Yes! A world population reference! My favorite!

"We have a great game that is now available to play on any device and is easier for newcomers to comprehend and enjoy. Combine this with our helpful, veteran user base and we should expect to see fuller worlds with greater competition than ever before."

So many people said that his new system would ruin D3 and the experience for a new user. And we were right. Less than 50 people in D3 in a world? Wow.

Posted by dahsdebater on 10/16/2018 6:49:00 PM (view original):
Talk about red herrings. This is an utterly nonsensical metaphor. Taylor Swift is more popular than The National because her music is generally inoffensive enough that nobody is going to hate it. The National is basically the exact opposite of that. And everything about them - the band, the musical style, the nature of the concerts - bear absolutely no resemblance to one another.

Here we're comparing HD to HD. Just at different times. If a band tried changing their music and lost 1/3 of their fans, they might care. They might also not, if they could afford to not care. Lots of musicians just want to make music primarily for themselves and are thrilled if they manage to make a living off of it and avoid a day job. But it would generally be fair to say that the general consensus was that their music had become less desirable if they lose fans. And by the same token, it's fair to say that HD has become less desirable since the switch to 3.0. That is objectively true. Whether the game is "better" or "worse" is an incredibly subjective question. I think it's less fun. That has very little to do with the probabilistic nature of new recruiting and virtually everything to do with the extended nature of it. I hate recruiting, always have, it is by far my least favorite part of the game. I like trying to unpack how the engine works, design an image of what I would like my team to look like, and then build team and player game plans. If I could autopilot recruiting I would. So this drawn-out recruiting is an absolute nightmare to me. Whenever I run out of free play I'm going to quit. But because world populations are so abysmally low, that may never happen. Until the lack of customers bankrupts the game.

Don’t be ignorant. Popularity doesn’t determine quality. That’s the point. It’s true in games, and it’s true in any creative endeavor. The truth is that there are things The National could do to sell more albums and tickets, and they (hopefully) don’t care about what you or anyone else think about that.

This topic is a red herring; a common one, that’s what folks who either don’t have teams, or claim to be playing out credits always come back to when they hear - gasp - other folks actually *like* this game as it is. Everyone knew there would be attrition. If seble or WIS didn’t expect it, they were fools. 25% was what I suggested, which is probably a little high, since I think it’s fair to say most of the folks who left had lots of teams. What I’ve said from before beta, if they really want to increase usership - if that’s a value they are striving for - the biggest obstacle to that is the absurdly high investment in time and money to get to mid-major and up D1, which is where >90% of people interested in a fantasy college basketball simulation are going to want to play. If you’re complaining about usership and not addressing this, you are just spitting out sour grapes.

By the way, for someone who presents as intelligent, I would think your time would be more valuable than to spend it on something you don’t enjoy.

Posted by shoe3 on 10/16/2018 1:36:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mullycj on 10/16/2018 1:17:00 PM (view original):
The ghost town of a site since 3.0 would argue differently..

I play in full or mostly full D1 conferences. Tell us more.

So which is it shoe? World populations haven't decreased by >33% since 3.0 OR you personally don't care if populations have decreased by >30% ??

Because it sounds like you are trying to change your narrative from the original discussion about whether 3.0 is successful to whether YOU enjoy the game.

"Game developers are not obligated to make games that will attract a maximum amount of users."

Wow...….man, start checking your meds. What game developer is NOT trying to create a game to attract the maximum amount of users? OMG I really hope you are just arguing for arguing's sake.

Posted by mullycj on 10/17/2018 9:02:00 AM (view original):
"Game developers are not obligated to make games that will attract a maximum amount of users."

Wow...….man, start checking your meds. What game developer is NOT trying to create a game to attract the maximum amount of users? OMG I really hope you are just arguing for arguing's sake.

Guys, I just called up a Sportshub rep. I inquired about investing in their company and if they would share some details on their business model. They told me that they don't really care about being financially successful, as long as a few select people out there like their product.

Where do I sign up?!

In fact, I heard that the Sportshub CEO came out and told all the employees that they wouldn't be getting a Christmas bonus this year because they fell well short of their projected sales. But they should 'buck up!' because they put out a GREAT product... that no one is buying.

^^^ Illustrating how this continues to be the dumbest conversation users have on the HD forum ^^^

Mully is presenting a false dichotomy. I don’t have to choose between recognizing that the population is lower now than it was before beta, and declaring that I enjoy it much more than I did before beta. Popularity is not quality.

We aren’t shareholders or investors. Benis is trying to interject a set of values here (profit) to make a specific point, somewhere between sour grapes and I told you so. But I am not obligated to care about his values, and neither are the game developers. SportsHub is not a publicly traded company, and even if it was, you would have to *actually* invest before you had any say at all in the product, or the size of the market they were trying to reach.

I do get a laugh though at the idea of Benis walking into that Thai place down the street.

Benis: “Guys I’ve been in here a dozen times now, and you’re never more than about half full. Your food is pretty good, but haven’t you seen the McDonald’s across the street? They always have a line to the door during lunch hour. You should add fries and burgers and those little biscuits that taste like maple syrup pancakes to your menu. Having all this empty space is just a bad look, don’t you think?”

Thai place: “Thanks for your input. We serve Thai food.”

Benis: “But what if I wanted to invest? You’re telling me that you’re ok with only being 35% full all the time? That’s ridiculous!”

Thai place: “You can go eat at McDonald’s across the street if you’d like.”

Benis, shouting: “THIS PLACE DOESNT CARE ABOUT CUSTOMERS!!”

Thai place: “Would you like to make an order, sir?”

Benis, calming down: “I’ll take the green curry with chicken, and some pork spring rolls, thanks.”

Posted by mullycj on 10/17/2018 8:53:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 10/16/2018 1:36:00 PM (view original):

Posted by mullycj on 10/16/2018 1:17:00 PM (view original):
The ghost town of a site since 3.0 would argue differently..

I play in full or mostly full D1 conferences. Tell us more.

So which is it shoe? World populations haven't decreased by >33% since 3.0 OR you personally don't care if populations have decreased by >30% ??

Because it sounds like you are trying to change your narrative from the original discussion about whether 3.0 is successful to whether YOU enjoy the game.

Also, the original discussion is about considering credit, and it no longer being a part of the game. The “is 3.0 successful” discussion is your red herring.

Posted by shoe3 on 10/17/2018 10:59:00 AM (view original):
^^^ Illustrating how this continues to be the dumbest conversation users have on the HD forum ^^^

Mully is presenting a false dichotomy. I don’t have to choose between recognizing that the population is lower now than it was before beta, and declaring that I enjoy it much more than I did before beta. Popularity is not quality.

We aren’t shareholders or investors. Benis is trying to interject a set of values here (profit) to make a specific point, somewhere between sour grapes and I told you so. But I am not obligated to care about his values, and neither are the game developers. SportsHub is not a publicly traded company, and even if it was, you would have to *actually* invest before you had any say at all in the product, or the size of the market they were trying to reach.

I do get a laugh though at the idea of Benis walking into that Thai place down the street.

Benis: “Guys I’ve been in here a dozen times now, and you’re never more than about half full. Your food is pretty good, but haven’t you seen the McDonald’s across the street? They always have a line to the door during lunch hour. You should add fries and burgers and those little biscuits that taste like maple syrup pancakes to your menu. Having all this empty space is just a bad look, don’t you think?”

Thai place: “Thanks for your input. We serve Thai food.”

Benis: “But what if I wanted to invest? You’re telling me that you’re ok with only being 35% full all the time? That’s ridiculous!”

Thai place: “You can go eat at McDonald’s across the street if you’d like.”

Benis, shouting: “THIS PLACE DOESNT CARE ABOUT CUSTOMERS!!”

Thai place: “Would you like to make an order, sir?”

Benis, calming down: “I’ll take the green curry with chicken, and some pork spring rolls, thanks.”

The analogy doesn't work, as most analogies don't, because different things are different.

That said, if you read shoe's Thai Story above and you don't laugh at least once, you have no soul. Well done shoe.

Almost have the latest population numbers ready.

Spoiler alert. It's terrible.

Posted by Benis on 10/17/2018 1:07:00 PM (view original):
Almost have the latest population numbers ready.

Spoiler alert. It's terrible.

FarmVille is still running, if it’s really important to your game experience that a lot of other people are doing the same thing.

	D1	D2	D3	Total
~9/27/15	1357	1206	1156	3719	1 year before 3.0
7/13/16	1247	1023	1059	3329	2 months before 3.0
4/22/17	986	805	871	2662	7 months after 3.0
9/30/17	1048	712	641	2401	1 year after 3.0
6/18/18	1105	694	684	2483	21 months after 3.0
10/17/18	1076	587	624	2287	2 years after 3.0
Reduction	21%	51%	46%	39%

Only lost 200 teams in the past 4 months.

www.whatifsports.com/hoops still seems to be active. Are the Fanball guys being told about that link for a free HD team?

Also, it's time to either get rid of D2 and D3 or make qualifying for D1 MUCH easier. Most people come to HD because they want to play D1. Why persist with this stupid long-term D2 training model?

“...if they really want to increase usership - if that’s a value they are striving for - the biggest obstacle to that is the absurdly high investment in time and money to get to mid-major and up D1, which is where >90% of people interested in a fantasy college basketball simulation are going to want to play. If you’re complaining about usership and not addressing this, you are just spitting out sour grapes.”