New PA/G cap Topic

thunder1008
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I'm delighted that the update takes away the killer fatigue strategy.

I was in one $80 MM OL last month where a hacker fielded all hitters and $200K pitchers, named his team Recuperate Pronto and tried to bust the league. Where's the strategy there?

I was in another OL where I skipped a couple roster checks early in the season and some guy used a fatigue strategy -- said he wasn't really trying to "kill" other teams, just "resting his players early" -- and it wreaked havoc on my lineup from which some of my hitters never fully recovered.

Not sure if I follow Boogerlips' point about gamers v. baseball purists, though I admit I'm a hard core baseball nut. I played nearly 20 WIS seasons using only players who I loved with absolutely no regard to how my teams performed because I'm stubborn. I finally decided it might be nice to win occasionally, so now I go with teams I like that can also win (though they usually don't).

But no matter what the game is, you have to have context and rules. The whole context for WIS simulated baseball is, by definition, baseball. If teams can devise strategies that have nothing to do with the way baseball is really played, then it becomes something other than baseball SIMS; it's just an arcane version of "dueling numbers."

If I ran the zoo, I suppose I would tilt the equation even more toward pure baseball by factoring non-statistical intangibles like leadership and hustle and borderline statistical metrics like clutch hitting and pitching (and choking) into the mix.

I'm not trying to change chess into checkers; I'm just trying to keep it on a chessboard where it belongs. I guess you could play a chess match where you suddenly announce that "rooks are wild," or something, but then it stops being chess, doesn't it?

Just my two cents' worth and, at this hour of the day, the currency may be devalued.
10/13/2009 8:17 PM
seels
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I actually liked the killer fatigue or "true Coors Field" teams. But my teams actually were pretty successful. There are like a dozen new rules in this new sim that destroyed any chance of me having these type of teams again.
10/13/2009 9:54 PM
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boogerlips
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Good point. That would work for me.
10/13/2009 11:27 PM
River_Rats
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I dunno, I like the 6 PA rule. I've played a few zingers in the first few games of the season such that my hitters all end up being in serious fatigue by the time inter-division games begin and fatigue starts to sets in. I'm happy not to have to worry about that any longer.
10/13/2009 11:28 PM
boogerlips
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Sounds like River Rat is in favor of big government.
10/13/2009 11:30 PM
River_Rats
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Yep. As long as it's doing what I want it to do, at least.

10/14/2009 9:28 AM
mattedesa
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Quote: Originally posted by thunder1008 on 10/13/2009I'm delighted that the update takes away the killer fatigue strategy.I was in one $80 MM OL last month where a hacker fielded all hitters and $200K pitchers, named his team Recuperate Pronto and tried to bust the league.  Where's the strategy there? I was in another OL where I skipped a couple roster checks early in the season and some guy used a fatigue strategy -- said he wasn't really trying to "kill" other teams, just "resting his players early" -- and it wreaked havoc on my lineup from which some of my hitters never fully recovered.Not sure if I follow Boogerlips' point about gamers v. baseball purists, though I admit I'm a hard core baseball nut.  I played nearly 20 WIS seasons using only players who I loved with absolutely no regard to how my teams performed because I'm stubborn.  I finally decided it might be nice to win occasionally, so now I go with teams I like that can also win (though they usually don't).But no matter what the game is, you have to have context and rules.  The whole context for WIS simulated baseball is, by definition, baseball.  If teams can devise strategies that have nothing to do with the way baseball is really played, then it becomes something other than baseball SIMS; it's just an arcane version of "dueling numbers." If I ran the zoo, I suppose I would tilt the equation even more toward pure baseball by factoring non-statistical intangibles like leadership and hustle and borderline statistical metrics like clutch hitting and pitching (and choking) into the mix.I'm not trying to change chess into checkers; I'm just trying to keep it on a chessboard where it belongs.  I guess you could play a chess match where you suddenly announce that "rooks are wild," or something, but then it stops being chess, doesn't it?Just my two cents' worth and, at this hour of the day, the currency may be devalued.

Nice to see someone who still recognizes the goal of this site is to simulate baseball as well as possible. If at the end of the season, these updates make for more realistic stats and gets rid of some of the ridiculousness brought on by people (intentionally or ignorantly) abusing the system, I'm all for it.
10/14/2009 9:42 AM
llamanunts
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You and I want this site to simulate baseball as well as possible, maybe. I think we can agree that the goal of this site is to make ever-larger piles of money. Not a specific point about this update, but let's not let our wishes cloud our perception.

10/14/2009 11:56 AM
yogsloth
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...and then there's people like me who couldn't give a fig about baseball. I'd rather watch paint dry. Honestly. Baseball is the most boring sport in the world after curling.

I just want a fun strategy game to play. :)
10/14/2009 3:35 PM
bagchucker
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BLASPHEMER!
10/14/2009 3:43 PM
ooooohdoggie
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This post could not be converted. To view the original post's thread, click here.
10/14/2009 3:54 PM
toddcommish
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Quote: Originally Posted By yogsloth on 10/14/2009
...and then there's people like me who couldn't give a fig about baseball. I'd rather watch paint dry. Honestly. Baseball is the most boring sport in the world after curling.

I just want a fun strategy game to play. :)

You're probably one of the guys who would rather use Up-up-down-down--right--right-B-A-start than actually playing the game too...
10/14/2009 3:55 PM
mattedesa
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Quote: Originally posted by ooooohdoggie on 10/14/2009


Quote: Originally Posted By yogsloth on 10/14/2009 ...and then there's people like me who couldn't give a fig about baseball.  I'd rather watch paint dry.  Honestly.  Baseball is the most boring sport in the world after curling.I just want a fun strategy game to play.  :)
http://www.zurichgames.ch/zurichgames/curling/game.php?l=de

 
 

That was fun - thanks!
 


 



10/14/2009 4:16 PM
thunder1008
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As a baseball purist, I obviously don't share the same POV as yogsloth. But I also don't see why the goals of the gamer and the baseball purist need to be in conflict.

As a baseball fan, I believe that the goal of WIS should always be to come closer and closer to simulating how actual baseball games might be played using a universe of potential players from 1885 through 2009 in a large but finite number of team combinations and potential ballpark settings. WIS should adhere to the Japanese concept of keisan -- "constantly striving for perfection through incremental improvement."

Whenever WIS can do away with strategies that bear no resemblance to actual baseball, like killer fatigue strategies, they should. Whenever WIS can do something like normalize fielding, which captures a player's performance within the context of the season he played and then transposes it to a competitive environment peopled with players from 1885-2009, each with his own individual context, they should. Whenever they can bump up IP or PA to better simulate the concept that a real baseball manager better be prepared to field a competitive team for a full 1458 regular season innings, give or take extra innings, weather shortened games and bottom of the 9th innings in which the winning team doesn't come to bat, they should.

But this shouldn't disadvantage the gamer. The gamer may not give a d*mn whether updates in the game better simulate real baseball, but he or she should be in a favor of a game that is always changing, evolving and never static. A static game introduces a disagreeable level of competitive parity in which all experienced owners eventually draft similar players and devise similar strategies, and the only differentiators of success are the number of newbies or diehard purists who happen to be in your league who can't or won't adopt similarly successful strategies. Even the gamer who is winning hand over fist today should want to avoid that kind of endgame, because it will eventually drive him away in boredom.

Now the race is on to see who can adapt to the new parameters of the game fastest and seize the competitive advantage until the rest of the field starts to catch up and it's time for the next update, and that should be good for fans and gamers alike.

Again, I don't guarantee that my two cents' worth is actually worth that much, but you got it anyway.
10/14/2009 4:45 PM
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