This is my 2nd recruiting class at D1 Davidson... please tell me if these guys are going to start moving me in the right direction in rebuilding Davidson. My main goal is to replace the players I had or cut (that weren't good) and get players that will let me get to C, etc prestige. Thanks in advance. Here is the team http://www.whatifsports.com/hd/TeamProfile/Ratings.aspx?tid=12835

Patrick Surface SF #138 SF

ATH 70 (low)
SPD 57 (low)
REB 39 (low)
DEF 46 (high)
SB 16  (high)
LP 10 (high)
PER 40 (high)
BH 31 (high)
PAS 30 (high)
WE 72
STA 60 (avg)
DUR 47 (avg)
FT % 64.7%
OVR 518

James Black PG #185

ATH 71 (low)
SPD 60 (avg)
REB 11 (avg)
DEF 61 (high)
SB 1 (low)
LP 1 (low)
PER 42 (high)
BH 51 (avg)
PAS 64 (low)
WE 52
STA 66 (high)
DUR 45 (low)
FT % 62.8% (high)
OVR 525

Curtis Henricks PF #78

ATH 52 (avg)
SPD 36 (low)
REB 70 (avg)
DEF 33 (high)
SB 62 (low)
LP 38 (high)
PER 27 (low)
BH 18 (high)
PAS 42 (low)
WE 70
STA 52 (high)
DUR 15 (low)
FT %
OVR 515

Elwood Randolph SG #75 (3 years remaining)

ATH 63 (low)
SPD 53 (high)
REB 17 (low)
DEF  55 (avg)
SB 1 (low) 
LP 46 (low)
PER 36 (high)
BH 54 (high)
PAS 56 (avg)
WE 72
STA 68 (high)
DUR 66 (low)
FT % 74.8 (low)
OVR 587

Billy Herbert PF #102

ATH 68 (low) 
SPD 44 (low)
REB 46 (high)
DEF 62 (avg)
SB 36 (high)
LP 27 (low)
PER 12 (high)
BH 26 (high)
PAS 24 (high)
WE 85
STA 62 (high)
DUR 52 (avg)
FT % 68.7% (avg)
OVR 544

I don't think any of those guys are very good.

Surface has no strength, he isn't much of a defender or an offensive player.

Black is a average defender for DI but is a poor PG and unless his perimeter gets to like 90 he won't be able to score effeciently.

Henricks will be a bad defender, an ok rebounder, and unless you can get his LP into the 90's he won't be a good scorer.

Randoph cold be a decent scorer if you get his speed to 80 and PER to around 80.  He's weak on defense and not a PG.

Herbert is a DII post player and not even a real good one.

As a general rule for DI  try to find guys who's core will be 80+.  Inside scorers need 80/80 (or close to it) in LP and ATH, Perimeter scorers need 80/80 in SPD/PER.

Now, with that being said, it'll be hard to do that at a low end DI school but one or two of your recruits should hit those marks  SOMEWHERE.

I figured the response wouldn't be great but how is a D prestige team in NC supposed to compete. In my initial list the guys I liked went to Duke, NC State, Clemson. This is why I posted this because I felt like my recruits weren't great but when I searched within 500 miles these were the best guys I could get.

I was trying to recruit players better than the SIM AI had and hope that over years I will be able to incrementally get better. 

the big thing i noticed was no high potentials in ath or speed for anyone. that is one of the first things i look for. speed and atl can make up for a lot of other things at low DI.

Well I mean I've recruited in Ohio with a D+ prestige (big 10 schools hanging around). And New York with D and D+. And I'd be surprised if you couldn't have done better. These guys are not very good. If I were you and the pickings were as slim as you said they were I would go elsewhere. Either International/puerto rico (After scouting of course). Or to a different region in the country (in Phelan, where I am, the big sky and MWC are very strong, so the west is very off limits right now, but I like to look at the small conferences in the particular areas and see where the teams aren't as populated as recruits, EX: like the midwest, east coast, or the south, and then scout the states that have undecided recruits who's cores are promising or teams that you can beat in a battle, if you have some cash). 

Anyways Good Luck, hope u stick with DI, it gets better!

It takes time to learn how to recruit in DI. It's an entirely different animal. Don't be discouraged.

I actually like Surface is his defense is high-high.

Even with a D prestige you should have been able to do better than those guys.  Gonna be tough to improve bringing in recruits like that.  They're basically high end D2 players for the most part.  That might sting a little, but it's the truth.  Sorry.

Advice for low D1 schools (in the Ds):

1) You should rarely (if ever) fill all your scholarships.  Go big or go home, that's the only way you're going to improve.  Don't just take a guy because you don't want to come away with nothing.  Most of the time, nothing is better than a crappy big man because that big man is on campus the next four years and a walk-on is only there for 1.

2) You shouldn't ever come away with a well rounded recruit because that probably means he's not good enough anywhere to be effective.  Find guys with extreme strengths and try to set off their weaknesses.  

3) Find the low-rated guys with high-high potentials because taking a big man with 20 LP but  high-high is a lot better than taking a big man with 45 LP and low-high potential because only one of them has a chance at being an elite scorer.  Low D1 in all about high-high potential because that is where your studs come from.  

4) GO INTERNATIONAL!!!!!!  These guys are the high-risk high-reward players and that's exactly what you need.  The bigger schools don't want to deal with most unranked and seemingly untalented international guys because it's a risk they can't really afford to take.  They can find these same types of lowly ranked guys locally, except they know the local guys have great potential and so they take them.  As a lowly ranked D1 school, it's very hard to get a local guy with a bunch of high potentials, but it is SO MUCH EASIER if you go overseas.  Yea, most international guys you scout are going to be ****, but once in a while you find a guy that has high-high potential EVERYWHERE.  Normally, this guy would go to a big 6 school, but since they have no idea of his potentials, you can scoop up this international gem and dominate your conference.

If it's signing day and no one else has gone after any of recruits, it's a good sign you're shooting too low.

Also, as someone who just did a quick scan of NC and the surrounding areas, there are some MUCH better undecided players out there, not to mention 25 undecided international guys who probably haven't been scouted by anybody.  

Posted by tkimble on 7/15/2012 11:50:00 PM (view original):
Advice for low D1 schools (in the Ds):

1) You should rarely (if ever) fill all your scholarships.  Go big or go home, that's the only way you're going to improve.  Don't just take a guy because you don't want to come away with nothing.  Most of the time, nothing is better than a crappy big man because that big man is on campus the next four years and a walk-on is only there for 1.

2) You shouldn't ever come away with a well rounded recruit because that probably means he's not good enough anywhere to be effective.  Find guys with extreme strengths and try to set off their weaknesses.  

3) Find the low-rated guys with high-high potentials because taking a big man with 20 LP but  high-high is a lot better than taking a big man with 45 LP and low-high potential because only one of them has a chance at being an elite scorer.  Low D1 in all about high-high potential because that is where your studs come from.  

4) GO INTERNATIONAL!!!!!!  These guys are the high-risk high-reward players and that's exactly what you need.  The bigger schools don't want to deal with most unranked and seemingly untalented international guys because it's a risk they can't really afford to take.  They can find these same types of lowly ranked guys locally, except they know the local guys have great potential and so they take them.  As a lowly ranked D1 school, it's very hard to get a local guy with a bunch of high potentials, but it is SO MUCH EASIER if you go overseas.  Yea, most international guys you scout are going to be ****, but once in a while you find a guy that has high-high potential EVERYWHERE.  Normally, this guy would go to a big 6 school, but since they have no idea of his potentials, you can scoop up this international gem and dominate your conference.

+1 

Very good advice 

gvsu, it can be done. A while back in tark I spent 5 seasons at Elon (also a low D I in North Carolina) - seasons 3,4 and 5 we went to the NT, season 5 we went to the 2nd rd. I moved on to a BCS gig after that, but the simai won the CT with my seniors  2 seasons later... 1 of those guys is still #3 on the school's scoring list...the players are out there. I don't have any groundbreaking advice other than keep looking... a lot of it too is what coach billy g was saying in his interview, springboarding off what tkimble is saying - you won't get any well rounded guys at this level, so its key to find guys that can excel (or come close to excelling) at a few key things that compliment each other and build a solid team. The only thing I disagree with is I always recruited 12, because I didn't win any battles for the bigger kids anyway, even with the extra money, and since I was building piece by piece I needed more pieces - but I've seen lots of teams be successful with up to even 4 walk ons (those teams are top tier with 8 900 rated guys and 4 walkons - not for the low end D I team...)

tkimble - who is better in the state of NC? I had Green, Skinner and Kail on my list but they didn't look as good as the guys I signed... 

I disagree about the not filling all scholarships.  My Long Island team for example has filled every scholarship all 3 seasons I've been there and have gotten 3 very solid classes at a C or C- prestige.  The secret of recruiting is to look have some restraint and don't overspend early.  Target a couple players you want early, spend just enough to get them interested in you.  If a big school comes in, abandon that player and move on to someone who isn't being recruited by a big school.   A few cycles before signings begin, look at players not considering anyone and look for players who may are ranked in the top 75 of their position and scout for potential to see if you can find someone who has slipped through the cracks.  Try to get them interested so they will sign in the first cycle cheap, and use the bulk of your money to go after someone with high potential but is being recruited by someone with similar potential and/or someone who doesn't have many scholarships available where you can outspend them.  

As a C or C-, I usually begin looking at players ranked #25-50 at their position.  If I was gvs at a D prestige, I would probably look at players ranked #50-75 at their position and look for high potential recruits to go after.  When you take over a bad roster, you will need to recruit 2 types of players..... players who can compete immediately regardless of potential, and players who are going to take a season or 2 to develop but can be REALLY good with some improvement.  PersonallyI would tend to lean more on the potential of players and suffer through a rough season or 2 before I start competing.  

I also disagree about the not filling all your scholarships at low-end D1.  I had some pretty good success at low-end D, and I always filled all my schollys.  I often don't fill them all at Big 6 schools, but I see zero advantage to not filling them all at low-end.  The "go big or go home" adage is wholly inapplicable for low D1.

That said, I agree with all of Tkimble's advice otherwise, particularly as it relates to potentials.

And gvsujulius...site mail me.  I will point out some guys in our area (I'm at SCarolina) that I think you would have been smart to go after.  (Also, I don't think your class is as bad as some have indicated.)