pharrop, I appreciated your comment with respect to D'Antoni getting "criticized for not coaching when sometimes coaching is not coaching." It reminds a lot of the criticism of/lack of respect for Roy Williams, one of the best college basketball coaches of all time. Now, obviously I am not an unbiased observer when it comes to Roy Williams, so feel free to take everything I say about him with a rather large grain of salt. But he's another guy who takes a lot of heat for being supposedly inflexible from a systematic perspective and too slow to make changes, either in the course of an individual game or the season as a whole. But as you alluded to, sometimes it's a lot harder to NOT make changes when things seem to not be going well, and instead trust your system and your players to prove their worth in the end.

Posted by robusk on 8/21/2020 1:03:00 PM (view original):
Great list pharrop. Thanks for sharing. You and Ben both know way more than me so I am curious why you both have Mike Malone so low? I don't think he is great or anything. I am just not sure what about him makes him considered worse than similar coaches like Clifford, Vogel, Gentry, Brown, Thibs at this point.

Also, one quibble I would make: we seem to have determined as a society that we can't criticize coaches for some reason. I don't understand it. I can tune into tons of NBA games and the analysts are just railroading some player for some mistake he made like missing a cutter or making a bad read or something. That same analyst will crucify a ref for making a bad call. But yet he will go out of his way to say we shouldn't criticize coaches. Yes, it is a very hard job. But you know what? So is being an NBA player.

Certainly someone of my stature should stfu about coaches. But the idea that they are shielded from criticism sure is a weird one to me that I suspect is rooted in something more nefarious than I care to explore.

Not sure I disagree with the middle paragraph; I feel like I hear plenty of criticism of coaches from commentators and analysts. And certainly from the internet media, especially NBA Twitter. To be clear, I'm not saying there's too much criticism of coaches, just that I haven't noticed any lack of it.

Mike Malone - I just don’t get to see them much here in the East. The fact he coexisted with DeMarcus Cousins is a plus though. But the Denver/Utah series has been in the afternoon so I am seeing more of his stuff. That last tier are guys I don’t get to see much so I don’t really have an opinion.

As for criticizing coaches, I disagree with your premise that society has determined that coaches can’t be criticized, coaches get criticized relentlessly, at least here in Pittsburgh. I think the Van Gundys stay away from it and I appreciate that. I will hear one HS coach criticize another HS coach and that bothers me as I believe parents, players, and media are always looking to blame coaches when things go wrong. And sometimes it is a coach's fault but I think, except in egregious situations, it is really hard for outsiders to know whose fault it is. A good coach will take the blame even though it may not be his fault.

Posted by tarheel1991 on 8/21/2020 2:05:00 PM (view original):
pharrop, I appreciated your comment with respect to D'Antoni getting "criticized for not coaching when sometimes coaching is not coaching." It reminds a lot of the criticism of/lack of respect for Roy Williams, one of the best college basketball coaches of all time. Now, obviously I am not an unbiased observer when it comes to Roy Williams, so feel free to take everything I say about him with a rather large grain of salt. But he's another guy who takes a lot of heat for being supposedly inflexible from a systematic perspective and too slow to make changes, either in the course of an individual game or the season as a whole. But as you alluded to, sometimes it's a lot harder to NOT make changes when things seem to not be going well, and instead trust your system and your players to prove their worth in the end.

I was always a Duke fan until I heard coach Roy speak in person. He won me over that night. So humble, taking his HS coach to the final 4, been a Carolina fan ever since. I have blown hours of time on YouTube watching Carolina fast break videos.

and we're off to a flying start

Posted by pharrop on 8/21/2020 2:22:00 PM (view original):
Mike Malone - I just don’t get to see them much here in the East. The fact he coexisted with DeMarcus Cousins is a plus though. But the Denver/Utah series has been in the afternoon so I am seeing more of his stuff. That last tier are guys I don’t get to see much so I don’t really have an opinion.

As for criticizing coaches, I disagree with your premise that society has determined that coaches can’t be criticized, coaches get criticized relentlessly, at least here in Pittsburgh. I think the Van Gundys stay away from it and I appreciate that. I will hear one HS coach criticize another HS coach and that bothers me as I believe parents, players, and media are always looking to blame coaches when things go wrong. And sometimes it is a coaches fault but I think, except in egregious situations, it is really hard for outsiders to know whose fault it is. A good coach will take the blame even though it may not be his fault.

Yeah, maybe I have just been Van Gundy'd too hard.

Posted by bds9992 on 8/21/2020 2:53:00 PM (view original):
and we're off to a flying start

Are you talking about pick times in a pandemic?

Posted by dBKC on 8/21/2020 4:00:00 PM (view original):

Posted by bds9992 on 8/21/2020 2:53:00 PM (view original):
and we're off to a flying start

Are you talking about pick times in a pandemic?

You know what?

You're absolutely right. Sorry.

Spending all my time working on Savage and no time paying attention to the league I care more about than any other one. I am going to be a ******* tire fire this season.

Jokic in the 2nd? Who would do such a thing?

this is a joke, and was only intended as such.

He's okay, but he's certainly no Bob Rule!

Posted by HDS1 on 8/24/2020 8:52:00 PM (view original):
He's okay, but he's certainly no Bob Rule!

this is very true

hey! let's stop saying player names that no one should ever pick! {Doug Collins}

Posted by copernicus on 8/24/2020 9:04:00 PM (view original):
hey! let's stop saying player names that no one should ever pick! {Doug Collins}

so you're saying I shouldn't say anything about Campy Russell