Thanks for putting up a somewhat thoughtful post, strikeout. These forums probably aren't the best place to be asking that question, because we are all white. If you want a really well-informed answer, I would suggest approaching your local chapter of the NAACP or a similar group, or even going to a protest yourself, if it's still happening in your area. The people there will give you better answers than I ever will be able to, because they live that experience.

Here's some ideas I can provide you.

First, a discussion over whether police brutality is a "major problem" is always going to be ridiculous because it's meaningless and inherently based upon semantics. We protest because EVERY instance of police brutality is wrong and deserves to be protested. Ending police violence should be the goal. Yes, it's unlikely, but we have to all agree on a goal before we can minimize a problem. The police are there to protect and serve. They should not be killing.

So here's some policies that I have heard suggested:
  • Some sort of community accountability group to monitor the police department and ensure that police are doing their job correctly
  • The "good" police officers NEED to call out the bad ones before they kill people. Warning signs should be treated seriously. Police officers who are fired in one branch should NOT be rehired in others. The killer cop in Minneapolis had a history of violence.
  • There needs to be a higher bar for who should be allowed into the police force. Some sort of longer education program to weed out the bullies who are in it to get some sort of power. The only people allowed to police the communities should be ones who actually want to help people.
  • Demilitarize the ******* police. They shouldn't have weapons from the army. They shouldn't have tear gas, which, from what I have read, is banned in war. Stop asking for ******* tanks and heavy weapons. You don't need them.
  • Mandate not only the usage of body cameras, but also that they be turned on at all times.
  • When a riot is going on, don't impose a curfew. I have seen zero evidence suggesting that it actually de-escalates tensions, fact is that it does the exact opposite. A curfew gives police the opportunity to wage war on protesters.
  • Prosecute the police when they **** up. Already we are seeing the makings of an attempted cover-up in Minneapolis. This is why the community should be vigilant. If we let prosecutors, who work with police, assign justice without pushback they will be lenient. George Zimmermann, for instance, should NEVER have been allowed to walk free.
  • Have community meet and greets and outreach programs for the police department. Normalize forums where citizens can make suggestions and voice complaints. This should help get the community more comfortable with police, and likewise make the officers see people as people. Everyone should be able to trust the police.
  • Allow. Protests. To. Happen. Without. Creating. Violence. If people start rioting, you can react. If they are kneeling in front of you, you have no right to tear gas them. In some cities, the police are marching WITH protestors. It happened in my city. You don't see riots in those places.
  • Don't overpolice minority communities. If you look for trouble, you will find it. I remember when we got CCCP to admit that if he were a police officer, he would racially profile POC because they, as a group commit more crimes. Can we all see how this mindset leads to systemic racism?

I'm sure there are more suggestions that are out there, but these are ones that I have seen often. This just over policing; there are about 50 other policies for overall systemic racism that I would suggest (and I remember having those discussions with you in the past).
6/1/2020 5:53 PM
I need to get some work done, so I will read your list later. It looks like you worked hard on it, so I want to read it with care. I’m sure there’s some really good stuff in it. But, I will just say NOPE to your first part. This whole “you don’t fit a certain group identity group so you have to shut up” is stupid. I’m not playing the post-modernist game. It’s dangerous. We can have an opinion without fitting a label. Second, you have said that you are one of the ones protesting. Why are you protesting? You actually covered this. I’m not asking you to repeat yourself. My question is rhetorical and not necessarily aimed at you.

Also, I would like to see your evidence for systemic racism. Please point me to the policy or policies that are racist and in which system are you referring? If you show evidence of the racism within a system, I will be the first there to help you fight it. Hell, I’ll buy your plane ticket and pay for your meals.

Remember equity and equality of opportunity are different. Forced equity is actually a very dangerous goal. The 20th century proved that. In countries where this was instituted, everyone had an equal outcome in that they starved to death. At least 200 million died at the hands of the radical left (the radical right was just as bad). Equality of opportunity is a virtuous goal. We all should fight for that. My question is what opportunities are presented to certain groups that others don’t have in the west? I’ll admit that history plays a major role in disparities. Generational wealth is a big factor. What I am asking is what opportunities are being suppressed by “the system” (whatever that means) for certain groups today?
6/1/2020 6:15 PM
Posted by strikeout26 on 6/1/2020 5:13:00 PM (view original):
This will be my last post on the subject as I am more interested in reading others opinions than posting my own (I will block rsp so that I can actually read intelligent responses).

First off, I fully support people’s rights to protest. We need to discern between the protesters and the rioters. The people beating old ladies and looting Target and Rodeo Drive are not doing that in the name of justice. They are just dumbasses taking advantage of a situation.

Now to my question. For those that see police brutality as a major problem in the country, what are you hoping to achieve with the protests? What is the end goal? I am asking seriously.

Also, is your position based on actual evidence or is strictly based on anecdote. If it’s based on actual evidence, please provide because all of the studies that I see show that police brutality is not a major problem and that people of color are not unfairly targeted. I would prefer evidence that is based on a multi-variate analysis.

I would prefer to not see answers like “end police violence” as any rational person would agree that is an unrealistic proposition. No matter how strong policies and training are within law enforcement, bad cops are going to slip through the cracks. I am okay with “minimize police violence” as an answer, but please tell me how you think this can be achieved.

I post this with all sincerity as I truly want to know how people that think differently than me formulate their opinions.

P.S. I saw one of Tang’s posts where he basically said that there’s no way to prove racial intent in these cases, but that doesn’t mean they weren’t racist. I agree with you, Tang. I’m just very cautious in assuming intent especially since the far left calls everything they disagree with “racist.” It kind of degrades the term. Hell, someone (won’t name any names) started a thread about me yesterday calling me racist simply because I laid out a thoughtful, fact-based argument that he disagreed with. I have learned that people do this because they are not smart enough to actually refute an argument so they attack character. It’s quite the low-class move.

Now, time to block rsp so that I can read actual opinions and not have to deal with trolls that think 35% of America are racist without a single shred of evidence to support that.
wow....a somewhat intelligent post!! I think what people are trying to do with the protests is bring more attention to the problem. That is why Colin Kaepernick took a knee for the national anthem. Not to disrespect the anthem, the country or the men and women who serve (and served) in the military.. He did so to bring attention to what he saw as a big problem in the United States. Unfortunately, it didn't work very well. I had an argument with my 18 year old son yesterday. he said that the looting was justified, because peaceful protest was not getting it done. I objected by saying that there is no justification for looting,or destruction of private party. His response was that the big corporations could afford the losses. My response was that it doesn't matter whether the big corporations could withstand the losses or not. It is stealing and that is against the law. All looting and rioting does is give opponents the chance to say that the people protesting are thugs and thieves and should be in jail. It also takes away from the main issue. For the last few days I have very little talk about George Floyd and the evil that was done to him. Most of the talk has been about the havoc the looters are causing.

strikeout, I also disagree with your statement that " the far left calls everything they disagree with “racist.” " I don't think that is true, just as it is not true that the far right calls everything they disagree with fake news or socialism or liberalism. I've said many times, that while I have some liberal points of view, I don't think I'm a liberal. More like a moderate.
6/1/2020 6:22 PM
Posted by tangplay on 6/1/2020 5:53:00 PM (view original):
Thanks for putting up a somewhat thoughtful post, strikeout. These forums probably aren't the best place to be asking that question, because we are all white. If you want a really well-informed answer, I would suggest approaching your local chapter of the NAACP or a similar group, or even going to a protest yourself, if it's still happening in your area. The people there will give you better answers than I ever will be able to, because they live that experience.

Here's some ideas I can provide you.

First, a discussion over whether police brutality is a "major problem" is always going to be ridiculous because it's meaningless and inherently based upon semantics. We protest because EVERY instance of police brutality is wrong and deserves to be protested. Ending police violence should be the goal. Yes, it's unlikely, but we have to all agree on a goal before we can minimize a problem. The police are there to protect and serve. They should not be killing.

So here's some policies that I have heard suggested:
  • Some sort of community accountability group to monitor the police department and ensure that police are doing their job correctly
  • The "good" police officers NEED to call out the bad ones before they kill people. Warning signs should be treated seriously. Police officers who are fired in one branch should NOT be rehired in others. The killer cop in Minneapolis had a history of violence.
  • There needs to be a higher bar for who should be allowed into the police force. Some sort of longer education program to weed out the bullies who are in it to get some sort of power. The only people allowed to police the communities should be ones who actually want to help people.
  • Demilitarize the ******* police. They shouldn't have weapons from the army. They shouldn't have tear gas, which, from what I have read, is banned in war. Stop asking for ******* tanks and heavy weapons. You don't need them.
  • Mandate not only the usage of body cameras, but also that they be turned on at all times.
  • When a riot is going on, don't impose a curfew. I have seen zero evidence suggesting that it actually de-escalates tensions, fact is that it does the exact opposite. A curfew gives police the opportunity to wage war on protesters.
  • Prosecute the police when they **** up. Already we are seeing the makings of an attempted cover-up in Minneapolis. This is why the community should be vigilant. If we let prosecutors, who work with police, assign justice without pushback they will be lenient. George Zimmermann, for instance, should NEVER have been allowed to walk free.
  • Have community meet and greets and outreach programs for the police department. Normalize forums where citizens can make suggestions and voice complaints. This should help get the community more comfortable with police, and likewise make the officers see people as people. Everyone should be able to trust the police.
  • Allow. Protests. To. Happen. Without. Creating. Violence. If people start rioting, you can react. If they are kneeling in front of you, you have no right to tear gas them. In some cities, the police are marching WITH protestors. It happened in my city. You don't see riots in those places.
  • Don't overpolice minority communities. If you look for trouble, you will find it. I remember when we got CCCP to admit that if he were a police officer, he would racially profile POC because they, as a group commit more crimes. Can we all see how this mindset leads to systemic racism?

I'm sure there are more suggestions that are out there, but these are ones that I have seen often. This just over policing; there are about 50 other policies for overall systemic racism that I would suggest (and I remember having those discussions with you in the past).
Fine!!! My work can wait. You are a bad influence on me. I don’t like you anymore. I’ll read your list.

1. a little vague for my taste. I’m not sure how this would work and who gets to define “correctly.”

2. I don’t like blanket policies like this. I have seen cops unjustly fired and they are given opportunities with other precincts. I’m not a fan of the one strike and you’re out policy. Cases should be evaluated individually.

3. love this!!!

4. I don’t have a firm opinion on this yet. I lean towards this equipment being necessary, but I waiver. Let me think in this.

5. yep! This protects both citizens and law enforcement. Should be a no-brainer.

6. curfews have worked well in Atlanta. Like I said yesterday, Mayor Bottoms and Governor Kemp should be held up as a model for how to handle these situations.

7. George Zimmerman wasn’t a police officer, but I will say that you point has some merit. The Ahmad Arbery case here in South GA is an example. Former cop turned vigilante was buddies with DA and almost escaped due consequences. In the end, they got it right (once again thanks to Governor Kemp) but you’re point stands. Saying that, the police are entitled to the same due process as anyone else. We are always very quick to rush to judgement (Michael Brown case for example).

8. I like it.

9. The rioters could give two ***** about the cause that people are protesting for. They are their to cause trouble. The violence is not being perpetrated by the police at the protests. They have a duty to keep cities from being burnt to the ground.

10. No, this is not evidence of systemic racism. High crime areas are going to have more police surveillance. Why would police hang out in areas where nothing happens? It would be pointless. Unfortunately, black communities usually have higher crime rates. I hate that it is, but it is. Why that is can be debated, but it is.
6/1/2020 6:32 PM
Posted by wylie715 on 6/1/2020 6:22:00 PM (view original):
Posted by strikeout26 on 6/1/2020 5:13:00 PM (view original):
This will be my last post on the subject as I am more interested in reading others opinions than posting my own (I will block rsp so that I can actually read intelligent responses).

First off, I fully support people’s rights to protest. We need to discern between the protesters and the rioters. The people beating old ladies and looting Target and Rodeo Drive are not doing that in the name of justice. They are just dumbasses taking advantage of a situation.

Now to my question. For those that see police brutality as a major problem in the country, what are you hoping to achieve with the protests? What is the end goal? I am asking seriously.

Also, is your position based on actual evidence or is strictly based on anecdote. If it’s based on actual evidence, please provide because all of the studies that I see show that police brutality is not a major problem and that people of color are not unfairly targeted. I would prefer evidence that is based on a multi-variate analysis.

I would prefer to not see answers like “end police violence” as any rational person would agree that is an unrealistic proposition. No matter how strong policies and training are within law enforcement, bad cops are going to slip through the cracks. I am okay with “minimize police violence” as an answer, but please tell me how you think this can be achieved.

I post this with all sincerity as I truly want to know how people that think differently than me formulate their opinions.

P.S. I saw one of Tang’s posts where he basically said that there’s no way to prove racial intent in these cases, but that doesn’t mean they weren’t racist. I agree with you, Tang. I’m just very cautious in assuming intent especially since the far left calls everything they disagree with “racist.” It kind of degrades the term. Hell, someone (won’t name any names) started a thread about me yesterday calling me racist simply because I laid out a thoughtful, fact-based argument that he disagreed with. I have learned that people do this because they are not smart enough to actually refute an argument so they attack character. It’s quite the low-class move.

Now, time to block rsp so that I can read actual opinions and not have to deal with trolls that think 35% of America are racist without a single shred of evidence to support that.
wow....a somewhat intelligent post!! I think what people are trying to do with the protests is bring more attention to the problem. That is why Colin Kaepernick took a knee for the national anthem. Not to disrespect the anthem, the country or the men and women who serve (and served) in the military.. He did so to bring attention to what he saw as a big problem in the United States. Unfortunately, it didn't work very well. I had an argument with my 18 year old son yesterday. he said that the looting was justified, because peaceful protest was not getting it done. I objected by saying that there is no justification for looting,or destruction of private party. His response was that the big corporations could afford the losses. My response was that it doesn't matter whether the big corporations could withstand the losses or not. It is stealing and that is against the law. All looting and rioting does is give opponents the chance to say that the people protesting are thugs and thieves and should be in jail. It also takes away from the main issue. For the last few days I have very little talk about George Floyd and the evil that was done to him. Most of the talk has been about the havoc the looters are causing.

strikeout, I also disagree with your statement that " the far left calls everything they disagree with “racist.” " I don't think that is true, just as it is not true that the far right calls everything they disagree with fake news or socialism or liberalism. I've said many times, that while I have some liberal points of view, I don't think I'm a liberal. More like a moderate.
You are moderate. I would agree with that. I would probably say you’re “left-leaning.” And yes, that is a axiomatically a tactic of the far left. Like I said, my point was proven last night but someone in this site. B_L also used the same tactic. Albeit, he is actually pretty intelligent and could have a rational conversation when he wanted. But he was also always very quick to play the race card. I definitely don’t consider you far-left and I don’t consider tang far left and neither of you are quick to make those accusations.
6/1/2020 6:37 PM
remember George Floyd
6/1/2020 6:41 PM
My first point was about how as a white person, I do not have the ability to fully speak to the African American experience. As I can not fully understand the problem, I probably won't be able to offer the best solutions. I'm not sure what part of that you disagree with.

Before going into this, I would like to point out that my goal is not equality of outcomes. I want to make that perfectly clear. It is equality of opportunity. Furthermore, I will fully agree with you that in terms of the intersectionality of oppression, classism will usually undergrid racism. However, it is important to point out that due to Jim Crow and slavery, African Americans are at an inherent disadvantage in terms of, you guessed it, generational wealth. If your argument is that poverty is a huge problem, I would completely agree. Many racial issues could be fixed by tackling economic ones. In terms of systemic racism, here's what I've got.

CRIMINAL JUSTICE:
Here's a really good article:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/opinions/wp/2018/09/18/theres-overwhelming-evidence-that-the-criminal-justice-system-is-racist-heres-the-proof/
I would suggest reading it all, because it contains a TON of credible studies concerning every aspect of the criminal justice system, but here are some good tidbits:
  • In their book “Suspect Citizens,” Frank R. Baumgartner, Derek A. Epp and Kelsey Shoub reviewed 20 million traffic stops. In an interview with The Post, they shared what they found: “Blacks are almost twice as likely to be pulled over as whites — even though whites drive more on average,” “blacks are more likely to be searched following a stop,” and “just by getting in a car, a black driver has about twice the odds of being pulled over, and about four times the odds of being searched.” They found that blacks were more likely to be searched despite the fact they’re less likely to be found with contraband as a result of those searches.
  • A 2015 statistical analysis of police shootings from 2011 to 2014 found that the racial disparity in police shootings of black people could not be explained by higher crime rates in majority-black communities.
  • Another ACLU study, this time on the use of stop-and-frisk in Milwaukee between 2010 and 2017, found that in nearly half of the more than 700,000 such stops, the police failed to demonstrate reasonable suspicion as required by the Constitution. The study found that between pedestrian stops and traffic stops, black people were six times more likely to be stopped and searched than white people, and that less than 1 percent of those searches turned up any contraband. Here again, while black and Latino drivers were more likely to be searched, they were 20 percent less likely to be in possession of any contraband.
  • A national study of misdemeanor arrests published this year in the Boston University Law Review found that the “black arrest rate is at least twice as high as the white arrest rate for disorderly conduct, drug possession, simple assault, theft, vagrancy, and vandalism. The black arrest rate for prostitution is almost five times higher than the white arrest rate, and the black arrest rate for gambling is almost ten times higher.”
  • Missouri has been keeping data on traffic stops for 18 years, and for 18 years, the numbers consistently show that statewide, black people are more likely to be pulled over than white people. The data from 2017 showed the problem actually got worse, with blacks 85 percent more likely to be stopped.
  • A 2016 study from a consortium of civil rights groups found wide racial disparities in the suspension of driver’s licenses of California residents. Some black and Latino communities had suspension rates five times the state average.
  • As of May, data from New York City showed that black people are arrested for marijuana at eight times the rate of white people. In Manhattan, it’s 15 times as much. Black neighborhoods produce far more arrests than white neighborhoods, despite data showing a similar rate at which residents complain about marijuana use.
  • When The Post in 2014 reviewed 400 recent instances of questionable asset forfeiture, a majority of the motorists who had property confiscated by the police were nonwhite.
  • According to figures from the National Registry of Exonerations (NER) black people are about five times more likely to go to prison for drug possession than white people. According to exoneration data, black people are also 12 times more likely to be wrongly convicted of drug crimes.
  • Not included in these wrongful conviction figures are cases in which police and narcotics task forces conducted mass arrests of entire black or Latino neighborhoods or towns. Hundreds of people were persuaded to plead guilty to drug charges. By the NER’s estimate, there have been more than 1,800 such “group exonerations” in 15 cities since 1989. Almost all those exonerated were black or Latino.
  • Black people comprise about 12.5 percent of drug users but 29 percent of arrests for drug crimes and 33 percent of those incarcerated.
  • A 2011 study from Michigan State University College of Law found that between 1990 and 2010, state prosecutors struck about 53 percent of black people eligible for juries in criminal cases, vs. about 26 percent of white people. The study’s authors concluded that the chance of this occurring in a race-neutral process was less than 1 in 10 trillion. Even after adjusting for excuses given by prosecutors that tend to correlate with race, the 2-to-1 discrepancy remained. The state legislature had previously passed a law stating that death penalty defendants who could demonstrate racial bias in jury selection could have their sentences changed to life without parole. The legislature later repealed that law.
  • While white people make up less than half of the country’s murder victims, a 2003 study by Amnesty International found that about 80 percent of the people on death row in the United States killed a white person.
  • Black people are also more likely to be wrongly convicted of murder when the victim was white. Only about 15 percent of people killed by black people were white, but 31 percent of black exonorees were wrongly convicted of killing white people. More generally, black people convicted of murder are 50 percent more likely to be innocent than white people convicted of murder.
  • Innocent black people are also 3.5 times more likely than white people to be wrongly convicted of sexual assault and 12 times more likely to be wrongly convicted of drug crimes. (And remember, data on wrongful convictions is limited in that it can only consider the wrongful convictions we know about.)
  • A 2014 study of Manhattan criminal cases found that black defendants were 19 percent more likely to be offered plea deals that included jail time.
  • A survey of data from the U.S. Sentencing Commission last year found that when black men and white men commit the same crime, black men on average receive a sentence almost 20 percent longer. The research controlled for variables such as age and prior criminal history.
  • A 2007 Harvard study found sentencing discrepancies among black people, depending on the darkness of their skin. The study looked at 67,000 first-time felons in Georgia from 1995 to 2002. The average sentence for white men was 2,689 days. The average for black men was 378 days longer. But light-skinned blacks received sentences of about three and a half months longer than whites. Medium-skinned blacks received a sentence of about a year longer. Dark-skinned blacks received sentences of a year and a half longer.
  • A study of suspensions in Chicago schools from 2013 to 2014 found that black male students were more than five times more likely to be suspended than white and Asian male students. Black female students were seven times more likely than white and Asian female students. After adjusting for academic level and social disadvantages, black males were still five times more likely to be suspended, while the disparity for black females grew to 13 times more likely.
  • According to a 2014 study by the Vera Institute of Justice, black and Latino defendants in New York City were more likely to be detained before trial for comparable crimes. They were also more likely to have charges dismissed. The study didn’t look at this, but that may have been because they were more likely to be wrongly arrested in the first place. The study found that race played a role at nearly every step in the process, from arrest to detention to setting bail to sentencing.
  • A 2011 study of bail in five large U.S. counties found that blacks received $7,000 higher bail than whites for violent crimes, $13,000 higher for drug crimes and $10,000 higher for crimes related to public order. These disparities were calculated after adjusting for the seriousness of the crime, criminal history and other variables.

HOUSING:
Here's another really good article:
https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/race/reports/2019/08/07/472617/systemic-inequality-displacement-exclusion-segregation/
It talks about the history of housing discrimination and how it still affects POC today.

Over time, single-family zoning emerged and replaced race-based zoning as one of the most popular local governing tools for segregating American communities. This policy prevented the construction of apartment buildings and multifamily units in certain neighborhoods, ensuring that only those who could afford single-family homes could live there.75 As white households typically had higher incomes and access to a range of federal home loan programs, single-family zoning produced racially segregated neighborhoods without explicit race-based ordinances. With a greater tax base and support from federal programs, these areas could afford public goods that others could not and, as a result, experienced greater real estate appreciation.76 At the same time, city planners zoned areas adjacent to neighborhoods with apartment buildings and multifamily units—which were predominantly low-income and Black—for industrial and commercial use.77 These zoning decisions concentrated poverty and exposed vulnerable people to dangerous environmental hazards. This all but ensured that property values in these communities would appreciate at much slower rates.78 Single-family zoning persists to this day and helps maintain existing patterns of racial segregation in communities across the country.79

The harmful effects of government-backed segregation also produced racial inequities in access to public spaces, public goods, and increased exposure to environmental hazards.80 Communities of color often have less access to grocery stores, child care facilities, and other important neighborhood resources.81 They are also more likely to have hazardous waste facilities in close proximity.82 These disparities—along with the chronic devaluation of Black-owned property—contribute to differences in home values and appreciation. While the median white homeowner’s property is worth $219,600, the median Black homeowner’s property is worth just $152,700.83 As noted in CAP’s recent report, white homeowners also have more than double the mean net housing wealth—home value minus debt—of Black homeowners: $215,800 compared with just $94,400.84 Overall, segregation fueled the wealth-building capacity of white communities while simultaneously undermining wealth accumulation and economic well-being in communities of color.

HEALTHCARE:
The public health crisis in America disproportionately affects POC.
https://tcf.org/content/report/racism-inequality-health-care-african-americans/?agreed=1

Even with improved access to medical care under the ACA, the disparities in health outcomes between African Americans and whites are stark. African-American women are three times more likely to die of pregnancy-related causes than white women (see Figure 1).25 The African-American infant mortality rate is twice the rate for white infants (see Figure 2).26 African Americans are more likely to die from cancer and heart disease than whites, and are at greater risk for the onset of diabetes.27 However, death rates for African Americans with cancer and heart disease did drop over a fifteen year period.28 Across many chronic illnesses, however, African Americans are still more likely to die compared to other racial and ethnic groups.

Across the board, POC have a higher mortality rate for illnesses and conditions. They are also far more likely to be obese, even adjusting for poverty and area within the US.
Here are some studies about the racism within the health care system:
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(17)30569-X/fulltext
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK24693/
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11606-013-2583-1
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0277953613005121?via%3Dihub

  • The 37 studies included in this review were almost solely conducted in the U.S. and with physicians. Statistically significant evidence of racist beliefs, emotions or practices among healthcare providers in relation to minority groups was evident in 26 of these studies. Although a number of measurement approaches were utilized, a limited range of constructs was assessed.
  • Blacks, Hispanics, and some Asian populations, when compared with whites, appear to have lower levels of health insurance coverage, with Hispanics facing greater barriers to health insurance than any other group
  • Research reveals systematic racial differences in the kind and quality of medical care received by Medicare beneficiaries (Escarce et al., 1993; McBean and Gornick, 1994). In 1992, black Medicare beneficiaries were less likely than their white counterparts to receive any of the 16 most commonly performed hospital procedures (McBean and Gornick, 1994). The differences were largest for referral-sensitive procedures. The Medicare files showed only four nonelective procedures that black Medicare beneficiaries received more frequently than whites—all procedures (such as the amputation of a lower limb and the removal of both testes) that reflect delayed diagnosis or initial failure in the management of chronic disease. Since a greater percentage of black than white Medicare beneficiaries make out-of-pocket payments for deductibles and copayments (McBean and Gornick, 1994), this burden could contribute to less use of ambulatory medical care and to the postponement or avoidance of treatment.
  • Some differences in medical care may be due to stereotypes of different groups held by health care providers. The authors of Unequal Treatment (Institute of Medicine, 2002) argue that unconscious or unthinking discrimination based on negative stereotypes, even in the absence of conscious prejudice, may contribute to systematic bias in care.
EDUCATION:
POC consistently have worse educations than white people. Personally, I believe that this disparity is probably tied more into class than race, but racism definitely still exists in the education sector.
https://www.equityinhighered.org/indicators/u-s-population-trends-and-educational-attainment/educational-attainment-by-race-and-ethnicity/
https://www.brookings.edu/articles/unequal-opportunity-race-and-education/
  • Even within urban school districts, schools with high concentrations of low-income and minority students receive fewer instructional resources than others. And tracking systems exacerbate these inequalities by segregating many low-income and minority students within schools. In combination, these policies leave minority students with fewer and lower-quality books, curriculum materials, laboratories, and computers; significantly larger class sizes; less qualified and experienced teachers; and less access to high-quality curriculum. Many schools serving low-income and minority students do not even offer the math and science courses needed for college, and they provide lower-quality teaching in the classes they do offer. It all adds up.
  • Since the 1966 Coleman report, Equality of Educational Opportunity, another debate has waged as to whether money makes a difference to educational outcomes. It is certainly possible to spend money ineffectively; however, studies that have developed more sophisticated measures of schooling show how money, properly spent, makes a difference. Over the past 30 years, a large body of research has shown that four factors consistently influence student achievement: all else equal, students perform better if they are educated in smaller schools where they are well known (300 to 500 students is optimal), have smaller class sizes (especially at the elementary level), receive a challenging curriculum, and have more highly qualified teachers. Minority students are much less likely than white children to have any of these resources. In predominantly minority schools, which most students of color attend, schools are large (on average, more than twice as large as predominantly white schools and reaching 3,000 students or more in most cities); on average, class sizes are 15 percent larger overall (80 percent larger for non-special education classes); curriculum offerings and materials are lower in quality; and teachers are much less qualified in terms of levels of education, certification, and training in the fields they teach. And in integrated schools, as UCLA professor Jeannie Oakes described in the 1980s and Harvard professor Gary Orfield’s research has recently confirmed, most minority students are segregated in lower-track classes with larger class sizes, less qualified teachers, and lower-quality curriculum.
  • What happens when students of color do get access to more equal opportunities’ Studies find that curriculum quality and teacher skill make more difference to educational outcomes than the initial test scores or racial backgrounds of students. Analyses of national data from both the High School and Beyond Surveys and the National Educational Longitudinal Surveys have demonstrated that, while there are dramatic differences among students of various racial and ethnic groups in course-taking in such areas as math, science, and foreign language, for students with similar course-taking records, achievement test score differences by race or ethnicity narrow substantially.
I'm sure there's more, but these four areas cover a lot and are the best examples I could find.
6/1/2020 7:13 PM
Damn strikeout, you're making me work hard today. I don't have a lot to disagree with in terms of your other post. We agree on a majority of the solutions, and that's what matters. You didn't seem to have a strong objection to any of my suggestions, so I won't argue about stuff that doesn't matter a whole lot.

I just realized that I forgot voting discrimination in my long post. Throw that one up there. All the talk about Kemp reminded me.
6/1/2020 7:21 PM (edited)
I, for one, am glad to hear that Mayor bottoms has good (common) sense. Since Biden seems to have backed himself into a corner (again!) by pandering the VP spot to a female person, and now all this pressure that the female person VP should be of color...............then Mayor Bottoms should be, well Bottoms up for the VP spot.

She's certainly preferable to me than the candidate who lost to Gov. Kemp, or Kamala (not colored enough.........and I ain't talking skin tone!) Harris, or Amy K..............oh wait, She's only colored if'n you use a black light.
6/1/2020 7:56 PM
Thank you all for this exchange.
6/1/2020 8:01 PM
Posted by laramiebob on 6/1/2020 7:56:00 PM (view original):
I, for one, am glad to hear that Mayor bottoms has good (common) sense. Since Biden seems to have backed himself into a corner (again!) by pandering the VP spot to a female person, and now all this pressure that the female person VP should be of color...............then Mayor Bottoms should be, well Bottoms up for the VP spot.

She's certainly preferable to me than the candidate who lost to Gov. Kemp, or Kamala (not colored enough.........and I ain't talking skin tone!) Harris, or Amy K..............oh wait, She's only colored if'n you use a black light.
She’s a true class act and like I said, she works great with Kemp which means she can work across the aisle. Stacy Abrams is an idiot. I actually respected her more than Kemp when they were running against each other, but that shifted quickly post election. She cried about election rigging that didn’t exist. That bothered me. But after seeing her slob on Biden for the VP job, she really lost me. It’s one thing to want the position. That’s fine, but she has almost been on her knees begging. Watch her whine he doesn’t pick her. That’s what she’s good at.
6/1/2020 8:18 PM
Still think Biden is an idiot if he doesn’t choose Tammy Duckworth. Talk about checking the boxes.

Edit: Biden is an idiot either way. That’s one thing the left and right can agree on. He is just more of an idiot if he doesn’t choose her

6/1/2020 8:19 PM
I would love to be able to vote for president, but this will be two elections straight where neither party has given me that privilege. I wish Justin Amash would have went through with running as a libertarian. I like him. Seems to have character.
6/1/2020 8:22 PM
You must be young.

I've lost count of how many times the 2 "major" parties have give me sheitty choices. It is what it is.
When the POTUS candidate is very old (the case usually lately, excepting Obama) I vote giving major consideration to the possibility of death in office.
For example, when McCain picked Palin he lost my vote as she was beyond daft.

So, I'll be looking at the VP choice again, as Flump is very old and so is Biden.
Thus Pence vs. ???
Not a high bar to surpass IMO.

Bottoms likely does it.
so...........
Bottoms up, I say.
Good campaign slogan for Biden, too.
Methinks he likes a decent Martini.
6/1/2020 8:43 PM
Lol...Tara Reade would appreciate that. Too soon?!? My bad.

6/1/2020 8:56 PM
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