Somebody took a grumpy pill today!
7/21/2009 3:03 PM
I haven't been following this thread, but for some bizarre reason shortstop ratings spilled over into the HFA thread, so I thought I'd post this here:

Slow day at work, so I took at look at the recently completed season in MG.

32 shortstops qualified with enough defensive innings played to be listed among the league leaders in fielding.

14 of those shortstops had defensive ratings at or above the HBD recommendations of 80/85/85/85. Combined, they had a cumulative fielding percentage of .978.

The other 18 shortstops, who were under the recs in one or more rating, had a cumulative fielding percentage of .966.

Overall fielding percentage for the 32 shortstops was .971.

Draw your own conclusions. But it seems pretty clear that HBD shortstops with defensive ratings above the recs outperform the MLB average, and HBD shortstops with defensive ratings below the recs underperform the MLB average.
7/21/2009 3:04 PM
when I pointed out that HBD SS have a lower Fld% than MLB Fld%, I wanted to make sure I pointed out some known (but not to what extent) "owner decision" detrimental impacts that are in HBD, but not MLB, that could explain the gap

I find it hilarious that someone has grabbed that obvervation ... made some sort of baseless assumption about how many of these user decisons there must be ... made some sort of decision about how many errors said baseless assumption would/should create ... and used that pile of nonsense to suggest that the HBD engine is flawed in how it assigns errors to SS

brilliant!
7/21/2009 3:06 PM
Quote: Originally Posted By MikeT23 on 7/21/2009Somebody took a grumpy pill today
7/21/2009 3:06 PM
And a dose of cranky!!
7/21/2009 3:07 PM
Quote: Originally Posted By 98greenc5 on 7/21/2009
Quote: Originally Posted By tednash on 7/21/2009

Quote: Originally posted by 98greenc5 on 7/21/2009

FWIW:

MLB SS Fld % 2004-2008 = between .971 and .974

HBD-wide SS Fld % (MLB level) = .962

sooooo ... even with all the tankers in HBD who don't care who plays SS ... even with HBD owners knowingly playing non-SS at SS for extra offense ... even with the abandoned teams where a 1B plays SS because the AWOL guy didn't sign one ... even with the claimed (but of course not supported) dearth of SS talent in HBD ... HBD SSs make only 1 more error per 100 opportunities than their MLB counterparts


You say that like it is a good thing, but I think it means the sim is probably at least a little off at assigning errors. I would think that in the RL MLB, if about half the 1Bs got moved to SS for the added offense that .971 F% would go well below .962. Of course, that is just anecdotal, but their is a reason they don't play SS and it is because they would make more errors if they played there. Right?
what the hell point are you trying to make?

Well, you're both talking about 1B's playing SS. Neither point seems particularly cogent.

No one believes there are too few capable SS's being created, so this thread has long outlived its usefulness.
7/21/2009 3:19 PM
I conservatively estimate that at least one 1B is playing SS in each division.

Now, we have to remember that 1B don't have nearly the range of a SS, so they won't get to as many balls as a true SS would, and so their actual "fielding" or "gloving" of a ball will tend to be higher than otherwise anecdotal evidence might possibly indicate, since the "chances" they get will be of the easy type, comparatively speaking (though some might point out that RL "SS" JJ Hardy has also got lead weights in his shoes and may better resemble a 1B in this regard, that is, range).

Anyway, the point I am so belaboredly making, or not, is that these 1B may hurt the team with their limited range moreso than their actual fielding errors since the balls they get to they should be able to handle relatively easily, being experienced as they are at scooping low throws off the ground, which are grounder-like in velocity and trajectory.

But then again, once having succesfully fielded the ball, there is the slight complication of throwing it. Which adds a whole new calculus to the discussion.

So maybe it all works out in the end.
7/21/2009 3:19 PM
Quote: Originally Posted By kermit on 7/21/2009So maybe it all works out in the end
The pre-teen set should have a field day with that line.
7/21/2009 3:21 PM
Quote: Originally Posted By kermit on 7/21/2009
I conservatively estimate that at least one 1B is playing SS in each division.

Now, we have to remember that 1B don't have nearly the range of a SS, so they won't get to as many balls as a true SS would, and so their actual "fielding" or "gloving" of a ball will tend to be higher than otherwise anecdotal evidence might possibly indicate, since the "chances" they get will be of the easy type, comparatively speaking (though some might point out that RL "SS" JJ Hardy has also got lead weights in his shoes and may better resemble a 1B in this regard, that is, range).

Anyway, the point I am so belaboredly making, or not, is that these 1B may hurt the team with their limited range moreso than their actual fielding errors since the balls they get to they should be able to handle relatively easily, being experienced as they are at scooping low throws off the ground, which are grounder-like in velocity and trajectory.

But then again, once having succesfully fielded the ball, there is the slight complication of throwing it. Which adds a whole new calculus to the discussion.

So maybe it all works out in the end.

I stopped reading after that... what the hell 'tard worlds do you play in???
7/21/2009 3:37 PM
So far not one where I could win.
7/21/2009 3:41 PM
65890 posts and no championships????



LOSER!!!!!
7/21/2009 3:44 PM
I thought WIS was cleaning up the forums.

I guess they have done it as well as they usually do, eh?
7/21/2009 3:44 PM
Quote: Originally Posted By MikeT23 on 7/21/2009
65890 posts and you haven't found a league of helmeted autistic kids yet????



LOSER!!!!!

7/21/2009 3:48 PM
Quote: Originally posted by tednash on 7/21/2009
Quote: Originally posted by 98greenc5 on 7/21/2009FWIW:MLB SS Fld % 2004-2008 = between .971 and .974HBD-wide SS Fld % (MLB level) = .962sooooo ... even with all the tankers in HBD who don't care who plays SS ... even with HBD owners knowingly playing non-SS at SS for extra offense ... even with the abandoned teams where a 1B plays SS because the AWOL guy didn't sign one ... even with the claimed (but of course not supported) dearth of SS talent in HBD ... HBD SSs make only 1 more error per 100 opportunities than their MLB counterparts

You say that like it is a good thing, but I think it means the sim is probably at least a little off at assigning errors. I would think that in the RL MLB, if about half the 1Bs got moved to SS for the added offense that .971 F% would go well below .962. Of course, that is just anecdotal, but their is a reason they don't play SS and it is because they would make more errors if they played there. Right?

First basemen don't play SS because their range would be abysmal, not because they'd make more errors. They might actually have a better than average fielding %, because they'd only get to the really easy chances.
7/21/2009 3:56 PM
THUNDERSTRUCK!!!!!!
7/21/2009 3:57 PM
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