Richards is also an elite player IMO.  He's just not as good as Toews, nor nearly as accomplished.  Neither is Ovechkin.  I put a lot of stock in things like Junior championships, Olympic medals..especially Gold...Stanley Cups ans such.  THOSE are biggies to me.

laugher ? like the Canucks sweeping the Hawks? ..yea thatll happen this year..no Buff ...No Ladd .. ..Hawks are done !!..taking bets ..see Randle44..cmon Poirot  and MuddytheNarc

I consider Ovechkin and Crosby to be elite scorers.  Toews and Richards are elite players.

Posted by mudbone1969 on 4/1/2011 7:21:00 PM (view original):
Richards is also an elite player IMO.  He's just not as good as Toews, nor nearly as accomplished.  Neither is Ovechkin.  I put a lot of stock in things like Junior championships, Olympic medals..especially Gold...Stanley Cups ans such.  THOSE are biggies to me.

 you put a lot of stock in Poirot's behind

You are blocking the author of this post, randle44.

Why do you insist on beating your head against the wall?

Hawks just got raped again by the refs.  That was a clear high-stick goal.  How do you miss those easy calls?

Posted by mudbone1969 on 4/1/2011 7:25:00 PM (view original):
You are blocking the author of this post, randle44.

Why do you insist on beating your head against the wall?

Not talking to you Mrs Muddy..go back to cleaning the house

Posted by mudbone1969 on 4/1/2011 7:24:00 PM (view original):
I consider Ovechkin and Crosby to be elite scorers.  Toews and Richards are elite players.

Ovechkin and Crosby have god given talent that no other player in the NHL can match.... Toews and Richards have a hard working blue-collared style of play without the same kind of god given talent as the aforementioned.  There are a lot more players like Toews and Richie in the NHL than there are like Ovechkin and Crosby, thats why Ovechkin/Crosby are Elite Players.

Seriously though - you only rate Olympic Gold, Stanley Cups, Junior Hockey, etc highly because there is not a hawk with any stats to show they are even close to elite status.  

Ugh.  Hawks have no toughness.  Dude takes an elbow in the face and not 1 player on the hawks steps up for his teammate.  not one.  I'm not even suggesting fight - just get up in somebodys face and push them a little.  weak.

I won't even counter that farcical statement anymore.

ha ha - even the hawks commentators were asking where the help from his teammates was when toews was just getting into it. 

moy the soothsayer !!!!

Those were 2 crucial points tonight.  Crawford was fantastic and those points are thanks to him.

92 points, 5 games left.  We have a 5 point lead over Dallas and Calgary.  5 more points should be plenty.

Ok.

First off, I'll say that I don't believe anybody, Ovi included, is in Crosby class. He's simply the best player of his generation. Period. He has proven that he can be the best at whatever he choses to excel at. He is an outstanding faceoff man, plays responsible defense, is a great captain, a clutch player, his scoring speaks for itself and he is the unquestioned face of the NHL.

That being said, when looking at individual talent, there's a second tier where I'd put Ovi, the Sedins, Zdeno Chara and Lidstrom.
My 3rd tier would include Toews, Richards, Doughty, Keith, Parise, Malkin, Backstrom, Zetterberg, Kopitar, Datsyuk, Kesler, Perry, Getzlaf, and maybe a few others.

Now if we're talking intangibles and team success among active players, THAT is where I'd put Toews in the top tier along with Nick Lidstrom, Crosby, and maybe even Staal and St.Louis.

Those are two different debates though. I believe the "elite player" debate focuses on an individual's skillset rather than his teams' success.

As for tonight, the Hawks were very lucky to get 2 points. They had no business being in this game at all thanks to their undisciplined play and terrible decision-making with the puck. I also agree that they need to have someone get in the face of opponents who take shots at Toews & Kane. Where were Brouwer and Bryan Bickell? Where was Jake Dowell? Those are the guys I'm looking to step up in that situation. If Brouwer is not scoring and not being a physical presence, he's no better than a fringe NHLer at best because he's not good enough defensively to hold down a roster spot based on that. He needs to pick it up and show that Stan Bowman didn't make a mistake in keeping him around hoping he'd develop into the 2nd line player he's shown flashes of.

Next up is a tough test in the Lightning and then the Habs on Tuesday, which I'll be attending thanks to an awesome birthday gift (15 rows behind the benches at center ice!), followed by a home game against the Blues. If they can manage to get 4 out of 6 points from these 3 games heading into the home & home against Detroit, they'll be in pretty good shape I think.

Andru......Long winded post???  Were you into the sauce tonught???