Allen/Smith regular season Topic

Quote: Originally Posted By vandydave on 5/25/2010

Quote: Originally Posted By cheeznsweet on 5/24/2010

That sound you hear? Its hundreds of simultaneous "0" keystrokes being entered as the team practice minutes for the press. God help the people that keep running the FCP in this new engine.

i had 23 TOs against a terrible halfcourt pressing team today.
As suspected, the 1/2 court press is acting like a FCP with benefits. Seble this needs to be fixed. You are allowing the 1/2 court trap to press in the backcourt and trap in the frontcourt. See PBP of this game. Vandy you need to post this stuff as oppossed to just ***** about it. You need to dissect it, brother. Obviously there is a problem.

http://whatifsports.com/hd/GameResults/BoxScore.aspx?gid=5763340

This is a 1/2 court trap-Man to Man defense, but it's acting like a FCP.

--Tom Choy hits a wide open driving attempt from the right block set up by Clarence Ohler

--Dumaka Abdelmuti works out of a doubleteam but hits the front of the rim on the shot from the side

--Tom Choy connects on the open floater from the right side set up by John Lundell

--Edward Streeter is open and scores on a jumpshot from the side on a nice dish by James Ryan

--Tom Choy misses long on an open jumpshot from the right wing

--Edward Streeter misses the wide open jumper near the basket

--Dumaka Abdelmuti is bothered by a doubleteam and misses badly on a 3pt jumper from straight away

--John Lundell misses the wide open floater from the baseline

--Matthew Malinowski works out of a doubleteam and scores on a driving attempt from the baseline and he's hacked by Robert Carter - foul #1 on Robert Carter, team foul #3

--Matthew Malinowski makes the wide open fadeaway from the baseline

--Clarence Ohler is alone and drills a turnaround in the paint

--John Lundell makes the wide open shot from just outside the lane on a great pass from Tom Choy

--Tom Choy can't connect on an uncontested fadeaway from just outside the lane

--Matthew Malinowski banks in the layup over the doubleteam set up by Clarence Ohler and he's hacked by Charles Smith - foul #3 on Charles Smith, team foul #5

--Tom Choy banks in the wide open layup

--Dumaka Abdelmuti shoots over the doubleteam but comes up short on the 3pt jumper from the right wing

-------------------------------------

7 for 11 on open shots, 2 for 5 on double teams. Seble, what are the increased chances of a make on an open shot? What are the decreased chances on a double team shot? In this game, the victim had very high offensive IQ and very good BH and PA skills against a team with high DE ratings and slightly lower levels of SP and ATH. 23 TOs seems extremely high compared to 11 open shots.

Based on the math, (49 FGA), 33 shots were taken against neither a dt or open. Less than 25% of shots were open shots. More than 2/3 of the shots came against "normal" positioned defense--that's to say that more than 2/3 of his attempts were taken against neither a defense that was out of position (open) nor one that was in an advantageous position (dt) defensively.

Is an open shot like a FT where there is no defensive influence? A wide open shot would be the same against the Bulls as it would be against the Weak Sisters right?

To say the least, I'm concerned with the turnovers and how it's set up to both press and trap ala the FCP. What set of IQs are you using? Are there increased fouls? What about fatigue? What are the other disadvantages of using the FCP or trap (ie increased chance of giving up an offensive board). All these things were tweaked over several years in the old engine.
5/26/2010 5:46 AM
my fcp team caused 6 to's for the entire game

it is just going to be all over the map until we (and seble) figure things out

this is an entirely new game

give it time - might be what you say is right, might not

by the way, my team that fcp and only caused 6 TO's, won both exhibitions by over 50 points - for those of us who have played this game for years, the next few months are going to hard

tarek tweeked this engine for years to stabilize things, we cannot expect an entirely new engine to be stable overnight
5/26/2010 6:35 AM
this is tough. my press is completely ineffective in 5 games (4 exhibitions and last night). Now, the teams I played were certainly better but I'm noticing loads of fouls on my guards who have the best SP/ATH/DEF combos and highest IQs which seems strange to me. Went up against a team last night who was better but had low offensive IQs and still shredded my FCP. Never got beat like this last year. I have no problem reducing the dominance of the press. Just hope it didn't become completely ineffective overnight.

I do however think the distro settings seem to be working fairly well.

Anyone else notice an issue with 3pt frequency. Almost seems overcorrected. Had 2 guys at 0 and 1 at -1 and was down all night. Team I played was -1 1st half and -2 2nd half and I shot 2 3 pointers. Seems very low to me. Sent seble a ticket on it.
5/26/2010 6:41 AM
Quote: Originally posted by 1calloway on 5/26/2010this is tough. my press is completely ineffective in 5 games (4 exhibitions and last night). Now, the teams I played were certainly better but I'm noticing loads of fouls on my guards who have the best SP/ATH/DEF combos and highest IQs which seems strange to me. Went up against a team last night who was better but had low offensive IQs and still shredded my FCP. Never got beat like this last year. I have no problem reducing the dominance of the press. Just hope it didn't become completely ineffective overnight. I do however think the distro settings seem to be working fairly well. Anyone else notice an issue with 3pt frequency. Almost seems overcorrected. Had 2 guys at 0 and 1 at -1 and was down all night. Team I played was -1 1st half and -2 2nd half and I shot 2 3 pointers. Seems very low to me. Sent seble a ticket on it.

I think you are right, I looked at my test world team, thru 19 games, with identical settings to what 'typically' has been causing my team to shoot about 30% of its shots as threes, we shot 14% as threes this season, so the rate of 3's attempted got cut in half for my one team.

again, we are in engine debug mode, noone has any idea what the engine might look like tommorrow or a week from now, because of the vast number of tickets and issues being raised and the corresponding changes that may or may not take place and the unintended consequences of each change - which has proven in the past to be a key component to HDchange
5/26/2010 6:56 AM
Agree with you. I do think Seble has been very receptive to the issues raised by us. I am willing to continue to be patient and hope for the best. The 3pt frequency is an issue. Another guy in my division had 2 of his at +2 and only took 2 3s a piece. That definitely needs to be tweaked.

With a new engine, we are certainly going to have to go thru some growing pains to get it where it needs to be.
5/26/2010 9:38 AM
The #1 biggest key is that if you see some kind of legitimate bug or problem, send a ticket with examples.
5/26/2010 10:05 AM
How many teams in RL play a FCP for an entire game?

What examples do people have that this works in RL at all for a full time game plan?

I can think if Nolan Richardson and the "40 Minutes of Hell" ... how many others?
5/26/2010 10:28 AM
No team plays this in real life. Arkansas really played a half-court press with a pressure m2m.

But your argument is circular. If they offer it as a base defense in HD, it still needs to work properly. If they want to remove it as a base defense (which they may), that's fine. But as long as it exists as a base defense option, you can't say, "Well, no one plays this is in real life, so it shouldn't work here". It's a base defense option, it needs to work.
5/26/2010 10:31 AM
This post could not be converted. To view the original post's thread, click here.
5/26/2010 10:46 AM
Quote: Originally posted by Rails on 5/26/2010Seble, are players set to rest (reserved for an injured player) not playing if they are not hurt.  Seems to me they are resting even when healthy.  The rest default should be mopup if they are 100%.Still no stats on the player profile page for inelgibles in the first season.  Thought it was fixed in the beta, but now it is not.
Players shouldn't be able to be Rest if they're healthy.

Do you have an example of the ineligible issue?
5/26/2010 11:36 AM
This post could not be converted. To view the original post's thread, click here.
5/26/2010 11:50 AM
The half court press that I'm familiar with is that the defensive team presses/traps until the offensive team crosses halfcourt, at which point they fall back into their base defense.

The notion that a halfcourt press would just be extending out to halfcourt is odd to me, and not something that I really see (unless it's maybe a late-game desperation situation or something like that). That's really not how the halfcourt press should work.

Also how does all of this reconcile with rails' post/examples -- things that should not be happening while playing a m2m base defense. Something is off there.
5/26/2010 12:33 PM
Quote: Originally Posted By dalter on 5/26/2010
The half court press that I'm familiar with is that the defensive team presses/traps until the offensive team crosses halfcourt, at which point they fall back into their base defense.

The notion that a halfcourt press would just be extending out to halfcourt is odd to me, and not something that I really see (unless it's maybe a late-game desperation situation or something like that). That's really not how the halfcourt press should work.

Also how does all of this reconcile with rails' post/examples -- things that should not be happening while playing a m2m base defense. Something is off there.



Yes a Half court press means you press the team until they get pass half court then fall back in to your teams base defense.

I am not sure if thats how it works in HD, because I have never run the press, but if they are only pressing once the team crosses half court, and not in the back-court then something doesn't seem right about that.
5/26/2010 12:43 PM
Quote: Originally Posted By dalter on 5/26/2010
The half court press that I'm familiar with is that the defensive team presses/traps until the offensive team crosses halfcourt, at which point they fall back into their base defense.

The notion that a halfcourt press would just be extending out to halfcourt is odd to me, and not something that I really see (unless it's maybe a late-game desperation situation or something like that). That's really not how the halfcourt press should work.

Also how does all of this reconcile with rails' post/examples -- things that should not be happening while playing a m2m base defense. Something is off there.

This is how it wiould have to work. If not, how could you explain the HCP/Zone defense?
5/26/2010 12:59 PM
You can trap and pressure out to halfcourt while playing a zone. In common basketball terminology, a "half-court" press means that you begin defending when the offense crosses mid court. I've never seen it described otherwise outside of this game.

The current options in HD honestly don't make a lot of sense to me in my knowledge of the game. In my mind, every team should have to choose M2M or some type of zone to run as a base defense. Then on top of that there should be some different ways to press.

5/26/2010 1:13 PM
◂ Prev 1...8|9|10|11|12 Next ▸
Allen/Smith regular season Topic

Search Criteria

Terms of Use Customer Support Privacy Statement

© 1999-2026 WhatIfSports.com, Inc. All rights reserved. WhatIfSports is a trademark of WhatIfSports.com, Inc. SimLeague, SimMatchup and iSimNow are trademarks or registered trademarks of Electronic Arts, Inc. Used under license. The names of actual companies and products mentioned herein may be the trademarks of their respective owners.