Why on earth is your school in World Knight needed?

I am also confused as to why experiance is not a main factor. How can WIS honestly think a new player could be a good Beta tester?

im not sure why knight matters? I Think experiance matters but only to a point I think success is a sign you know what is going on also.

Maybe it's getting rolled out in Knight first?

And as someone who's worked in software testing, you want perspectives from as many different types of users as possible. You're trying to find errors, not just encourage ******** from a bunch of people.

Quote: Originally Posted By mcauley on 11/09/2009
Maybe it's getting rolled out in Knight first?

And as someone who's worked in software testing, you want perspectives from as many different types of users as possible. You're trying to find errors, not just encourage ******** from a bunch of people.

I completely understand. But those of us that have been around longer have not only played at every level but know what does and doesn't work in the game. Of all people the vets would be the ones that understand that this is not a 'Free Play' of HD but the chance to help out in the continued development of the game that we love. I completely understand that this is an opportunity to find glitches and bugs, I don't know exactly why you are calling me out for whatever 'encourage ******** from a bunch of people' is.

I think getting opinions from coaches who have been at DII and/or DIII for quite awhile but not necessarily DI (ala alblack, etc.) makes a lot of sense. But I agree with Z, I don't think getting much input from very new coaches is going to be the most beneficial. I'm not saying eliminate them entirely, but I'd say to have them present on a very limited basis. Guys with more experience are going to understood HD much, much better and have more to offer.

dalt, in all honesty I think the best thing that seble could do is ask guys that are in those situations ie Al and throw him a d2 team... so on and so forth. Who better to beta test how the new engine works at d2?

I would be more then willing to help out at any level, although I would prefer D1. But the ability to be present and help figure out what is working and what isn't and why is more then enough for me to volunteer my time in whatever way WIS needs to help fully develop HD as best as possible.

Also In reference to "Not just encourage ******** from a bunch of people" I think that you will find that the majority of the '********' is not from the vets that have been around the game for a long time, discussing ways in which HD could be improved is not ********.

Quote: Originally Posted By dalter on 11/09/2009I think getting opinions from coaches who have been at DII and/or DIII for quite awhile but not necessarily DI (ala alblack, etc.) makes a lot of sense. But I agree with Z, I don't think getting much input from very new coaches is going to be the most beneficial. I'm not saying eliminate them entirely, but I'd say to have them present on a very limited basis. Guys with more experience are going to understood HD much, much better and have more to offer.

I agree all levels of play should be represented

"How can WIS honestly think a new player could be a good Beta tester?"

New players make just as good beta testers as vets. Both find problems, both need to be catered to by CS.

Quote: Originally Posted By cthomas22255 on 11/09/2009"How can WIS honestly think a new player could be a good Beta tester?"

New players make just as good beta testers as vets. Both find problems, both need to be catered to by CS.

You clearly are missing my point. I never said that new players could not find bugs. Of course anyone could find a bug. My point was very clearly that not only do the vets know more about the game (meaning a better grasp of how to find the bugs) but have also played at every level. If you are going to tell me you could throw any new coach at a d1 program and expect him to be able to figure out bugs while learning how to do things at d1, you are wrong. To be able to properly beta test you need to know how things are suppose to work, without that knowledge you can't pick out the bugs.

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Agree. New users ARE needed. The amount of which depends on what changes they've made. As a vet, recruit generation SEEMS like it should be tested with users weighted toward more vet status, but that could just be my vet tunnel vision. ;)

Quote: Originally Posted By mrpolo09 on 11/09/2009

Gotta agree with mcauley here. Long time users of anything will start to get tunnel vision. They will zone out through many things as they've done them over and over, millions of times. To get the best perspective all ability levels should be utilized.

Also, the newbies represent the most important demographic of a business. "potential" long-term users. I know the most important thing in this situation is evaluating the upgrades. But you also want to evaluate the user friendliness of the game as well. Whats fine and dandy for us vets, might put off players that are new to the game. And we dont want that.

I was going to post something similar to this but since you beat me to it, I'll just say, +1.

The reason they need Knight, is probably because they are cloning the Knight world as the beta-world. It would save them time if the user's already had history to copy from.

They cloned Tark for FSS beta.

mlatsko, might it be possible that HD has more to lose from vets (with multiple longterm teams), vets who are "waiting around to see how the changes shake out before deciding to stay" than to gain from newer customers? I'm not sure, myself. But I don't think the beta-test experience-level distribution for this is necessarily typical. It may be that a worst-case scenario is that WIS listens too little to vets' complaints/suggestions/solutions re: the new release, while concentrating on the new player experience, and many, many vets finally stay "take this game and shove it." :)

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