Quote: Originally posted by TheJester74 on 5/13/2010I've got a guy I've thought about posting in the forums for a while. A decent SP with 20 control. And in Ryan like form he threw a no-hitter this season, walked 8 in that game.

Rick Starr

He's actually worse than Ryan in that he walks almost a guy every inning, but his other ratings are off the charts good.

What's interesting that that for the season HBD supressed HR totals he had a stellar 3.84 ERA in 194 IPs. He walked 160 guys, but only gave up 9 HRs. I wouldn't have suspected a guy with 20 control could be decent.

His stellar 3.84 ERA is due in considerable part to so many unearned runs. He gave up 4.57 runs/9 innings, it's just a good chunk come up as unearned.

Quote: Originally posted by zbrent716 on 5/13/2010

Quote: Originally posted by TheJester74 on 5/13/2010I've got a guy I've thought about posting in the forums for a while. A decent SP with 20 control. And in Ryan like form he threw a no-hitter this season, walked 8 in that game.
Rick Starr

He's actually worse than Ryan in that he walks almost a guy every inning, but his other ratings are off the charts good.

What's interesting that that for the season HBD supressed HR totals he had a stellar 3.84 ERA in 194 IPs. He walked 160 guys, but only gave up 9 HRs. I wouldn't have suspected a guy with 20 control could be decent.

His stellar 3.84 ERA is due in considerable part to so many unearned runs. He gave up 4.57 runs/9 innings, it's just a good chunk come up as unearned.

Somehow I think dropping his HR totals from 25 to 9 would seem to have a larger affect on ERA.

By the way I hope I wasn't misleading in my quote, he's not my player. I thought a guy with that low control was useless, but his career 4.48 is fairly middle of road.

Cy Young says hi

http://www.whatifsports.com/HBD/Pages/Popups/PlayerProfile.aspx?pid=1691980

Regular Season Pitching Stats
Season Fran Level G GS CG W L SV SVO Inn H R ER HR BB SO OAV OBP SLG WHIP ERA
1 NY2 ML 24 24 2 13 8 0 0 165.0 133 56 52 15 73 126 .221 .311 .332 1.25 2.84
1 DET ML 9 9 0 3 4 0 0 55.2 59 30 29 5 26 48 .268 .353 .368 1.53 4.69
1 Totals ML 33 33 2 16 12 0 0 220.2 192 86 81 20 99 174 .233 .323 .341 1.32 3.30
2 NY2 ML 33 33 6 15 10 0 0 241.1 188 102 90 29 115 182 .209 .301 .349 1.26 3.36
3 NY2 ML 33 33 3 18 8 0 0 237.1 179 96 90 38 98 187 .205 .292 .357 1.17 3.41
4 BOS ML 32 32 7 17 11 0 0 233.1 165 90 76 37 96 165 .198 .287 .366 1.12 2.93
5 BOS ML 31 31 4 15 6 0 0 216.1 142 71 58 21 91 168 .184 .276 .304 1.08 2.41
6 BOS ML 32 32 5 18 4 0 0 222.0 163 82 70 19 102 146 .203 .299 .307 1.19 2.84
7 BOS ML 32 32 4 15 9 0 0 214.2 206 100 96 26 79 141 .247 .319 .390 1.33 4.02
8 BOS ML 31 31 6 21 7 0 0 220.2 177 83 80 19 87 158 .222 .308 .347 1.20 3.26
Career Totals ML 257 257 37 135 67 0 0 1806.1 1412 710 641 209 767 1321 .213 .301 .346 1.21 3.19

lots of walks, but a career .213 OAV helps

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Not intending to say that Rick is useless; he'd make a fine mopup man for me on some teams, though not at that price. It just seems like, for him, ERA is misleading since he has allowed a high number of unearned runs.

Geronimo Limon

2532.0 IP
2513 K
1311 BB
.231 OAV
1.39 WHIP
4.12 ERA
160-130 W-L

Take away his Season 3 where he was abused...

2433.2 IP
2446 K
1266 BB
1.37 WHIP
4.01 ERA
158-118 W-L

TSMOPOAT...for you jose...

Quote: Originally posted by TheJester74 on 5/13/2010I've got a guy I've thought about posting in the forums for a while. A decent SP with 20 control. And in Ryan like form he threw a no-hitter this season, walked 8 in that game.

Rick Starr

He's actually worse than Ryan in that he walks almost a guy every inning, but his other ratings are off the charts good.

What's interesting that that for the season HBD supressed HR totals he had a stellar 3.84 ERA in 194 IPs. He walked 160 guys, but only gave up 9 HRs. I wouldn't have suspected a guy with 20 control could be decent.

That is a real shame, because if his control were about 20 pts higher, he would be a bona fide stud muffin. It would still only be 40-ish, but that little extra control is the difference between a guy who's other numbers can't account for his bad rating, and a guy who's other numbers can overcome that bad rating.

Quote: Originally posted by TheJester74 on 5/13/2010I've got a guy I've thought about posting in the forums for a while. A decent SP with 20 control. And in Ryan like form he threw a no-hitter this season, walked 8 in that game.

Rick Starr

He's actually worse than Ryan in that he walks almost a guy every inning, but his other ratings are off the charts good.

What's interesting that that for the season HBD supressed HR totals he had a stellar 3.84 ERA in 194 IPs. He walked 160 guys, but only gave up 9 HRs. I wouldn't have suspected a guy with 20 control could be decent.

I think that's more Bobby Witt than Nolan Ryan.

Quote: Originally posted by movet22 on 5/16/2010

Quote: Originally posted by TheJester74 on 5/13/2010I've got a guy I've thought about posting in the forums for a while. A decent SP with 20 control. And in Ryan like form he threw a no-hitter this season, walked 8 in that game.
Rick Starr

He's actually worse than Ryan in that he walks almost a guy every inning, but his other ratings are off the charts good.

What's interesting that that for the season HBD supressed HR totals he had a stellar 3.84 ERA in 194 IPs. He walked 160 guys, but only gave up 9 HRs. I wouldn't have suspected a guy with 20 control could be decent.

That is a real shame, because if his control were about 20 pts higher, he would be a bona fide stud muffin. It would still only be 40-ish, but that little extra control is the difference between a guy who's other numbers can't account for his bad rating, and a guy who's other numbers can overcome that bad rating.

It is a shame, I think 60 control makes him a HOF'er. You can learn about about the game engine by looking at a guy like him. I have usually been a "avoid pitchers with sub 60 control" GM, but I'm a little more flexible now.

Still that control rating gives you the chance to have a player miss his projections and still be effective. If you draft a guy whose controls tops at 40 he just can't miss getting superb splits, and good pitch ratings or he is useless.

I'll offer up this guy: Chili Zheng

I've had him for a couple of years now and finally gave up on him. Last season he threw a one hitter, losing it late and had a few games like that where he just dominated. He also walked way too many and always found himself in trouble.

Like the Mets w/Ryan, I finally tired of him and just recently traded him.

Quote: Originally posted by overeasy on 5/13/2010With 44 control, a good WHIP, and an All-Star appearance last season, Wayne Thomas is Ryan-like minus the K numbers.

(Additionally for those of you who are believers in the importance of GB/FB, check out his rating.)

Given his GB/FB, his stats don't follow.

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