Thanks admin. For the fielding coaches Topic

zbrent716
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Quote: Originally posted by hartjh14 on 2/15/2010
Quote: Originally posted by phillyfan33 on 2/15/2010Bench coach is an "Promotion" from Fielding Instructor ..is it not?
Not in terms of this game from what I've seen.

It absolutely is in this game. A coach will take a league minimum bench coach job over a more lucrative fielding coach offer.
2/15/2010 11:48 PM
MikeT23
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Quote: Originally Posted By deanod on 2/16/2010
Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 2/15/2010
If I can get a 75 FI and 80 everything else for the minimum, I don't know why I'd pay more.



What's wrong with having this as an option? You're still spending $6M more than you are on advance scouting


Because coach hiring will become unnecessary just like I see ADV scouting.

The more budget items that become unnecessary, the more dumbed down the game becomes.
2/16/2010 5:40 AM
hartjh14
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2/16/2010 7:13 AM
MikeT23
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The key was "in this game". Nothing else can be argued.
2/16/2010 8:28 AM
firemanrob
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Quote: Originally Posted By MikeT23 on 2/16/2010
Quote: Originally Posted By deanod on 2/16/2010

Quote: Originally posted by MikeT23 on 2/15/2010

If I can get a 75 FI and 80 everything else for the minimum, I don't know why I'd pay more.



What's wrong with having this as an option? You're still spending $6M more than you are on advance scouting.



Because coach hiring will become unnecessary just like I see ADV scouting.

The more budget items that become unnecessary, the more dumbed down the game becomes.
Next is HS/Coll scouting. People will whine enough to get them to show people every player and all that HS/Coll scouting will do is fine tune the projections that you see. That can be overcome by carefully watching how players improve and paying attention to original ratings, makeup, etc. Actually, I guess IFA scouting would work the same way. So there would be no need to budget for scouting or coaching.
2/16/2010 8:47 AM
gjello10
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To me, the biggest problem with coach hiring is that ML coaches ask for 10x what AAA coaches ask for and 40x what RL coaches ask for, yet ML coaches don't really do that much. If you don't end up having to bid out the wazoo for a FI, you can sign a scruby ML staff and a fantastic minor league staff for $6-8m as is. Since coaching has a lot to do with player development, and very little to do with anything else, and almost all players more or less do all of their developing in the minors, it seems to me that the minor league coaches are at least as important, if not more so, than the ML coaches (and, yes, I know that ML coaches have a small effect on the whole org, but still).
2/16/2010 9:48 AM
MikeT23
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As I understand it, it also affects decline. So, if you have crappy BL coaches and players in their 30s, you're playing with fire.
2/16/2010 9:52 AM
gjello10
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Quote: Originally Posted By MikeT23 on 2/16/2010
As I understand it, it also affects decline. So, if you have crappy BL coaches and players in their 30s, you're playing with fire.
You are correct. But it's still 10x the salary request for nothing close to 10x the benefit (IMO) and that's why the market doesn't work right.
2/16/2010 10:16 AM
MikeT23
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A 3rd year player makes 360k but that doesn't mean he's not better than the guy making 8m. The market is what it is. If you want to pay your AAA PC 2.8m and your ML PC 600k, you're welcome to it.
2/16/2010 10:44 AM
torrone
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2/16/2010 11:06 AM
gjello10
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Everything always is what it is, by definition. That's not an argument for or against anything. And players salary rules, which mimic RL union contract rules, negotiated under the anti-trust exemption, are not comparable to arbitrary demands generated by computer programs posing as coaches.

It has been proposed that coaches accept offers based more on money (and less on prestige/level) than they currently do. This has been suggested with regards to FI accepting BC positions for millions less. But I think it pertains to MiLB coaching as well. In RL, it's hard for me to imagine any real person accepting $150K to coach AA instead of $800K to coach Low A, and I think improved ability to hire down at a premium would induce people to spend more on coaches, and result in a wider distribution of outcomes by team based on the time/skill/money they devoted to the process. If making coach hiring meaningless "dumbs down" the game, I think this "smarts it up" a bit.

I enjoy coach hiring as it is, but I think this would a nice tweak.
2/16/2010 11:34 AM
MikeT23
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So, you'd take "mail boy" over CEO if "mail boy" paid more?

A lot of people look at their next career move when taking jobs. "Mail boy" at 250k is unemployable at his next job because, well, he's used to sorting mail for 50k a week. To apply it to coaching, I'm forced to believe AA coach is viewed as more "ML-ready" than a LoA guy. And, if LoA guy turns down the AA job because of money, he's viewed as the guy who doesn't care about the job, he cares about the money. I think most coaches want to move to the "next level".

Futhermore, you're basing your coaching values on what you believe to be true. It's possible that you're wrong.

2/16/2010 11:43 AM
shobob
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So why is it that bench coach has more prestige than fielding instructor? I would think that the "manager" position (that we don't hire) has the most prestige. Bench coach and fielding instructor should have equal prestige IMO.
2/16/2010 11:57 AM
MikeT23
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Bench coach makes the decisions when the manager is ejected. He sort of helps the manager oversee the entire team. Fielding instructors, presumably, don't know anything about pitching, hitting or baserunning.
2/16/2010 12:02 PM
shobob
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Bench coaches helping the manager run the ML team equals more prestige? A fielding instructor's duties affect the whole franchise, from top to bottom, and into the future. It just seems like the FI's job is more important, hence more value/prestige. I don't like the fact that admin caved to the complainers and provided more FIs. I would have liked it better if they made it so that if a guy gets offered both a BC and a FI position, he'd just go for the money. There are some dickwads (who have posted in this thread no less) who feel that the BC position is useless, so they hire FIs to their BC position at 600K, while other owners are stuck paying 2 mil for a 50s FI. That just doesn't seem right to me, considering the far-reaching implications of having a bad FI. Don't get me wrong, I don't think that everyone should have an 80s FI, but it just seems stupid to see some 80s and 90s rated FIs getting paid 600K to be a BC, when they could be making 2-3 mil as a FI
2/16/2010 12:14 PM
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Thanks admin. For the fielding coaches Topic
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