Max Practice Minutes Topic

muskies85
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Hey fellas what are the most minutes you would put in a practice category these days before you feel its diminishing returns? Right now the max I have been putting in a category is 25. What do you guys do?
2/26/2014 10:49 AM
rednation58
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I use 25 for IQ development- but I rarely go over 20 mins for any single rating unless the player is starting to max out or they're still blue potential in a core as an upperclassman.

2/26/2014 11:17 AM
Trentonjoe
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I think 20 is the limit before you see diminishing returns.
2/26/2014 11:29 AM
muskies85
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Yea I am more referring to when a player is beginning to max out. I go 20 on blue when to start but when the player is maxing out do you go more like 25 or is it just a waste of time?
2/26/2014 11:37 AM
Trentonjoe
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I reduce minutes (usually) when a player goes to red.  

I think it is very useful to go above 20 minutes early in some high highs.  Not so much in the black and red.
2/26/2014 11:42 AM
rednation58
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What if a player is pretty much maxed out but you're trying to get those last few points in a specific rating? Going above 20 wouldn't help? At a certain point, I get all the max out emails from the asst. coach and there's really nowhere to put all the left over minutes anyway.
2/26/2014 12:01 PM
rednu
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Posted by rednation58 on 2/26/2014 12:01:00 PM (view original):
What if a player is pretty much maxed out but you're trying to get those last few points in a specific rating? Going above 20 wouldn't help? At a certain point, I get all the max out emails from the asst. coach and there's really nowhere to put all the left over minutes anyway.
Going above 20 always helps...it's just that each minute added gives you less help than the one before it. So think about it as getting full credit for minutes 1-20...minute 21 is worth less than full credit (but still adds to the effort you're getting from minutes 1-20), minute 22 is worth less than minute 21, etc.

If you've gotten the max-out emails in other categories, there's no reason not to pile on the minutes anywhere that you think a player's attributes still has points to be gained. I've had 45+ minutes in some individual things on my practice plans previously, just because those were the only areas where the player still had points to gain.

And to answer the question asked higher up, diminishing returns triggers after 20 minutes on individual categories and after 25 minutes on the team Off/Def practice.
2/26/2014 12:08 PM
mikvitu
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Yeah if you have nowhere else to put it, put it into whatever is going to increase. You're going to get diminishing returns but whats it matter anyway if the guys maxed out. But I would never exceed 20 on a specific part of practice if the guy has multiple categories that need work. 
2/26/2014 12:11 PM
muskies85
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Yeah I am only referring to the time when you have say 2 black categories and the rest red and the kid is a senior with a 3.5 gpa and doesn't need study hall work. I guess there really is no reason not to add leftover minutes to those black categories.
2/26/2014 1:29 PM
Trentonjoe
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My general plan is:

1. Get the cores to red.
2. Then load minutes into secondary blues
3. Then adjust
2/26/2014 1:33 PM
wildcat98
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I like to add minutes to a red category, wait for the "maxed out" message, and then drop that category to 1 minute and pile the extra 19 into a different red category, repeating the process until only the 2 black categories (which will have been set at 20 the entire time, of course) are left. At THAT point, I pile in all my extra minutes divided equally between the remaining black categories.
2/26/2014 1:33 PM
zbrent716
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I think you see diminishing returns long before 20 minutes in a category.

For those that are saying 20 - in your own experience, 18 minutes gets exactly double the development of 9 minutes?

Or are you assuming some value (7?) that generates no positive growth at all, and so 9 minutes is really only 2 minutes towards development (7 towards maintaining) and in that case 11 minutes (4 towards development) is double development over 9?

Neither of those seem accurate in my experience, and so I think the non-linear aspect of practice minutes and development kicks in way below 20.
2/26/2014 2:24 PM
Trentonjoe
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Posted by zbrent716 on 2/26/2014 2:24:00 PM (view original):
I think you see diminishing returns long before 20 minutes in a category.

For those that are saying 20 - in your own experience, 18 minutes gets exactly double the development of 9 minutes?

Or are you assuming some value (7?) that generates no positive growth at all, and so 9 minutes is really only 2 minutes towards development (7 towards maintaining) and in that case 11 minutes (4 towards development) is double development over 9?

Neither of those seem accurate in my experience, and so I think the non-linear aspect of practice minutes and development kicks in way below 20.
I have never done the math but it seems to me that 20 minutes gets significantly more growth than 15 does.
2/26/2014 2:27 PM
zbrent716
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Posted by Trentonjoe on 2/26/2014 2:27:00 PM (view original):
Posted by zbrent716 on 2/26/2014 2:24:00 PM (view original):
I think you see diminishing returns long before 20 minutes in a category.

For those that are saying 20 - in your own experience, 18 minutes gets exactly double the development of 9 minutes?

Or are you assuming some value (7?) that generates no positive growth at all, and so 9 minutes is really only 2 minutes towards development (7 towards maintaining) and in that case 11 minutes (4 towards development) is double development over 9?

Neither of those seem accurate in my experience, and so I think the non-linear aspect of practice minutes and development kicks in way below 20.
I have never done the math but it seems to me that 20 minutes gets significantly more growth than 15 does.
I completely agree that 20 seems to get significantly more growth than 15 does. And I think we can all (in this thread so far) agree that the difference between 25 and 20 is less than the difference between 20 and 15.

Where we differ though, is whether we think there is a greater difference between 10 and 15 than between 15 and 20.
2/26/2014 2:54 PM
spasticity
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Yeah I think it's very likely a curve such that, technically, diminishing returns kicks in almost immediately.  Most people probably think of the phrase "diminishing returns" as the point where that effect gets really noticeable and prohibitive.  I would say that point is 25 personally.
2/26/2014 3:15 PM
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