Which rebounder would do better in the game? Topic

rutley01
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Assuming all other ratings are more or less equal, please rank these players in rebounding effectiveness:

Player A: 80ATH, 40 REB
Player B: 25ATH, 85 REB
Player C: 50ATH, 50 REB
9/14/2010 11:34 AM
bscoresby
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player b
9/14/2010 11:55 AM
reinsel
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Yes.  No question.   On the Offensive rebounding side it might be close with A & B, but on the defensive rebounding size B will win by a large margin.
9/14/2010 12:12 PM
pablo_ohio
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B
9/14/2010 12:13 PM
bhansalid00
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EDITED:
Let me throw a little bit of actual data here - here are four players I had this yr in D3 and their rebounding rates:

Player A: 64 ATH, 63 REB, A- iq's. Averaged 12.3 rebs / 40 mins.
Player B: 28 ATH, 72 REB, A- iq's. Averaged 14.8 rebs / 40 mins.
Player C: 26 ATH, 66 REB, B+ iq's. Averaged 12.7 rebs / 40 mins.
Player D: 52 ATH, 66 REB, A+ iq's. Averaged 11.9 rebs / 40 mins.

Now, Players A and D played mostly PF, while B and C played mostly center. So comparing by position, Player A's 12-pt advantage in ATH made him a slightly better rebounder than Player D's 3 extra pts in REB and 2/3 of a grade higher IQ. But at center, Player B's 6 extra pts of REB and 2/3 of a grade in higher IQ made a huge diff vs Player C.

Anyway, I was pretty surprised by this. Looks like REB and IQ's matter even more for rebounding than I previously thought - and maybe ATH  matters a little less.
9/14/2010 1:32 PM (edited)
dahsdebater
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I'm not sure why it surprised you that the rebounding rating is the most important for determining how good of a rebounder a player is...  I'd also be willing to bet that if you calculated the standard deviation of the rebounding numbers that player B was more consistent.  I've done that a few times and it's almost always the case that high athleticism players have the potential to explode for large numbers of rebounds in some games and then toss out bagels in others and end up with significantly higher variance in their rebound/min ratings game-to-game than high rebounding players.
9/14/2010 1:32 PM
bhansalid00
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Posted by dahsdebater on 9/14/2010 1:32:00 PM (view original):
I'm not sure why it surprised you that the rebounding rating is the most important for determining how good of a rebounder a player is...  I'd also be willing to bet that if you calculated the standard deviation of the rebounding numbers that player B was more consistent.  I've done that a few times and it's almost always the case that high athleticism players have the potential to explode for large numbers of rebounds in some games and then toss out bagels in others and end up with significantly higher variance in their rebound/min ratings game-to-game than high rebounding players.
I didn't say it surprised me that REB was the most important rating. I said it surprised me that even a modest advantage in REB (9 pts or less) could pretty significantly outweigh disadvantages in ATH.

I suspect you're right about the higher variance among high-ATH rebounders compared to high-REB guys - Player A had more games of 5 or fewer rebs than Player B.
9/14/2010 1:45 PM (edited)
narcotico
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Just an anecdotal observation, but it seems to me that my players tend to rebound at a higher rate per-minute when playing the C position as opposed to PF in the new engine.

All 4  frontcourt players on my Greensboro team have 87-88 reb, so they provide a good case study:

PF
starter Barnett: 56 ath 87 reb 18.6 mpg 5.0 rpg
backup Harvey: 54 ath 87 reb 20.0 mpg 5.0 rpg

C
starter Kennedy: 53 ath 88 reb 20.9 mpg 8.2 rpg
backup Toler 72 ath 88 reb 17.5 mpg 7.1 rpg

Interesting, no?


9/14/2010 4:59 PM (edited)
jetwildcat
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Posted by narcotico on 9/14/2010 4:38:00 PM (view original):
Just an anecdotal observation, but it seems to me that my players tend to rebound at a higher rate per-minute when playing the C position as opposed to PF in the new engine.

All 4 of my frontcourt players on my Greensboro team have 87-88 reb, so they provide a good case study:

PF
starter Barnett: 56 ath 87 reb 18.6 mpg 5.0 rpg
backup Harvey: 54 ath 87 reb 20.0 mpg 5.0 rpg

C
starter Kennedy: 53 ath 88 reb 20.9 mpg 8.2 rpg
backup Toler 72 ath 88 reb 17.5 mpg 7.1 rpg

Interesting, no?





it appears that position has quite the correlation
9/14/2010 4:39 PM
bscoresby
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does that mean your best rebounder should be at center or excel, or you switch the lesser to pf to make 2 equal rebounders?     
9/14/2010 5:17 PM
jetwildcat
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probably depends how good the opponents are. logic would say that, with equal opposing rebounders, put the better rebounder at center if its simply a multiplier (rough example power forwards are 1.2x their rebounding ability, centers 1.6x, you want to multiply 1.6 by the bigger number) but if there's a ceiling somehow involved, then you'd want two players close to the ceiling.

my gut would say put the better rebounder at center but who knows, is my point
9/14/2010 5:50 PM
reinsel
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Yeah, another big factor in reb #'s is how good your other players are at Reb.  My best Reb #'s have been when I have played 3 guards.  The bigs really get huge numbers then.
9/14/2010 7:11 PM
Lizak
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That makes it sound like the outcome is predetermined and they are just trying to find someone to assign the rebound to for stat purposes.  Actually, not that uncommon in tabletop sports games.  The system determines there will be a rebound or assist or whatever for side A and then it's just a matter of seeing who the most likely player is to get credit.

9/14/2010 7:39 PM
johnfoppe
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Mix 2 parts REB and 1 part ATH.  Serve on the blocks.  ;-)
9/14/2010 9:30 PM
jetwildcat
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Posted by Lizak on 9/14/2010 7:39:00 PM (view original):

That makes it sound like the outcome is predetermined and they are just trying to find someone to assign the rebound to for stat purposes.  Actually, not that uncommon in tabletop sports games.  The system determines there will be a rebound or assist or whatever for side A and then it's just a matter of seeing who the most likely player is to get credit.

yeah its a bit unrealistic like that, you'd think they should throw all 10 players (including the sideline) into the pool and see who gets a board that way
9/14/2010 11:18 PM
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