South Carolina Topic

 Just read South Carolina's justification when it became the first state to secede after Abraham Lincoln's election:

A geographical line has been drawn across the Union, and all the States north of that line have united in the election of a man to the high office of President of the United States, whose opinions and purposes are hostile to slavery. He is to be entrusted with the administration of the common Government, because he has declared that that "Government cannot endure permanently half slave, half free," and that the public mind must rest in the belief that slavery is in the course of ultimate extinction. This sectional combination for the submersion of the Constitution, has been aided in some of the States by elevating to citizenship, persons who, by the supreme law of the land, are incapable of becoming citizens; and their votes have been used to inaugurate a new policy, hostile to the South, and destructive of its beliefs and safety.

6/24/2015 3:59 AM
Posted by bad_luck on 6/23/2015 11:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 6/23/2015 11:31:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/23/2015 10:47:00 PM (view original):
The separate country that was formed to protect slavery.

Dude, take my advice. Grab some winks. Come back tomorrow and try again.
You have trouble grasping complex concepts, don't you? And by "complex", I mean anything that goes beyond "duh".
We aren't even arguing at this point, you're just being funny.

You already said that the South seceded to protect slavery. What more is there to talk about?
Nothing, apparently.  Your stubbornness and refusal to admit that you're wrong makes any further discussion pointless.


6/24/2015 6:06 AM
You know, you can look things up on the internet.

As I said earlier, it was all about the money.   Pretty much everything is about the money. 

Part of the problem began with the Tariff of 1828.   You can look it up but, briefly, it greatly benefited the north's cotton mills while costing the south $$$ via a heavy tax on imported goods.   That created a mistrust between north/south. 

There was also the whole "free state/slave state" thing.    As everyone knows the House of Reps is based on population, the Senate is two per state.   In the 1850s, the "free states" outnumbered "slave states".   The balance of political power had entirely shifted.   Some in the south felt that this was going to turn them back into colonies.

As time went on, abolitiionists began calling slavery "immoral" as opposed to "evil".   That didn't float with the church-heavy south.

Around this time, there were several skirmishes in the midwest wrt to the whole "free/slave state" thing(John Brown/Bleeding Kansas).   More mistrust.

And Lincoln was elected. 


To summarize, slavery was a key issue but it was about $$$ and political power.   The south had no business model that didn't include slavery and the Tariff of 1828 put a financial strain on their ability to import goods.   Essentially forcing them to buy from the north.  Which led to mistrust when the political power shifted to the north 20+ years later.    We laugh at third world countries having fist fights in Congress(or whatever they have) but that was us in the mid-1800s.  The south truly felt they were a different country and that State's Rights were being lost.   So they seceded. 
6/24/2015 8:37 AM
BTW, the start of the CW could have been avoided but Lincoln wanted it.   I forget the name of the fort where union soldiers were holed up(Fort Moultrie.  Told you that you could look things up on the internet) but they got nervous because of the all the uproar and moved to the incomplete Fort Sumter.   Charleston offered to allow them to leave, unharmed, but they refused despite being very low on supplies.   So Lincoln sent ships to re-supply the INCOMPLETE fort and it was fired upon.  They gave Lincoln the war he wanted.
6/24/2015 8:51 AM (edited)
I'll add that the simplistic answer is "slavery".     It was about progress(the south wasn't making any), money(the south was seeing their money pile shrink) and power(the north was getting it). 

6/24/2015 8:49 AM
This post has a rating of , which is below the default threshold.
Posted by MikeT23 on 6/24/2015 8:49:00 AM (view original):
I'll add that the simplistic answer is "slavery".     It was about progress(the south wasn't making any), money(the south was seeing their money pile shrink) and power(the north was getting it). 

!
6/24/2015 9:09 AM
BTW, if you're going to legislate out a people's way of making a living, you can't expect them to react well.   Might as well burn their houses and kill their livestock. 

The South wasn't moving forward, maybe they did need a kick in the *** in order to do so, but I don't believe slavery would be an issue today if Lincoln had said "OK, **** it.   Be your own ******* country.   Good luck with that, Jethroes."
6/24/2015 9:16 AM
Posted by tecwrg on 6/24/2015 6:06:00 AM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/23/2015 11:38:00 PM (view original):
Posted by tecwrg on 6/23/2015 11:31:00 PM (view original):
Posted by bad_luck on 6/23/2015 10:47:00 PM (view original):
The separate country that was formed to protect slavery.

Dude, take my advice. Grab some winks. Come back tomorrow and try again.
You have trouble grasping complex concepts, don't you? And by "complex", I mean anything that goes beyond "duh".
We aren't even arguing at this point, you're just being funny.

You already said that the South seceded to protect slavery. What more is there to talk about?
Nothing, apparently.  Your stubbornness and refusal to admit that you're wrong makes any further discussion pointless.


I do not need to stick my head in the sand. Here is your "argument:"

"The Civil War wasn't caused by slavery. It was caused by secession."

Um ok. And the South seceded because of slavery. Which was my original point. They were trying to protect slavery.

Since you made that "argument," you haven't changed it. You've just pretended that it somehow refutes my point.

6/24/2015 9:20 AM
Of course, none of this has anything to do with the Confederate flag or Dylann Roof. 
6/24/2015 9:24 AM
6/24/2015 9:31 AM
6/24/2015 9:38 AM
TOM BRADY PLAYS FOR THE YANKEES!!!!
6/24/2015 9:47 AM
SO DOES LEBRON!!!!


6/24/2015 9:50 AM
IMAGINE THE RIGHT-WING PANIC HAD THE WHITE POSTER-BOY BEEN HOLDING AN ISIS FLAG!

RIGHT-WING PANIC!

ISIS IS COMING!
6/24/2015 9:53 AM
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