Posted by bheid408 on 12/11/2020 8:39:00 AM (view original):

Posted by chargingryno on 12/11/2020 12:13:00 AM (view original):
How does me giving a new owner a $1.6-2.5m aaa player taking advantage of them?

if anything I am being taken advantage of by trading my AAA for scrubs. The 3-4 AAA I trade away are gonna be more valuable than the one RP I get, but I didn’t build my team to need the AAA players, I built it to need an RP

WOW! Now you are saying you are helping them and hurting your team? WOW! If making those trades doesn't help you, then you wouldn't be doing it. I and a lot of other owners on this site thought you were better than that.

If you don't know how you are taking advantage of them then you I'll give you a clue...... "I didn’t build my team to need the AAA players, I built it to need an RP" therefore, you know what you are doing, they don't.

Where did I say it didn’t help me or that it was hurting my team? As I’ve said from the beginning of this topic if you’d cared to read it, each team has separate needs. My teams are usually built with specific themes in mind (A++ fielders, SB teams, etc) that don’t utilize AAA. As everyone, even you, has noted, new owners don’t know what they’re doing. So, I’ll repeat, how does giving them a player that has more value TO THEM hurting them? Are they, a new owner who doesn’t know what they’re doing, better off with a $1.5m-$2.5m AAA or 200k Zach Cozart? Their team is 100% better off with the AAA players. now, do I also feel that my team is better off with the 200k cozart? Yes I do. That’s what people in the biz call a mutually beneficial transaction.

Heck, before coming into this forum, mwett’s argument against these trades was that the owner receiving the AAA player had an unfair advantage and he couldn’t fathom how getting a 200k scrub could be validated. Now magically he’s changed his stance to say that I’m taking advantage of owners by giving them AAA for their scrubs.

heh

when there's a cash incentive to keep the money train rollin

you can't blame a man for being uhhhhhhh

what's the word i'm lookin for

Posted by bheid408 on 12/11/2020 12:06:00 PM (view original):
Here:
if anything I am being taken advantage of by trading my AAA for scrubs.
.
Aren't you implying it's hurting your team? Maybe not. Maybe being taken advantage of, helps your team???
How does trading away players you have no intention of ever using so you can acquire a player that you do intend to use make it so you are being taken advantage of?

What is usually consistant with cheaters is that it's never their fault that they cheat and they'll also always try to justify cheating. Like the game allows it so it must be ok. Or it's the game developers fault that I cheat since they didn't develop the game to keep it from happening. Or you can just say it's okay to cheat because "It's a game". No big deal.

I think it's quite clear no one is cheating. To state or even imply so is ludicrous.

Whether or not it's taking advantage of others who may not know all the details is the question, and I think it's also quite obvious that's also not happening in either direction. Having more knowledge of the system and using that knowledge doesn't imply nefarious intent or action. Nor does it imply taking advantage of another who doesn't have that level of knowledge. By and large, gaining AAA helps the newer owners more because they tend to draft inefficiently whereas the $200k scrubs tend to help an owner that drafted more efficiently or with that goal in mind.

I sometimes draft with the intent to use AAA and will even trade for additional AAA to fill those team needs. Then, knowing how valuable AAA are, I figured it would be easier to trade AAA I don't need because most owners would have a greater need for AAA. So, I began drafting more with the intent to trade my AAA for scrubs, thus the trades benefit both teams mutually. Maybe not in the same $ value on a player for player basis, but in value to the team effect, they are quite similar. For my $1-2.5M player, I can get enough value to add $1-1.8m from the WW. Fairly even in terms of value added.

Yes, we are using that value differently, but with the previously recommended minimums for IP/PA, the AAA were often better than their starters. As we start to see teams built around the new minimum recommendations, we should start to see more streamlined teams, and now the AAA have value in providing depth for those that may have cut close or not drafted to the minimum. Giving them PH, defensive replacements, and value.

These AAA for scrub trades also do a better job of teaching new owners the variable details of the sim and show them there are a number of ways to see value and build teams. Especially since these trades almost always cause a discussion in the league. This is a great opportunity to teach new owners about AAA value, real names, normalization, and how to properly use the WW ("Generally don't, but..." is usually how I start that).

This isn't even a gaming the system issue like the old Fatigue Strategy and Superman Long A was, it's a recognizing value problem, and it's not just a new owner issue. Many established and long time owners still don't understand AAA value, WW value, efficient team building that utilizes either or both of these values, or how these two different variable values intersect. I can't tell you how many HOF owners I've walked through the AAA and WW value with in leagues over the last year alone.

No one is being taken advantage of, the owner trading for the scrub is giving up more individual value for similar team value, and in a way that often benefits the AAA recipient more. It's like trading in standard fantasy leagues. If a trade benefits one owner 15% and gains them 100 net points on the season, and gains the other owner 6% and net 60 points on the season; both benefit and are helped by the trade, but one gained more relative value from the deal. This is usually related to the rest of the individual team builds and supporting players. It's not taking advantage of the owner gaining just 6%, especially if they were already in a top 3 position and the other team is outside the playoffs trying to get in. Different teams have different needs, and the value intersects differently.

There's a bunch of emotion in here over an issue that isn't much of an issue at all. If we want to help new owners, then use these trades as an opportunity for education, direct them to the forums, etc... lambasting others for cheating or taking advantage of others when that's clearly not happening is more likely to drive new owners away than them getting a AAA player for a $200k scrub, especially if the relative value is explained.

LONG LIVE JUGGALOSTEVE

Posted by boogerlips on 12/11/2020 1:50:00 PM (view original):
LONG LIVE JUGGALOSTEVE

Just let me know what time the draft is

Posted by bheid408 on 12/11/2020 12:06:00 PM (view original):
Here:
if anything I am being taken advantage of by trading my AAA for scrubs.
.
Aren't you implying it's hurting your team? Maybe not. Maybe being taken advantage of, helps your team???
How does trading away players you have no intention of ever using so you can acquire a player that you do intend to use make it so you are being taken advantage of?

What is usually consistant with cheaters is that it's never their fault that they cheat and they'll also always try to justify cheating. Like the game allows it so it must be ok. Or it's the game developers fault that I cheat since they didn't develop the game to keep it from happening. Or you can just say it's okay to cheat because "It's a game". No big deal.

I didn’t think this needed clarification, but it’s clear you need things spelled out for you.

“if anything” -used to suggest tentatively that something may be the case (often the opposite of something previously implied). In my opinion, I could easily justify receiving 2-3 200k scrubs for a AAA player. If the player they receive is worth $1.5-$2.6m, why should I only receive 200k in compensation? It doesn’t matter whether I’m going to use them or not, they’re mine. I have two dressers. I don’t need the other one, but why should I sell it for 1/10 of what it’s worth? Why should I just leave it in my closet when I know there’s someone out there who could use a dresser. Hell, I’m not looking to take advantage of people so I’ll even sell it for less than it’s worth, if anything (notice that phrase again) I’ll lose money on the deal, but I’m a kind hearted guy so I’m fine with it.

Last I’ll say on this,

mwett- in the league you mentioned, you were talking about the unfair nature of those trades because the owner who received the AAA player in your mind was getting the much better end of the deal and you couldn’t fathom how getting a real 200k player for a player worth up to $2.6m could possibly be fair (for the owner receiving the 200k scrub).

Now you’ve magically changed to believe that I, and other owners who make such trades, are taking advantage of new owners by giving them AAA for their 200k players. Also, your “you disagree with me so anything you say is pointless” argument is as juvenile as this entire discussion.

“A real 2020 scrub of 200K, not a higher priced disguised as AAA, with WAR ratings of 40-50 and under 75 ABs. This is an actual 200K disaster. Was offered for an Effective aaa CA of real-life value +2M. I'm vetoing, and asking you to join me, but if you're not, plz tell me what I'm missing.” - per your league wide sitemail. So is it unfair to send AAA or to receive 200k scrubs? I’m not sure which one you’re mad about anymore.