First round loss in the nt or 3rd round in pi?

1st round NT.  Not too long ago I dropped from an A to an A- after a PI Championship.

That's in D3 of course, as a reference for the impact of the drop, but I would assume the same postseason values would apply on any level.

I'm not so sure you are right dahs. Check out the following team, getting bumped from C+ to B- in a PI FF run, with no one drafted:

http://www.whatifsports.com/hd/TeamProfile/History.aspx?tid=13815

WIS doesn't value the PIT very much.

Last week, I was runner-up in the DIII PIT and dropped from A+ to A-.  I'd won one NT and was twice RU in the last 6 seasons. But I also dropped to A- after a 1st round loss in season 54

57	alblack56	17-15	10-5	6-8	1-2	8-8		49	A-	PI (Championship Game)
56	alblack56	25-5	11-2	12-1	2-2	15-1	10	10	A+	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (Sweet 16)
55	alblack56	29-6	13-1	9-3	7-2	13-3	2	3	A+	NT At-large Bid NT (Championship Game)
54	alblack56	17-13	7-5	8-6	2-2	11-5		46	A-	Conf Champion NT At-large Bid NT (1st Round)
53	alblack56	20-11	7-5	10-4	3-2	12-4		30	A+	NT At-large Bid NT (Elite 8)
52	alblack56	28-7	10-2	10-4	8-1	13-3	1	2	A+	NT At-large Bid National Champion
51	alblack56	32-3	12-0	12-2	8-1	14-2	2	2	A+	Conf Champion CT Champion NT (Championship Game)

doesn't it make a little bit of sense that the PIT would drop prestige a little for an A+ team, but increase it for a C-level team? (not that A+ to A- is reasonable in al's case, but that it makes more sense in conjunction with tianyii's example)...

Posted by wronoj on 3/20/2012 9:03:00 AM (view original):
doesn't it make a little bit of sense that the PIT would drop prestige a little for an A+ team, but increase it for a C-level team? (not that A+ to A- is reasonable in al's case, but that it makes more sense in conjunction with tianyii's example)...

D1 is a different game though. The above team moved up to B- with FF in PIT, I dropped from B- to C+ with NT first round:

http://www.whatifsports.com/hd/TeamProfile/History.aspx?tid=13759

Yeah, but D1 has a rolling window for prestige, so past success is also going to be important in determining which way prestige is going.

I thought a PIT championship was slightly better than a first round NT win.

Posted by isack24 on 3/20/2012 9:49:00 AM (view original):
Yeah, but D1 has a rolling window for prestige, so past success is also going to be important in determining which way prestige is going.

I thought a PIT championship was slightly better than a first round NT win.

For D2/D3 at A+, it's definitely better to have a 1st round knockout, because the maximum prestige drop is to A.

For D1, I'm not so sure. Coppin State rolling window is pretty similar to mine, with them bumping to a C+ with 2nd round NT, and my team going to B- on 2nd round NT. Then Coppin goes to B- with FF PIT and I fall back to C+ with NT 1st round. 

Posted by isack24 on 3/20/2012 9:49:00 AM (view original):
Yeah, but D1 has a rolling window for prestige, so past success is also going to be important in determining which way prestige is going.

I thought a PIT championship was slightly better than a first round NT win.

I don't see how being the 65th best team in the nation should trump anything that happens in the tournament, that's just dumb.

Posted by tianyi7886 on 3/20/2012 10:36:00 AM (view original):

Posted by isack24 on 3/20/2012 9:49:00 AM (view original):
Yeah, but D1 has a rolling window for prestige, so past success is also going to be important in determining which way prestige is going.

I thought a PIT championship was slightly better than a first round NT win.

For D2/D3 at A+, it's definitely better to have a 1st round knockout, because the maximum prestige drop is to A.

For D1, I'm not so sure. Coppin State rolling window is pretty similar to mine, with them bumping to a C+ with 2nd round NT, and my team going to B- on 2nd round NT. Then Coppin goes to B- with FF PIT and I fall back to C+ with NT 1st round. 

The part about the maximum prestige drop is not correct Tianyi.  I got an at-large bid with my Assumption (D2 Phelan) team, lost in the first round of the NT, and dropped from an A+ to an A-.  Granted, I was coming off of a Final Four season and ended up 16-13 the next season (the season of the drop), but it WAS an NT bid (again, an at-large), and I did drop all the way from an A+ to an A-.  Just letting everyone know that it can happen.

Posted by colonels19 on 3/20/2012 11:35:00 AM (view original):

Posted by isack24 on 3/20/2012 9:49:00 AM (view original):
Yeah, but D1 has a rolling window for prestige, so past success is also going to be important in determining which way prestige is going.

I thought a PIT championship was slightly better than a first round NT win.

I don't see how being the 65th best team in the nation should trump anything that happens in the tournament, that's just dumb.

Believing that the PIT champ is the 65th best team in the country is "just dumb."

I have always believed the RPI is the kicker in this equation.

I've had A+ d2 teams go 2nd round NT with a 35-40 RPI and lose the A+ back to an A. I've had 1st round exits with a 15 RPI and I keep the A+

I think a PT winner better than a 1st round NT loss, but not better than a 2nd round NT loss.

I bet a 3rd round PT loss is SLIGHTLY worse than a 1st round NT loss, and a PT final four loss = NT 1st round loss