I second what andru just said. My thoughts exactly with one exception.......imo ovechkin is just as talented (in a different more physical style of play) as Crosby. The difference is Crosby is much much more of a team player. Ovechkin will win a Stanley Cup at some point imo but in the mean time he's really elevated the caps.

Say what you want, and we all know andru downplays EVERYTHING, but Toews is an elite player and will remain one for a good while.  Anyone in the national hockey media will agree with me. 

Posted by mudbone1969 on 4/2/2011 10:44:00 AM (view original):
Say what you want, and we all know andru downplays EVERYTHING, but Toews is an elite player and will remain one for a good while.  Anyone in the national hockey media will agree with me. 

Yeah... ill go check with the natioanal media to see if you are right

In the meantime can you provide me any individual accomplishments of his? Records broken, led the league in anything? Those kinds of things. Thanks.

To be fair, Toews was one of the youngest ever to captain a Stanley Cup Champion, he led the playoffs in assists, was the best faceoff man in the playoffs and in the top 5 during the season in 09-10, was voted best forward for a star-studded team Canada at the Olympics when he started as the 13th forward, led Canada to a World Junior Gold Medal with a performance for the ages against the US in the shootout...

The kid has done alot at such a young age moy.

Having said all that, muddy, Toews is not in the same class as Crosby cmon.

Posted by andru2797 on 4/2/2011 12:05:00 PM (view original):
To be fair, Toews was one of the youngest ever to captain a Stanley Cup Champion, he led the playoffs in assists, was the best faceoff man in the playoffs and in the top 5 during the season in 09-10, was voted best forward for a star-studded team Canada at the Olympics when he started as the 13th forward, led Canada to a World Junior Gold Medal with a performance for the ages against the US in the shootout...

The kid has done alot at such a young age moy.

So one great season makes a player elite? Take out all accomplishmens during the '09-10 season.... now list his accomplishments. Even stamkos can say he scored 50 goals at age 19.

Toews is not the fastest player, the hardest or most accurate shooter, the best defender...... surely an elite player in the NHL is the best at something. Edit.... I'm not saying Toews sucks.... he's a great player, just not an 'elite' player.

Posted by moy23 on 4/2/2011 11:50:00 AM (view original):
In the meantime can you provide me any individual accomplishments of his? Records broken, led the league in anything? Those kinds of things. Thanks.

LOL....nice try!!!

He's a great player and the best on the hawks.... so of course they will talk about him when the hawks are nationally televised. Nationally broadcasted games will talk about stamkos when TB is playing, Richie when Philly plays, and Buff when ATL plays..... that doesn't make them elite.

Btw.... I can't find any individual records set by Toews. And as for leadership.... its not like the pens have missed the playoffs since Crosby has been the youngest captain to ever lead his team to a Stanley cup.

Since when do individual records have one single thing to do with whether a player is elite or not?

Toews = elite player.  To deny this is just ignorant.

Posted by mudbone1969 on 4/2/2011 4:44:00 PM (view original):
Since when do individual records have one single thing to do with whether a player is elite or not?

Toews = elite player.  To deny this is just ignorant.

I'm just ignorant I guess but Toews is no Crosby.

And if a player is an elite player it means he is the best.... the best players break records and/or consistantly lead the league in something.

I think the problem here is you have a watered/muddied down definition of elite.... its like anyone with a heartbeat and hockey blades is in the club. Is sedin an elite player? Richards, Kopitar, Stamkos, Malkin, Ovechkin, Zetterberg, Perry? You still refuse to answer that question.

What question?  Toews is in the group that includes the best players in hockey.  There is simply nobody with any hockey knowledge that would disagree with that.

Smoke another pole Muddy  u dilusional f#ck,......im sure Smithers ...err i mean Andru has a smile as wide as your wife's  c#nt

ok ..suspend me commish  LOL  Muddy is a p#ssy...we all know it ...and Smithers sucks Muddy's c#ck...Smithers = Andru...in my defense i didnt use the actual words...its all up to the discretion  of the viewer..