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widely known, and yet still absurd. i was arguing with admin about this in the forums probably 3 years ago.

The last four seasons are basically all HD has ever used to decide on promotions.

Also, your current school prestige compared to the school you want to jump to's is very deceiving. And it should not be a part of deciding which jobs you as a coach are qualified for.

Quote: Originally Posted By zhawks on 11/06/2009
The last four seasons are basically all HD has ever used to decide on promotions.

Also, your current school prestige compared to the school you want to jump to's is very deceiving. And it should not be a part of deciding which jobs you as a coach are qualified for.

z, i agree with everything but the bolded part. I wouldn't go so far as to say it should drive the decision, but it shouldn't be ignored either.

It should not be even a little, tiny part.

I take over an A+ prestige school, and over four seasons, drive it down to a B. Jbasnight takes over a D+ school and over four seasons drives it up to a B-.

You think I should have an advantage there? Even a tiny one? No way. Prestige wasn't intended to be used that way, and it never has been. Your resume is what matters.

The 4-year window thing though is, of course, absurd. I used to battle TK on that as well. He was intractable.

EDIT: And I meant to point out the same thing Z did below, that prestige is effected by conference affiliation, etc, making it even less relevant a tool. It just doesn't belong in the jobs process. It wasn't designed for that.

Why shouldn't it? A schools prestige is greatly affected by it's baseline prestige and somewhat affected by it's conference prestige.

dalt have you spoke to seble regarding this?

I haven't. The # of tickets I send these days are pretty few-and-far-between. I get the feeling I would get a response like, "there may be ways to improve the process, but that's not the area that we're currently looking to address".

Which I guess is better than TK telling me to go F myself, assuming that seble would indeed be willing to examine it once the engine update is completed.

Quote: Originally Posted By dalter on 11/06/2009
It should not be even a little, tiny part.

I take over an A+ prestige school, and over four seasons, drive it down to a B. Jbasnight takes over a D+ school and over four seasons drives it up to a B-.

You think I should have an advantage there? Even a tiny one? No way. Prestige wasn't intended to be used that way, and it never has been. Your resume is what matters.

The 4-year window thing though is, of course, absurd. I used to battle TK on that as well. He was intractable.

I'd actually argue that you should have some edge there, daalter. If anything, the fact that only the past four seasons come into play reinforces that prestige should have some role in the decision.

Presumably, to get an A+ job in the first place you did a good job as a coach somewhere along the line. It's not hard for prestige to sag from there, and it's not terribly difficult to take over a D+ rated program and bring it up to the B- range in a few seasons.

No school in real life would ever prefer the second coach to the first. Only by ignoring the first coach's body of work prior to the past four years could you come to that conculsion.

That's two separate arguments. You're essentially arguing that it shouldn't be just a 4-yr window, and that my previous success should count for more. And I agree with that in general. But prestige is not the way to accomplish that.

Quote: Originally Posted By dalter on 11/06/2009
That's two separate arguments. You're essentially arguing that it shouldn't be just a 4-yr window, and that my previous success should count for more. And I agree with that in general. But prestige is not the way to accomplish that.

Right. I'm saying that if you're going to be silly enough to look only at the past four seasons, you could take prestige into account as a partial proxy for coaches' prior recods. But of course the best approach would be to just take the coach's entire record into account.

Edit: I can't believe I didn't know this by now. Maybe later today I'll post this funny SHHH-BANG! e-mail I got from a recruit.

But you are wrong. You are saying that the guy that destroyed the A+ prestige should have the better resume? You are arguing against yourself here aren't you?

Quote: Originally Posted By zhawks on 11/06/2009But you are wrong. You are saying that the guy that destroyed the A+ prestige should have the better resume? You are arguing against yourself here aren't you

Not at all. What I'm saying is this: If you are going to count only the past four seasons in the hiring decision, then you should also count the prestige of a coach's current school as a way to take into account their prior history.

Quote: Originally Posted By jbasnight on 11/06/2009

Quote: Originally Posted By zhawks on 11/06/2009
But you are wrong. You are saying that the guy that destroyed the A+ prestige should have the better resume? You are arguing against yourself here aren't you?

Not at all. What I'm saying is this: If you are going to count only the past four seasons in the hiring decision, then you should also count the prestige of a coach's current school as a way to take into account their prior history.

That doesn't make any sense. Just because you were at a D+ and he was at an A+ does not mean that his past resume is that much better then your past resume.

jbas, that's flawed logic.

You're taking a bad system and just introducing another bad element to it. That doesn't solve anything, or necessarily make anything better.

Your argument is totally valid if what you're saying is, "Let's expand it beyond four seasons", but to simply factor in team prestige, when we've already shown how badly flawed/misleading that can be, does not make the situation any better. And in many cases it could make it worse.