CS coming out and clarifying that this violates fair play guidelines, and will result in disciplinary action is not exactly the same as building a 3 billion dollar wall. It’s not an earth shattering violation, and it isn’t like a team can do this successfully more than once every dozen or so seasons, so yeah it is easy to overstate the harm. But it is probably a violation, and CS should recognize it, and deal with it.

"Hello Mr. Trentonjoe, I'm calling to inform you that your son was caught cheating on his math test today"
"What grade did he get?"
"C+"
"C+??? If he had gotten an A then it'd be an issue. MAYBE a B. But I'm not losing any sleep over him cheating and getting a C+"

1. I would be ****** if my kid got caught cheating and only got C+.

2. Of course it’s incredibly shady. I also think it’s kinda clever. It’s one of those things that violates the spirit of the rules but not what’s actually written.

Posted by shoe3 on 7/7/2018 6:50:00 PM (view original):
Report it anyway. These are the sort of shenanigans that *probably* violate fair play guidelines, and when we see it, we need to raise the ticket. Send the coach, the players, etc to CS.

It's not probably, it is a violation.

From the Fair Play Guidelines...

Cheating

All owners must play by the rules and requirements set forth by each game on our site. If an owner discovers a loophole, a way to cheat, or any other method of giving himself an unfair advantage, WhatIfSports reserves the right to take the necessary steps to correct the issue at any time without prior notification. Refunds or roster changes will not be given to any owner in this situation.

This could be argued as a loophole but it is definitely giving oneself an unfair advantage over all other DIII coaches that season.

Posted by Benis on 7/8/2018 5:00:00 PM (view original):
"Hello Mr. Trentonjoe, I'm calling to inform you that your son was caught cheating on his math test today"
"What grade did he get?"
"C+"
"C+??? If he had gotten an A then it'd be an issue. MAYBE a B. But I'm not losing any sleep over him cheating and getting a C+"

I was going to counter this with.....

Jr Benis..... "dad, I'll be 18 in a week, and I've had the same job for 4 years at the fine art museum. I decided to do some voluntary overtime, and dust some of the pieces. And I bumped a sculpture and it broke a piece off. Well, they let me go dad"

Benis.... "Get the **** out of my house!!!! What's wrong with you son?! You're a disgrace!"

Posted by gomiami1972 on 7/8/2018 6:40:00 PM (view original):
From the Fair Play Guidelines...

Cheating

All owners must play by the rules and requirements set forth by each game on our site. If an owner discovers a loophole, a way to cheat, or any other method of giving himself an unfair advantage, WhatIfSports reserves the right to take the necessary steps to correct the issue at any time without prior notification. Refunds or roster changes will not be given to any owner in this situation.

This could be argued as a loophole but it is definitely giving oneself an unfair advantage over all other DIII coaches that season.

I mostly agree with you but in this situation, he filled his scholarships so anyone could have seen that southern Utah wasn’t a real threat. He really didn’t gain an unfair advantage because everyone had access to the same information.

Posted by Trentonjoe on 7/8/2018 6:45:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 7/8/2018 6:40:00 PM (view original):
From the Fair Play Guidelines...

Cheating

All owners must play by the rules and requirements set forth by each game on our site. If an owner discovers a loophole, a way to cheat, or any other method of giving himself an unfair advantage, WhatIfSports reserves the right to take the necessary steps to correct the issue at any time without prior notification. Refunds or roster changes will not be given to any owner in this situation.

This could be argued as a loophole but it is definitely giving oneself an unfair advantage over all other DIII coaches that season.

I mostly agree with you but in this situation, he filled his scholarships so anyone could have seen that southern Utah wasn’t a real threat. He really didn’t gain an unfair advantage because everyone had access to the same information.

Not everyone had access to a DI and then DIII budget. He was able to level 4 (probably) a large part of the country for his new DIII team...but I think we're not too far apart on this one.

Posted by topdogggbm on 7/8/2018 6:42:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 7/8/2018 5:00:00 PM (view original):
"Hello Mr. Trentonjoe, I'm calling to inform you that your son was caught cheating on his math test today"
"What grade did he get?"
"C+"
"C+??? If he had gotten an A then it'd be an issue. MAYBE a B. But I'm not losing any sleep over him cheating and getting a C+"

I was going to counter this with.....

Jr Benis..... "dad, I'll be 18 in a week, and I've had the same job for 4 years at the fine art museum. I decided to do some voluntary overtime, and dust some of the pieces. And I bumped a sculpture and it broke a piece off. Well, they let me go dad"

Benis.... "Get the **** out of my house!!!! What's wrong with you son?! You're a disgrace!"

What 14 year old kid is working at a fine arts museum? Go bag groceries like a normal kid!

Posted by Benis on 7/8/2018 6:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by topdogggbm on 7/8/2018 6:42:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 7/8/2018 5:00:00 PM (view original):
"Hello Mr. Trentonjoe, I'm calling to inform you that your son was caught cheating on his math test today"
"What grade did he get?"
"C+"
"C+??? If he had gotten an A then it'd be an issue. MAYBE a B. But I'm not losing any sleep over him cheating and getting a C+"

I was going to counter this with.....

Jr Benis..... "dad, I'll be 18 in a week, and I've had the same job for 4 years at the fine art museum. I decided to do some voluntary overtime, and dust some of the pieces. And I bumped a sculpture and it broke a piece off. Well, they let me go dad"

Benis.... "Get the **** out of my house!!!! What's wrong with you son?! You're a disgrace!"

What 14 year old kid is working at a fine arts museum? Go bag groceries like a normal kid!

Hahaha. Well you obviously had a firm hand on his upbringing. You pushed him to aim for the moon, you brut!

Posted by Benis on 7/8/2018 6:53:00 PM (view original):

Posted by topdogggbm on 7/8/2018 6:42:00 PM (view original):

Posted by Benis on 7/8/2018 5:00:00 PM (view original):
"Hello Mr. Trentonjoe, I'm calling to inform you that your son was caught cheating on his math test today"
"What grade did he get?"
"C+"
"C+??? If he had gotten an A then it'd be an issue. MAYBE a B. But I'm not losing any sleep over him cheating and getting a C+"

I was going to counter this with.....

Jr Benis..... "dad, I'll be 18 in a week, and I've had the same job for 4 years at the fine art museum. I decided to do some voluntary overtime, and dust some of the pieces. And I bumped a sculpture and it broke a piece off. Well, they let me go dad"

Benis.... "Get the **** out of my house!!!! What's wrong with you son?! You're a disgrace!"

What 14 year old kid is working at a fine arts museum? Go bag groceries like a normal kid!

Does working in a candle store count as being normal?

Hmmmm..... Bed Bath and Beyond? Yea I'd consider that normal. But something like Yankee Candle? Ehhh, I don't know about that one.

Posted by topdogggbm on 7/8/2018 7:40:00 PM (view original):
Hmmmm..... Bed Bath and Beyond? Yea I'd consider that normal. But something like Yankee Candle? Ehhh, I don't know about that one.

Actually have a friend who works at Yankee Candle, pretty funny you mention that.

Posted by gomiami1972 on 7/8/2018 6:40:00 PM (view original):
From the Fair Play Guidelines...

Cheating

All owners must play by the rules and requirements set forth by each game on our site. If an owner discovers a loophole, a way to cheat, or any other method of giving himself an unfair advantage, WhatIfSports reserves the right to take the necessary steps to correct the issue at any time without prior notification. Refunds or roster changes will not be given to any owner in this situation.

This could be argued as a loophole but it is definitely giving oneself an unfair advantage over all other DIII coaches that season.

But this isn't a loophole, it's a feature of two-stage recruiting.

The game is designed to let any coach who knows they're going to switch jobs get a head start on recruiting their new school. You can argue the wisdom of that, but not the fairness.

Anyone who has a beef here has it with WIS, not mjs.

Posted by kcsundevil on 7/9/2018 11:38:00 AM (view original):

Posted by gomiami1972 on 7/8/2018 6:40:00 PM (view original):
From the Fair Play Guidelines...

Cheating

All owners must play by the rules and requirements set forth by each game on our site. If an owner discovers a loophole, a way to cheat, or any other method of giving himself an unfair advantage, WhatIfSports reserves the right to take the necessary steps to correct the issue at any time without prior notification. Refunds or roster changes will not be given to any owner in this situation.

This could be argued as a loophole but it is definitely giving oneself an unfair advantage over all other DIII coaches that season.

But this isn't a loophole, it's a feature of two-stage recruiting.

The game is designed to let any coach who knows they're going to switch jobs get a head start on recruiting their new school. You can argue the wisdom of that, but not the fairness.

Anyone who has a beef here has it with WIS, not mjs.

We are debating the letter vs the spirit of the law. The Fair Play guideline doesn't spell out this specific scenario; no codified law can describe every possible permutation. You don't see it in writing, therefore you believe it is allowed. I see using a DI budget to recruit for a future DIII school as a method of creating an unfair advantage and is outside the intent of what the programmer had in mind.

Maybe when the Supreme Court has a ninth Justice, we can make our cases and let them decide.