Posted by Benis on 2/14/2018 10:39:00 AM (view original):

Posted by zagsrulez on 2/14/2018 10:32:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 2/14/2018 10:30:00 AM (view original):

Posted by zagsrulez on 2/14/2018 9:07:00 AM (view original):

Posted by cubcub113 on 2/10/2018 4:13:00 PM (view original):

Posted by beachhouse on 2/10/2018 11:32:00 AM (view original):
I don't think I've ever consider ab90 to be a good coach; just someone who capitalizes. I can't fault someone for wanting to be successful in this game, but it can't be as much fun. He'll have another great shot at winning a title with Grand Canyon in Knight this season. I guess I play the game differently and that is probably why I haven't won a title yet.

Ab quit the game by the way. Gave his account to Only

You gotta be kidding me. When I started making jokes about ab90 being the classic HD cherrypicker, Only has to message me to “set me straight”. Way to stick of for your alternative self Only. Not only that he is breaking fair play guidelines because he now has at least TWO teams in DII Knight.

******* pathetic.

Having two teams in the same division doesn’t matter. Its distance and conference. Can’t be same conference, can’t be within 1000 flight miles. He’s definitely in violation in Tarkanian, Lynchburg is 762 flight miles from West Palm Beach. I’m sure he’s notified WIS of the unintentional violation, and they’re giving him a grace season to get one of the teams moved out.

No you can only have ONE squad per world regardless of division or distance.

nope you can have two. Its in the fair play guidelines.

How is that “fair play”? Having a two teams on different parts of the country would give that person an advantage with recruiting.

I have a California squad (Knight) and a Massachusetts squad (Smith). Let’s say they were in the same world. I love recruiting in NY, so I could FSS NY with both squads and then do cheaper scouting with my UMASS squad. All the players I like, I recruit at Level 1 Scouting with my Cali squad.

please explain how that is fair play? That’s blatant cheating.

Not only that if one squad was D1 and the other squad was D3, I could use the D1 squad to show interest using a couple AP to scare off all competition for my D3 squad to obtain better players.

you guys think that is fair play?

Posted by zagsrulez on 2/14/2018 10:54:00 AM (view original):
Not only that if one squad was D1 and the other squad was D3, I could use the D1 squad to show interest using a couple AP to scare off all competition for my D3 squad to obtain better players.

you guys think that is fair play?

You should read the actual fair play guidelines, specifically the part on collusive behavior, which covers everything you talk about. Actually doing the stuff you talk about is also prohibited. Being able to do it doesn’t put you in violation, doing it does.

Collusive transactions

Collusion includes any act that supports bad, deceitful or illegal behavior agreed upon by two or more users or attempted by a single user. Here are a few examples:

• Discussing the pursuit of a recruit with another coach, including who is pursuing him and money that might have been spent.
• Sharing Future Stars Scouting (FSS) information between multiple teams
• Scheduling a non-conference game against an alias team (i.e. team owned by same owner in a different conference and more than 1,000 miles away). Exhibition games are permitted in this situation, however.
• Any clear throwing of a game (normally indicated by massive lineup changes or settings changes)
• Specifically targeting another coach is prohibited. This includes, but is not limited to, focusing on recruits a particular coach is pursuing in order to steal them or force the coach to overspend.
• Attempting to persuade another user to participate in a collusive effort (only the initiator would be at fault unless agreed upon by other user)

So essentially, if you know a person has two teams in a world, you should keep an eye on their recruiting behavior. If a west coast team has a bunch of players from NY, there could be a problem, you should send a ticket and ask for CS to follow up.

The biggest area of concern is internationals, IMO. You should never scout internationals with more than one squad.

Posted by shoe3 on 2/14/2018 10:58:00 AM (view original):

Posted by zagsrulez on 2/14/2018 10:54:00 AM (view original):
Not only that if one squad was D1 and the other squad was D3, I could use the D1 squad to show interest using a couple AP to scare off all competition for my D3 squad to obtain better players.

you guys think that is fair play?

You should read the actual fair play guidelines, specifically the part on collusive behavior, which covers everything you talk about. Actually doing the stuff you talk about is also prohibited. Being able to do it doesn’t put you in violation, doing it does.

Collusive transactions

Collusion includes any act that supports bad, deceitful or illegal behavior agreed upon by two or more users or attempted by a single user. Here are a few examples:

• Discussing the pursuit of a recruit with another coach, including who is pursuing him and money that might have been spent.
• Sharing Future Stars Scouting (FSS) information between multiple teams
• Scheduling a non-conference game against an alias team (i.e. team owned by same owner in a different conference and more than 1,000 miles away). Exhibition games are permitted in this situation, however.
• Any clear throwing of a game (normally indicated by massive lineup changes or settings changes)
• Specifically targeting another coach is prohibited. This includes, but is not limited to, focusing on recruits a particular coach is pursuing in order to steal them or force the coach to overspend.
• Attempting to persuade another user to participate in a collusive effort (only the initiator would be at fault unless agreed upon by other user)

But how would anyone even know that someone is sharing FSS information between multiple teams?
Like even if it is written in the rules, there is absolutely no deterrent from keeping people from doing this. There are multiple worlds, there is no GOOD reason why a person needs to make two different accounts to maintain a multiple teams in a world.

An easier way to track this, if it was really "fair play", would be to allow a single user account to have multiple teams in a world.

Do you really think CS would do anything? Removing the ability to cheat is what prevents cheating. Saying "Don't cheat" does not.

Posted by shoe3 on 2/14/2018 11:04:00 AM (view original):
So essentially, if you know a person has two teams in a world, you should keep an eye on their recruiting behavior. If a west coast team has a bunch of players from NY, there could be a problem, you should send a ticket and ask for CS to follow up.

The biggest area of concern is internationals, IMO. You should never scout internationals with more than one squad.

I am not wasting my time tracking 0nly's recruiting patterns to ensure that he is not cheating, I barely have enough time to keep up with my own teams. It is WIS responsibility to ensure all players are not breaking the rules by placing clear deterrents to prevent cheating.

Posted by MikeT23 on 2/14/2018 11:07:00 AM (view original):
Do you really think CS would do anything? Removing the ability to cheat is what prevents cheating. Saying "Don't cheat" does not.

The only thing I’d support regarding an update to those guidelines would be to make it structurally impossible to have two teams, which would be complicated, including cross checking credit card info, IP addresses and email addresses. It could probably be done, but not likely a good use of resources. But if they want to do that, I would not complain. It has to be enforceable. If it’s not enforceable, it’s only affecting the open and honest players.

Posted by zagsrulez on 2/14/2018 11:10:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 2/14/2018 11:04:00 AM (view original):
So essentially, if you know a person has two teams in a world, you should keep an eye on their recruiting behavior. If a west coast team has a bunch of players from NY, there could be a problem, you should send a ticket and ask for CS to follow up.

The biggest area of concern is internationals, IMO. You should never scout internationals with more than one squad.

I am not wasting my time tracking 0nly's recruiting patterns to ensure that he is not cheating, I barely have enough time to keep up with my own teams. It is WIS responsibility to ensure all players are not breaking the rules by placing clear deterrents to prevent cheating.

So here's the thing-

WIS expects us to police the game for them. They could create a way to link multiple IDs so at least it was known who was who. 0nly has been operating two IDs for a long time and everyone knows they're both him. Other users have done the same over the years.

But how do you prevent the secret IDs? Just have an alt ID and don't tell anyone about it. Voila - easy cheating.

Personally I'm more concerned about those who hide this information than those who are open with it. I never understood why so many people were okay with Spud telling everyone he had other IDs but REFUSING to say what they were. This screams cheating to me but most seemed to be fine with it.

When you're not good at cheating, it's less of a problem in most people's minds.

Anyway, expecting WifS to monitor and control the use of multiple IDs is laughable. I discovered an alias in one of my HBD worlds a few weeks ago. Once I was 100% certain, dude was leaving footprints over multiple worlds that would frighten a Sasquatch, I went to the commish. Commish went to WifS, presented the evidence and WifS came back with "There seems to be a link between the two users but we cannot be 100% certain". WifS left it at that so the commish went to the user(s). He closed up shop that day.

Point being, WifS isn't going to do anything.

Posted by zagsrulez on 2/14/2018 11:07:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 2/14/2018 10:58:00 AM (view original):

Posted by zagsrulez on 2/14/2018 10:54:00 AM (view original):
Not only that if one squad was D1 and the other squad was D3, I could use the D1 squad to show interest using a couple AP to scare off all competition for my D3 squad to obtain better players.

you guys think that is fair play?

You should read the actual fair play guidelines, specifically the part on collusive behavior, which covers everything you talk about. Actually doing the stuff you talk about is also prohibited. Being able to do it doesn’t put you in violation, doing it does.

Collusive transactions

Collusion includes any act that supports bad, deceitful or illegal behavior agreed upon by two or more users or attempted by a single user. Here are a few examples:

• Discussing the pursuit of a recruit with another coach, including who is pursuing him and money that might have been spent.
• Sharing Future Stars Scouting (FSS) information between multiple teams
• Scheduling a non-conference game against an alias team (i.e. team owned by same owner in a different conference and more than 1,000 miles away). Exhibition games are permitted in this situation, however.
• Any clear throwing of a game (normally indicated by massive lineup changes or settings changes)
• Specifically targeting another coach is prohibited. This includes, but is not limited to, focusing on recruits a particular coach is pursuing in order to steal them or force the coach to overspend.
• Attempting to persuade another user to participate in a collusive effort (only the initiator would be at fault unless agreed upon by other user)

But how would anyone even know that someone is sharing FSS information between multiple teams?
Like even if it is written in the rules, there is absolutely no deterrent from keeping people from doing this. There are multiple worlds, there is no GOOD reason why a person needs to make two different accounts to maintain a multiple teams in a world.

An easier way to track this, if it was really "fair play", would be to allow a single user account to have multiple teams in a world.

Sure there are. People get attached to teams or players and don’t want to give them up.

Are people cheating? Almost definitely. Are they the teams belonging to players who are currently open and honest about operating multiple IDs? Less likely. Ask Benis, he tripped over his little pig benis in his excitement thinking he had found a gotcha on my roster, who turned out to be a juco or transfer, after I said I only recruited locally and never scouted internationally at ACU as shoe3. Pretty funny.

Since you have an "open" alias, should we believe you?

Since benis has half a dozen brothers playing, including one with 30 teams under 3 different usernames, should we believe him?

“They could create a way to link multiple IDs so at least it was known who was who.”

That would be wonderful. Does such a method exist? Great in theory, assuming the logistics are workable.

I've always been a fan of alias subtlety. If you guys look through DIII Phelan, I bet you'd never guess which alias is mine.