D1 - lose recruit from considering in one cycle? Topic

john_mills
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I just moved to a C- low d1 team. Another coach in our conference just mentioned this issue and the same thing just happened to me, so I wanted see if this is a known new "fact". Had siginifant money into a recruit last night (first day of recruiting); well over 10k in him. 2am notes indicate he loves me. By 6am, a big 6 school comes in and I am wiped out off considering. Another ton of money gets me back on list in the next cycle, but I just got bumped again. Big 6 school only has C+ prestige. I have more than enough money in (beleive me) to ensure considering status throughout the entire process. What gives here?
8/11/2010 2:48 PM
glen87
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10k at DI is not "significant" money.  a big 6 school is easily putting $20k + per recruit.  also remember money does not = recruiting effort, all moeny is not equal.  what are the distances involved?  how are you using your money?  these are all questions that need to be answered to help you out in this case.
8/11/2010 3:09 PM
tmacfan12
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He just has much more money in the guy then you. Its that simple.  And 10 k at D1 is not a lot.
8/11/2010 3:15 PM
glen87
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just did a quick recap of some of my DI recruiting battles while at the mid-major level.

season 11 - $43,900 for a 5 star center
season 15 - $34,833 for a 4 star center
season 20 - $32,282 for a 4 star PG
season 12 - $26,466 for a 5 star center, also lost a 3 star SG for $21,178

about a dozen others with $20k+ to win and at least 7 where $20k+ lost the player
8/11/2010 3:18 PM
john_mills
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Alrighty - i have a big 6 team too.  i know how to play this game, so relax a bit from your soap box that 10k is nothing.  10k in the 1st or 2nd cycle is a decent chunk of change to start the process. 

distance is 150 miles for me and 200 for him.

glen - i bet you were at least considered for that 3 star SG for 21k.  I am above that....  I am just saying I SHOULD BE CONSIDERED at this point in the game.  Signings don't happen till tomorrow.
8/11/2010 3:47 PM (edited)
john_mills
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Also, was using money straight HV and the occasional CV.   The math is better for 2 HV's than 1 CV at the distance.

8/11/2010 3:42 PM
glen87
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if you put $20k into a recruit, but another school has $30k into him (in similar recruiting effort), he will not be considering you.  just because you have a lot into him, does not mean he will automatically be considering you
8/11/2010 4:50 PM
john_mills
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I won't get into specific money amounts since this baby is still going on.  But I am pretty sure that if I have 20k into a recruit and another guy has 30k into the recruit, all things being equal, I should show up on the considering list.  Certainly way behind, but at least being considered...  That is all I am saying.  There is something fluky with getting kicked off like this.
8/11/2010 6:03 PM
tmacfan12
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No there isnt. He is way ahead of you, far enough to the point where you are knocked off. I dont know what you dont get. There has to be a point where you get knocked off so that the recruit will sign faster and you have reached that point. Also, you have no idea how much money this guy is spending so I dont get how you are complaining.
8/11/2010 6:21 PM
daalter
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In that scenario, he has 50% more more into the recruit plus a 2/3 grade prestige advantage. And who knows, he could have $35 or 40K into him.

Bottom line is that if you have $20K into a guy and he's not considering you, it means the other guy has quite a lot more into him (and/or is leveraging the prestige advantage).

And no, this definitely isn't a change or new development.
8/11/2010 7:55 PM
emy1013
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John, I'm surprised that you haven't run into this scenario before.  As Daalter said, this isn't a new change or development.  In fact, I find it to be quite common to knock a school completely off a kid's considering list in one cycle, especially if one of the schools has a decent prestige/money advantage.
8/11/2010 11:01 PM
john_mills
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I could see if it he had a money/prestige advantage, but he only has 2/3 of a C letter grade.  That is nothing special.  In addition, I have a significant money advantage going in (more spots to fill, but about 25k more in the bank at least). 

I am not going to continue to argue with everybody, as that makes me look more foolish.  Its obvious now (of course) that  this happens to people all the time.  It just seemed odd to me that I was knocked off in one cycle (first with over 10k and then again with over 20k into the kid) AND the same thing happened to a conference mate... since it never had happened to me with any real money into somebody.  Learning everyday I suppose.

Thanks guys - sorry for the arguing.
8/12/2010 8:35 AM
girt25
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Posted by john_mills on 8/12/2010 8:35:00 AM (view original):
I could see if it he had a money/prestige advantage, but he only has 2/3 of a C letter grade.  That is nothing special.  In addition, I have a significant money advantage going in (more spots to fill, but about 25k more in the bank at least). 

I am not going to continue to argue with everybody, as that makes me look more foolish.  Its obvious now (of course) that  this happens to people all the time.  It just seemed odd to me that I was knocked off in one cycle (first with over 10k and then again with over 20k into the kid) AND the same thing happened to a conference mate... since it never had happened to me with any real money into somebody.  Learning everyday I suppose.

Thanks guys - sorry for the arguing.
It doesn't matter that you had more money at the start of recruiting. What matters is that you had $20K into the guy, and he clearly had the ability to put in quite a bit more than that. And you may downplay the prestige advantage, but I'm guessing that gives him something like a 1.4 to 1 edge ... meaning that if he had $30K into the recruit, that's equivalent to you having $42K in. And that would pretty obviously be enough to knock you off the list.
8/12/2010 1:37 PM
robdoc3
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yep,  1.465 : 1
8/12/2010 1:48 PM
grecianfox
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2/3 of a letter grade in a pretty decent advantage. Not sure if the 1.465:1 number cited above is correct imo, but it is in the ballpark.
8/12/2010 2:50 PM
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