robinhood is a better coach than me, no worries on that front, and sure he deserves the chance at Kansas. But he could have taken it when I did after a 2-27 season at C prestige and built it back up into a postseason team... he chose not to, I chose to move then so that I had a chance. Didn't even expect to get the job, and wouldn't have if a better coach had applied.

I then built it into a job that a bunch of people wanted again. Am I happy with 3 PIT appearances? Not really. I probably scheduled myself out of the NT the last 2 seasons. Team is only mediocre now, but also has 2 5-star recruits signed and should be a shoo-in for NT berths coming up.

If robinhood decides that he wants to stay, it's his job and he deserves it. If I ask him does he mind returning to his already dominant program and he says he's OK with that, why does it bother you so much? That's all that has happened here.

Why does it bother me? Because I believe people should simply be gracious, and say, "Congratulations, robinhood, on taking over Kansas. I did my best to leave you a solid core. I hope you can bring the Jayhawks to the same heights you brought Mississippi". Instead, you've taken what should be an exciting challenge and, at best, put a bad taste in his mouth.

Posted by cbriese on 6/9/2020 12:40:00 PM (view original):
Why does it bother me? Because I believe people should simply be gracious, and say, "Congratulations, robinhood, on taking over Kansas. I did my best to leave you a solid core. I hope you can bring the Jayhawks to the same heights you brought Mississippi". Instead, you've taken what should be an exciting challenge and, at best, put a bad taste in his mouth.

if wronoj lost in an open competition for the job, i suspect his response would be much more in line with what you are saying.

we all know how much time and effort it takes to get one of these jobs, it sucks to lose out not in an open competition, but from an honest mistake re: renewal. i do also agree this raft of forgotten renewals is sort of annoying and sucks for those who get excited about jobs and then give them up. perhaps some improvements like those mentioned here would help.

along with the stuff mentioned here... CC renewals (standard in 2020), emy's comments on job qualifications... perhaps the game sitemailing / emailing coaches about impending job loss might help? a lot of the 'hey you are about to lose this job!' stuff on the HD pages strikes me as similar to the banner adds and cookie warnings on so many sites that our brains are trained to tune out without any conscious intervention. perhaps there's something to improve there, i'm not sure if it might help, but it definitely seems like these renewals are getting forgotten left and right, and to me that suggests there's something about the system, not just about the individuals making the mistake.

Posted by cbriese on 6/9/2020 12:40:00 PM (view original):
Why does it bother me? Because I believe people should simply be gracious, and say, "Congratulations, robinhood, on taking over Kansas. I did my best to leave you a solid core. I hope you can bring the Jayhawks to the same heights you brought Mississippi". Instead, you've taken what should be an exciting challenge and, at best, put a bad taste in his mouth.

Fair point.

p6453 had a good post but removed it.
Renewal process can be improved. But I'm sure people who want to leave the game but get charged for another season will ***** about that too.
But this IS about personal responsibility, and yes, some people actually still believe that. The people who have been on here the most are vets who know the system inside and out. You have two months to purchase an additional season/5 pack/10 pack (whatever). If you are worried that something might come up in real life to distract you then don't wait till the last minute.

As in real life stop looking for others to bail you out on something that was totally under your control.

Hell, getting the job back wasn't even my point. I was just ranting a bit, because I didn't want to go out like that. I hadn't submitted a ticket, and didn't really plan on it. I even said best of luck to the new coach in my post.

Then the people who responded were all very positive that it was a good idea to send a ticket, that I might get it back. Figured it was worth a try. Robinhood has been totally cool about it, and if CS will move forward, it can get fixed ASAP. I'm worried now that his job has apps, and then the next one down the line, etc. etc. etc.

Either way, I didn't feel entitled to anything. I wasn't ranting about CS or the system. And if it doesn't work out, I'll go off into retirement, and WiS will lose a long-term customer.

Posted by mullycj on 6/9/2020 1:23:00 PM (view original):
p6453 had a good post but removed it.
Renewal process can be improved. But I'm sure people who want to leave the game but get charged for another season will ***** about that too.
But this IS about personal responsibility, and yes, some people actually still believe that. The people who have been on here the most are vets who know the system inside and out. You have two months to purchase an additional season/5 pack/10 pack (whatever). If you are worried that something might come up in real life to distract you then don't wait till the last minute.

As in real life stop looking for others to bail you out on something that was totally under your control.

You’re projecting things into the conversation, mully. No one is asking for a bailout. We’re asking for the system to be fixed so this happens less often.

There is no downside to reducing the occurrence, which could happen in any number of simple ways. That some folks insist on casting it as someone’s personal failing instead of a dumb setup that could very easily be made more user friendly suggests some folks are addicted to schadenfreude.

I absolutely love how any thread on the WIS forums devolves into a philosophical debate on human nature

Posted by A_B_G on 6/9/2020 1:41:00 PM (view original):
I absolutely love how any thread on the WIS forums devolves into a philosophical debate on human nature

I take issue only with your use of the word “devolves”.

wronoj - I think you handled this fine. I think its just the accumulation posts on the same issue. And I think your rant about not being qualified is also fair. I had the exact same thing happen to me years ago.

Shoe - I think most everyone agrees it can be improved. I think the line we are drawing is "is the system a dumb/broken" setup? I argue the renewal system works but is not full proof. When you buy a season there can be a pop up that asks if you want to be auto-billed in the future.

But (for the sake of forum arguments and boredom) I will disagree and say you are all asking for bailouts. The minute you contact CS to tell them you forgot to renew and ask for help, or email another user who got your team, aren't you asking them to bail you out? (That is sort of rhetorical)

Posted by mullycj on 6/9/2020 1:46:00 PM (view original):
wronoj - I think you handled this fine. I think its just the accumulation posts on the same issue. And I think your rant about not being qualified is also fair. I had the exact same thing happen to me years ago.

Shoe - I think most everyone agrees it can be improved. I think the line we are drawing is "is the system a dumb/broken" setup? I argue the renewal system works but is not full proof. When you buy a season there can be a pop up that asks if you want to be auto-billed in the future.

But (for the sake of forum arguments and boredom) I will disagree and say you are all asking for bailouts. The minute you contact CS to tell them you forgot to renew and ask for help, or email another user who got your team, aren't you asking them to bail you out? (That is sort of rhetorical)

We wouldn’t have to ask for *anything* from CS or the forum users if the system was functional and user friendly. That’s the point. I want to see less of this in the forums too, and I want it to be because it happens less often, not because people are shamed into silence because something came up and they lost a team they didn’t mean to lose.

Posted by gillispie1 on 6/9/2020 12:55:00 PM (view original):

Posted by cbriese on 6/9/2020 12:40:00 PM (view original):
Why does it bother me? Because I believe people should simply be gracious, and say, "Congratulations, robinhood, on taking over Kansas. I did my best to leave you a solid core. I hope you can bring the Jayhawks to the same heights you brought Mississippi". Instead, you've taken what should be an exciting challenge and, at best, put a bad taste in his mouth.

if wronoj lost in an open competition for the job, i suspect his response would be much more in line with what you are saying.

we all know how much time and effort it takes to get one of these jobs, it sucks to lose out not in an open competition, but from an honest mistake re: renewal. i do also agree this raft of forgotten renewals is sort of annoying and sucks for those who get excited about jobs and then give them up. perhaps some improvements like those mentioned here would help.

along with the stuff mentioned here... CC renewals (standard in 2020), emy's comments on job qualifications... perhaps the game sitemailing / emailing coaches about impending job loss might help? a lot of the 'hey you are about to lose this job!' stuff on the HD pages strikes me as similar to the banner adds and cookie warnings on so many sites that our brains are trained to tune out without any conscious intervention. perhaps there's something to improve there, i'm not sure if it might help, but it definitely seems like these renewals are getting forgotten left and right, and to me that suggests there's something about the system, not just about the individuals making the mistake.

The game sends at least two old-fashioned emails to you warning about impending job loss. "YOU WILL LOSE THE PROGRAM YOU'VE BUILT."

Users at risk of losing their teams get no less than 6 warnings across a variety of methods and spread out over time.

If CC autobilling were added, seble would waste a lot of his time dealing with users who were autobilled who didn't want to be. Teams can be paid for with a combo of points credits and cash, the existing system treats users as capable of handling that level of choice. It's a good system.

The only obvious solution I can see to the immediate issue is for seble to stop being gracious about trying to help users who forget to renew. He's meant well, but this practice has clearly set an unreasonable expectation among some users.