Sim Engine Like Real Life Topic

antonsirius
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Quote: Originally posted by schroedess26 on 1/17/2010
Quote: Originally posted by colonels19 on 1/17/2010Because it doesn't happen most of the time...however just because that is the case, doesn't mean that something doesn't need to be tweaked/fixed.  The sim takes a sh!t every once in a while, not all the time.
Well if it is so sparse of when it happens than there are other things that need to be focused on, like the new beta, recruit generation in there, and most important for you colonels, your game planning.

I actually agree with the troll, in the sense that the extreme outlier results from the sim are too extreme (dogget had a thread ******** about this not too long ago).

Big upsets are fine; teams shooting .150 on the night against inferior defenders, not so much.
1/17/2010 10:34 AM
zhawks
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Quote: Originally posted by dalter on 1/17/2010More to the point, if it only happens occasionally, how are you differentiating between occasional randomness that's excessive or appropriate? To me, it would be excessive/inappropriate if it was preventing what I described above, which it clearly does not. How much randomness is too much for you?

Agreed dalt, another point to be made is that WIS sims a huge amount of games per day and because of that it might seem like there are too many outlier games, when really it is not.
1/17/2010 10:35 AM
colonels19
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Quote: Originally Posted By dalter on 1/17/2010More to the point, if it only happens occasionally, how are you differentiating between occasional randomness that's excessive or appropriate? To me, it would be excessive/inappropriate if it was preventing what I described above, which it clearly does not. How much randomness is too much for you
When A. the game doesn't pass the "eye-test" and B. if there aren't logical explanations to justify what happened.

If it was proven that true randomness was used (which is highly unlikely because not many places/sites do) I would have shut up a long time ago and defended WIS on every last bizarre outlier....but it seemingly happens time and again....there's an entire thread in the NBA Sim forum dedicated to bizarre unjustifiable results.
1/17/2010 10:51 AM
a_in_the_b
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COlonels. .if the game involves any random factor whatsoever, and plays the number of games that are played here, there will, absolutely, 100% no exceptions, whatever type of randomizer you use, be games that 'don't pass the eye test'



1/17/2010 10:57 AM
schroedess26
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This post could not be converted. To view the original post's thread, click here.
1/17/2010 11:04 AM
colonels19
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Quote: Originally Posted By a_in_the_b on 1/17/2010
COlonels. .if the game involves any random factor whatsoever, and plays the number of games that are played here, there will, absolutely, 100% no exceptions, whatever type of randomizer you use, be games that 'don't pass the eye test'

But if I know that the randomness is TRUE and NORMAL and the game doesn't pass the eye test, then I have nothing to ***** about. If under true randomness a team beat its opponent 100-0 on the road and the next matchup the exact opposite happened....I would back it completely because it would have been normal, true randomness at work.
1/17/2010 11:10 AM
a_in_the_b
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Tell me, can you give me the line of code that shows which randomizer WIS uses in its game please?
1/17/2010 11:12 AM
schroedess26
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Well then how do you know its not normal randomness than? Honestly you just said something that is more unlikely than anything else.
1/17/2010 11:12 AM
colonels19
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Quote: Originally Posted By schroedess26 on 1/17/2010
What the difference between the two? Oh thats right two different engines. The games are not the same. Its like comparing NCAA Football and Madden since your a big EA guy. They may be based on the same thing and be football, but both engines have been readjusted and reworked to fit their game. They work with the same concepts. I bought EA Arena Football (made in 2006) used and the engine/franchise setup is exactly like madden, except for the fact that its the now defunct AFL. FWIW, its a horrendous game, don't buy it...I'm shocked they don't make it any more.

HD and NBA back at the start might have been the same, but they have grown apart and the new beta is no exception. When the new beta for HD comes out they won't paste the end product over to NBA, its a HD only thing. So if the NBA sim was the baseline for HD, what makes you think/believe that different kinds of RNGs are used for both games?
1/17/2010 11:14 AM
a_in_the_b
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Um COlonels? Can you show me the line of code for the randomizer used in the NBA sim as well?
1/17/2010 11:15 AM
colonels19
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Quote: Originally Posted By a_in_the_b on 1/17/2010Tell me, can you give me the line of code that shows which randomizer WIS uses in its game please?
They would never do that and its still a kind of a running joke in the NBA sim forums because I suggested this very thing...albeit 3 or 4 years ago or so.
1/17/2010 11:16 AM
a_in_the_b
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SO the fact is COlonels. .you are admitting you DON'T KNOW what the Randomizer is?
1/17/2010 11:17 AM
colonels19
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Quote: Originally Posted By schroedess26 on 1/17/2010Well then how do you know its not normal randomness than? Honestly you just said something that is more unlikely than anything else
Because I've seen crazy stuff happen in too many games here across various engines to believe that their RNG works properly all the time. This conclusion has been developed over years, not days.
1/17/2010 11:18 AM
a_in_the_b
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Quote: Originally Posted By colonels19 on 1/17/2010
Quote: Originally Posted By schroedess26 on 1/17/2010
Well then how do you know its not normal randomness than? Honestly you just said something that is more unlikely than anything else.
Because I've seen crazy stuff happen in too many games here across various engines to believe that their RNG works properly all the time. This conclusion has been developed over years, not days


So you base your OPINION on anecdotal evidence?



Then you use Anecdotal evidence yourself to try to infer the randomizer, especially when by the nature of how humans work, the games that are going to be talked about ARE going to be the unusual ones, not the "Everythign went exactly as I expected' ones?
1/17/2010 11:22 AM
colonels19
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I love it when you say randomizer...I don't know why, its just funny to me lol.
1/17/2010 11:27 AM
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