesting thought.

i assume there will only be a handful a guys who get cloned twice so it hopefully wont be too much of an issue...in the extremely likely lebron scenario, the lebron1 owner will have his time to declare, and the lebron2 owner wouldnt be on a time limit to declare until after the lebron1 owner does

Posted by jpevans31 on 1/19/2023 8:41:00 PM (view original):
IMO, 24 hours makes more sense than 48. No need to possibly lengthen the draft even more. In this league, we're already doing our research before our picks. We should already have a good idea of what our 5 seasons should be. And if someone has already picked a guy, that shortens the list of seasons you have to pick from. Besides that, 1 day to choose sounds more SAVAGE.

i completely agree...i initially wanted to say 24 hours

the time limit is a bit arbitrary anyway...i cant really enforce a strict limit, what would the punishment be? i cant have owners dropping mid draft and i cant let the clone drafter possibly get the 5 best seasons of a 1st round stud a round or two later - that would be unfair to the rest of us

it would have to be more of like an honor code thing...youre expected to announce as soon as possible...dont be an ******* and make the other wait...24 hours should be enough time to realize you need to choose, and then to make a decision

I'm down with whatever you want to try DH. If you like the chaos of he 48 or 24 hours or similar, that's cool. If you want to make it a little easier you could do what I thought you originally intended with the LeBron example breaking him into 3 draftable players. Think it was 03-08, 09-13, 14-present? And again taking the easier approach, with so many players - you just put the rule as: first 5 seasons, 2nd 5 seasons, 3rd 5 seasons and a few guys like lebron, vince and kareem have a 4th 5 seasons (maybe a 5th?). Anyways - it becomes a rule that makes it easier on commish. You'd need to confirm missed seasons. For example Bird. 1st Bird is 79-83. 2nd Bird is 84-88 or 89. So you'd have to say 5 years or seasons. It could get pretty interesting in that I think it will hurt some guys draft position.

Posted by dh555 on 1/20/2023 5:25:00 PM (view original):

Posted by jpevans31 on 1/19/2023 8:41:00 PM (view original):
IMO, 24 hours makes more sense than 48. No need to possibly lengthen the draft even more. In this league, we're already doing our research before our picks. We should already have a good idea of what our 5 seasons should be. And if someone has already picked a guy, that shortens the list of seasons you have to pick from. Besides that, 1 day to choose sounds more SAVAGE.

i completely agree...i initially wanted to say 24 hours

the time limit is a bit arbitrary anyway...i cant really enforce a strict limit, what would the punishment be? i cant have owners dropping mid draft and i cant let the clone drafter possibly get the 5 best seasons of a 1st round stud a round or two later - that would be unfair to the rest of us

it would have to be more of like an honor code thing...youre expected to announce as soon as possible...dont be an ******* and make the other wait...24 hours should be enough time to realize you need to choose, and then to make a decision

I worry about the time and commish having to enforce it and others getting frustrated with what would likely be a very slow draft. For example - here's a possible scenario. Jordan is drafted round 1. Owner within reason picks 5 seasons. Owner is round say 4 picks Jordan again. I'm up in round 5 and looking for a SG back up with some usage and rather than go with a Vince Carter type, I want a 3rd Jordan. And I want to wait for the owner who drafted 2nd Jordan to declare seasons. We'd just need to all be ok with the waiting and a bit of a slow draft.

It shouldn’t be that hard to pick the five seasons that you want to use. If we really want to make it fun, instead of 24 hours make it 4 hours.

If we're doing it during the Savage X season, I'm less interested. That's ten teams to manage on top of all of your other leagues. That's too much. It's a fun idea, but I'd be out if that was the case.

I don't really love the idea of adding clones to a normal Savage season. Maybe it could be a spin-off. Savage is pretty good as is.

Posted by raggedclaws on 1/21/2023 6:23:00 PM (view original):
I don't really love the idea of adding clones to a normal Savage season. Maybe it could be a spin-off. Savage is pretty good as is.

This is my feeling.