I manscape a tad more than "The Animal". Little Nike checks shaved in my chest. Christmas tree shaved in my back. Ya know..... seasonal stuff.

Posted by gillispie1 on 12/15/2020 7:59:00 PM (view original):

Posted by lilspike0738 on 12/15/2020 8:19:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 12/14/2020 1:40:00 PM (view original):

Posted by gillispie1 on 12/14/2020 12:11:00 PM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 12/14/2020 11:54:00 AM (view original):
“just get rid of multiple team allowance, with some token for the folks impacted by it. its arguably bad for the game and its arguably stupid on the merits, but man, to not have to listen to these stupid threads for the rest of time... for your own sanity, i think its probably time. i always hate to let the whiners win but there has to be some accounting for how much CS time is wasted, how much these threads are negative for the community spirit, and whatever else.”

If it is as simple as getting rid of the allowance, then I’m cool with it. But I don’t think it is. I don’t know of any way of doing this that doesn’t actually make CS life harder, and forum life much worse. If there is, I’m all ears.

perhaps. put it out 12 months to give folks time (and post on every conference board), maybe give some free credits to the folks impacted (assuming they won't move resumes around etc). i could be wrong, maybe its because i have 0 teams and it no longer impacts me, but from what i've seen, most of the folks who used to have multiple accounts simply don't coach at all anymore, and those who do largely moved away from from the 2 teams slowly after CS started caring 8 years ago. but i could be wrong. maybe its still a ton of people and would be a disaster.

The impact of this is almost entirely removing accounts from people who are already complying with FairPlay guidelines, folks who aren’t cheating. I assume someone who is trying to cheat using multiple accounts is not open about having multiple accounts. If an IP and/or CC check is put in place, VPN and a separate card can probably skirt those rules in most cases. So we’re left with the same situation we have now - the community reports suspicious behavior, and CS has to investigate the trail - except a whole lot of bad will and resentment gets thrown in on top of it.

It would be much better if folks would just play their own game. Accept that some people are always going to try to cheat; and realize this is an Internet game, and sometimes sin is its own punishment. Someone going to all the trouble of covering their tracks and operating incognito accounts to gain some slight edge in a recruit battle or two every season on a fake basketball game probably deserves my pity more than community vengeance.

I'm not familiar with your knowledge of computers, nor am I trying to offend or put you down in anyway, however; this is something that is VERY easily implemented by several sites...etc that had much less income/resources than WiS at the start. I can create a website today, and do more to ensure 1 account per user.

Now, maybe the argument is that they missed their window to implement something like this, ahead of the other things they plan to do, and that would be fine. However; the argument that it's not feasible or reasonable without a huge impact on rule abiding players is largely false.

At the least, there would be transparency to those are utilizing a 2nd account/card/computer for a sibling or child...etc.. At most, it would would severely limit and reduce exploiting the rules... When someone pays money for a product, they do so with the idea that the game is going to do it's best to keep it's integrity. No new players are foaming at the mouth to join, especially not with "Well it's 4-5 seasons before you're even relevant, and there might be people cheating that could potentially make it harder, but we're not sure..."

Idk... I understand where you're coming from, but I think it's ill-informed.

i also think the exercise is just far more difficult than you are giving it credit for. almost no website or service i am aware of implements what you are talking about. you can run 2 accounts on gambling sites, news sites, sports sites, on high end video games, and virtually everything else i have seen on the internet.

i think you are extrapolating - or perhaps pontificating - without the experience of actually trying to fight such a thing. its not nearly as simple as you are suggesting, its actually pretty awful. sounds like you are thinking of a simple browser cookie implementation or something along those lines which is not close to a robust solution.

there's also all the edge cases - friends who play, or brothers, etc, who might share a device from time (or use at each others house to check their team etc). or maybe some guy asks some other guy for help. all those legitimate cases would have to be filtered out.

Gambling sites, and other examples you've given have rules too.... Their rules don't have fair play guidelines like WiS, where having knowledge of other areas for recruits..etc is considered cheating. They also have specified parameters where if you're caught abusing multiple accounts (sitting at the same poker table with two separate accounts) you can be prosecuted and/or fined. Really weird flex there, but sure...

You are also perhaps aware of multiple of the types of sites you're throwing out there, do have rules against people breaking their terms of service, and actually enforce them when the rules are broken. Draft Kings for instance -- If you secretly create another account and enter a contest that is meant to have 1 entry per user, you can be fined and/or charged. Do people do it? Sure, because crappy people exist, but the rule is there and IF they find people in error, they act accordingly... Something WiS has never done appropriately... Given we have new people here, that seem MUCH more active and on board with fair play guidelines, perhaps we can actually see consistency and not letting things slide for the sake of "Omg the worlds are dying, we can't lose 1 person"... If they actually enforce appropriately, and act accordingly, my feeling for the need to incorporate anything would diminish greatly... The fact that we have documented evidence of Seble letting things slide, because it was easier than making a stink about it, should speak volumes to why newer players and returning players feel the "Old Boys Club" effect.

There's ways to disallow Emails, Credit Cards...etc from being used on more than one account. It's a very doable process, and not very intricate or tantalizing as you're pretending. WiS may have reasons against implementing them, I don't know, but your arguments are wrong... A simple site mail to CS with "hey, my son is going to play, I'm going to use my credit card to purchase seasons", or even utilizing the gift feature are EASY ways around that and at least make people work a bit harder to cheat, if they choose to be a crappy person.

I find it absolutely ironic that you're using terms like pontificating, when you literally don't play the game but stick around these forums to sling s*** and pretend to puff out your "all knowing" chest... Sit down, Gramps

I am in the same world as a couple of people I know in real life (down to 2 from 6-7 at one time). If we shared scouting info by email, that would be far more damaging than me having two teams in the same world, but far from each other. And it would be 100% untrackable. There are probably 50 other ways we could collude, if we wanted to, that WiS couldn't track.

It's impossible to stop cheating on here, if people want to do it.

Posted by wronoj on 12/17/2020 1:58:00 PM (view original):
I am in the same world as a couple of people I know in real life (down to 2 from 6-7 at one time). If we shared scouting info by email, that would be far more damaging than me having two teams in the same world, but far from each other. And it would be 100% untrackable. There are probably 50 other ways we could collude, if we wanted to, that WiS couldn't track.

It's impossible to stop cheating on here, if people want to do it.

Yes & No...

1st) No one cares if 6-7 friends are helping each other game plan, and vying for a championship. You guys are investing more than you're taking out, and there's no real money to be made by you all investing $12.95 a season to potentially get a $25 gift card for Amazon IF you win a championship... Sure, it's still cheating and I frown upon that level of bending of the rules, but it's less crippling to the game. This happens naturally when vets make super conferences anyways. They may not be sharing information, but they're all bouncing off each other, and soaking recruits up in a large area. The knowledge, skill and level of experience makes it impossible for new players to succeed regardless of collusion or not.

2nd) Its much more of a problem, when people are creating duplicate accounts, getting discounts on seasons (or using free seasons) to stack the odds in their favor.... Team jumping, scouting for their main team...etc is more crippling to the game, because it effects everyone over the course of the game, and not the same group of friends who took over recruiting in an area of the map.

3rd) There are ways to track it... We all saw (or most of us) saw Sportsbulls get a warning for signing a bunch of crappy players on purpose to screw with AB90. They went in and could tell to what level the recruits were recruited to, and felt it went against the fair play guidelines. If people saw the same 6-7 people on recruits, and sensed something fishy, it could be reported and looked into....

4th) There will always be cheaters... The answer isn't just "Forget it, if people want to do it, they will"... The idea should be making this game as fair as possible and ensuring the integrity of the game is preserved. Thats the goal...

The real solution, could be as simple as removing the incentive for people to cheat... Stop giving so many credits for teams that don't win. Discourage random team jumping, and encourage guys stick around and build championship caliber teams... No one is spending $12.95 on 2-3 accounts to maybe win $25 in Amazon Giftcards lol.... For those that don't recognize this, there are several players that play ONLY for the chance at Reward Points to get Gift Cards... It's the main monetary incentive for people cheating, and abusing the system.

Again -- We have new people in charge here... Adam has been more vocal than any other admin I've ever seen in 17 years on this site. Perhaps they'll take charge, and make a long lasting impact. I can tell you that I've been largely impressed with his responses and efforts to bring this game back from near extinction, but I still need to see actions before I get ahead of myself. If we're all theory crafting here, then I'm going to provide 2 cents to the theory craft. If we start seeing more active admins, and actual differences being made that impose penalties and enforce rules consistently and effectively, maybe nothing needs to be done at alll... Time will tell.

You’re factually wrong or sketchy on quite a bit here lilspike.

1) Lots of people care, or at least should, if they think multiple accounts are a serious problem. We’re not talking about emailing each other to help “game plan,” which isn’t against fair play guidelines in the first place. Multiple people *can* collude in the ways you’re talking about using emails.

2) “Much more?” Based on what data? How do you know how significant this problem is?

3) Sportsbulls wasn’t screwing with AB90. He was gaming the system to give himself a better shot at some D2 pool recruits that he might potentially have wanted if he moved to D2. It was a FPG gray area, and needed some clarity, seble came down on preferring that it not be done, but stopped short of calling it outright cheating. He did give a warning to sportsbulls, which was pretty ridiculous, given the circumstances, but that had nothing to do with any harm caused to any specific players, certainly not AB90.

Now I agree the idea is to remove the incentive to cheat. Totally. That’s why 3.0 was a big step in the right direction. A lot of the folks still doing this stuff (or still convinced lots of people are doing this kind of stuff) are still stuck in the mode of the previous version of the game where the payoff for doing this kind of thing was much higher, and the stakes were higher, too. When 51 beats 49 100% of the time in recruiting, those battles are much higher stakes, ie there is more incentive to bend the rules or outright collude. Right now, it just seems like a lot of work to do if the goal is trying to see a few extra recruits that you may or may not have to battle for anyway. I’m not saying no one does it, or no one does it successfully. But the vast majority of people who are successful at this game laugh at the notion of needing or even wanting an extra account to help them do it.

Posted by lilspike0738 on 12/17/2020 2:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wronoj on 12/17/2020 1:58:00 PM (view original):
I am in the same world as a couple of people I know in real life (down to 2 from 6-7 at one time). If we shared scouting info by email, that would be far more damaging than me having two teams in the same world, but far from each other. And it would be 100% untrackable. There are probably 50 other ways we could collude, if we wanted to, that WiS couldn't track.

It's impossible to stop cheating on here, if people want to do it.

Yes & No...

1st) No one cares if 6-7 friends are helping each other game plan, and vying for a championship. You guys are investing more than you're taking out, and there's no real money to be made by you all investing $12.95 a season to potentially get a $25 gift card for Amazon IF you win a championship... Sure, it's still cheating and I frown upon that level of bending of the rules, but it's less crippling to the game. This happens naturally when vets make super conferences anyways. They may not be sharing information, but they're all bouncing off each other, and soaking recruits up in a large area. The knowledge, skill and level of experience makes it impossible for new players to succeed regardless of collusion or not.

2nd) Its much more of a problem, when people are creating duplicate accounts, getting discounts on seasons (or using free seasons) to stack the odds in their favor.... Team jumping, scouting for their main team...etc is more crippling to the game, because it effects everyone over the course of the game, and not the same group of friends who took over recruiting in an area of the map.

3rd) There are ways to track it... We all saw (or most of us) saw Sportsbulls get a warning for signing a bunch of crappy players on purpose to screw with AB90. They went in and could tell to what level the recruits were recruited to, and felt it went against the fair play guidelines. If people saw the same 6-7 people on recruits, and sensed something fishy, it could be reported and looked into....

4th) There will always be cheaters... The answer isn't just "Forget it, if people want to do it, they will"... The idea should be making this game as fair as possible and ensuring the integrity of the game is preserved. Thats the goal...

The real solution, could be as simple as removing the incentive for people to cheat... Stop giving so many credits for teams that don't win. Discourage random team jumping, and encourage guys stick around and build championship caliber teams... No one is spending $12.95 on 2-3 accounts to maybe win $25 in Amazon Giftcards lol.... For those that don't recognize this, there are several players that play ONLY for the chance at Reward Points to get Gift Cards... It's the main monetary incentive for people cheating, and abusing the system.

Again -- We have new people in charge here... Adam has been more vocal than any other admin I've ever seen in 17 years on this site. Perhaps they'll take charge, and make a long lasting impact. I can tell you that I've been largely impressed with his responses and efforts to bring this game back from near extinction, but I still need to see actions before I get ahead of myself. If we're all theory crafting here, then I'm going to provide 2 cents to the theory craft. If we start seeing more active admins, and actual differences being made that impose penalties and enforce rules consistently and effectively, maybe nothing needs to be done at alll... Time will tell.

I mean, lilspike I can make a long last impact by telling you all I don't accept cheating, but our CS tools are built on old *** Microsoft Technology from the early 2000's. If I type your name in there and miss a digit or a character, it gives me no results. There is no magical batch job to compare emails that will automatically flag accounts with similar emails, addresses, or CC's.

While we talk about CC's that information lives on the Sportshub/Fanball site and probably 50-75% of the WIS ID's match the Fanball//Sporthub IDs. So yes I can look for matching CC's and for matching emails, but I am sorry I have to outsource the discovery of these instances to you all. When it is reported I will take it very seriously, investigate and make sure we handle it appropriately, but I have eight games to manage, three communities bigger or just as big as this one of HD players. I don't accept cheating, but Chris and I think bringing more people to these games and improving these games is very important.

I will touch on one thing you brought up which is the HD discounts, GD a couple years back went to scaling world rewards with how full worlds are, it was a disaster from what I heard. With that said, the revenue per coach on HD is 20% lower than any other game because of the reward system. We currently give awards of $3.00 for making the tournament (64 teams) in World's where the division population usually sits around 100, give or take 20 coaches. So we essentially reward the top 60%. Just food for thought...

Like I said if you sense people doing this report it, I take this stuff seriously, but going out and proactively and looking for it is not an easy task lilpike, I am not trying to pass the buck, its just I only have so many hours in the day.

Thanks.

Posted by shoe3 on 12/17/2020 2:58:00 PM (view original):
You’re factually wrong or sketchy on quite a bit here lilspike.

1) Lots of people care, or at least should, if they think multiple accounts are a serious problem. We’re not talking about emailing each other to help “game plan,” which isn’t against fair play guidelines in the first place. Multiple people *can* collude in the ways you’re talking about using emails.

2) “Much more?” Based on what data? How do you know how significant this problem is?

3) Sportsbulls wasn’t screwing with AB90. He was gaming the system to give himself a better shot at some D2 pool recruits that he might potentially have wanted if he moved to D2. It was a FPG gray area, and needed some clarity, seble came down on preferring that it not be done, but stopped short of calling it outright cheating. He did give a warning to sportsbulls, which was pretty ridiculous, given the circumstances, but that had nothing to do with any harm caused to any specific players, certainly not AB90.

Now I agree the idea is to remove the incentive to cheat. Totally. That’s why 3.0 was a big step in the right direction. A lot of the folks still doing this stuff (or still convinced lots of people are doing this kind of stuff) are still stuck in the mode of the previous version of the game where the payoff for doing this kind of thing was much higher, and the stakes were higher, too. When 51 beats 49 100% of the time in recruiting, those battles are much higher stakes, ie there is more incentive to bend the rules or outright collude. Right now, it just seems like a lot of work to do if the goal is trying to see a few extra recruits that you may or may not have to battle for anyway. I’m not saying no one does it, or no one does it successfully. But the vast majority of people who are successful at this game laugh at the notion of needing or even wanting an extra account to help them do it.

He didn't openly admit to it, but we all know it was 100% to stop people like AB90 from securing a title team... I do 100% agree it was BS that he got a warning, and it angered me greatly (The lack of consistency to how things were handled by Seble). I was more using that as an example of "we have seen evidence of WiS research into recruiting"...

I don't have any evidence other than financial.... 6-7 guys paying $12.95 a piece to maybe get $25 out of it, seems less likely to happen. If it does, it seems less impactful overall, as that many guys are going to effect recruiting CRAZY amounts anyways, anywhere they go.... They *most likely* wont be able to find enough "Far From Home" preferences to benefit from taking over the entire continent, and would struggle to fill out championship rosters all.... All in all, you're correct... Very little evidence to prove this, but just seems less impactful than 1 user who utilizes discounts, free seasons...etc to benefit their "main team". They don't have to play themselves for a 'ship, and don't provide anything to the game like 6-7 users are. Just my opinion, you are correct about that.

You could be correct... Perhaps it's less of an issue than we believe... I've been back a few months now, and i've already seen examples of people playing themselves in the NT (one guy throwing the game entirely), which seems to be a silly problem to still have and shouldn't happen. (Especially with money given to 2nd round+)

Bulls 100% signed those players so that someone couldn't piggyback his team and win. I know that with great certainty shoe. Just for the record

Posted by adlorenz on 12/17/2020 3:04:00 PM (view original):

Posted by lilspike0738 on 12/17/2020 2:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by wronoj on 12/17/2020 1:58:00 PM (view original):
I am in the same world as a couple of people I know in real life (down to 2 from 6-7 at one time). If we shared scouting info by email, that would be far more damaging than me having two teams in the same world, but far from each other. And it would be 100% untrackable. There are probably 50 other ways we could collude, if we wanted to, that WiS couldn't track.

It's impossible to stop cheating on here, if people want to do it.

Yes & No...

1st) No one cares if 6-7 friends are helping each other game plan, and vying for a championship. You guys are investing more than you're taking out, and there's no real money to be made by you all investing $12.95 a season to potentially get a $25 gift card for Amazon IF you win a championship... Sure, it's still cheating and I frown upon that level of bending of the rules, but it's less crippling to the game. This happens naturally when vets make super conferences anyways. They may not be sharing information, but they're all bouncing off each other, and soaking recruits up in a large area. The knowledge, skill and level of experience makes it impossible for new players to succeed regardless of collusion or not.

2nd) Its much more of a problem, when people are creating duplicate accounts, getting discounts on seasons (or using free seasons) to stack the odds in their favor.... Team jumping, scouting for their main team...etc is more crippling to the game, because it effects everyone over the course of the game, and not the same group of friends who took over recruiting in an area of the map.

3rd) There are ways to track it... We all saw (or most of us) saw Sportsbulls get a warning for signing a bunch of crappy players on purpose to screw with AB90. They went in and could tell to what level the recruits were recruited to, and felt it went against the fair play guidelines. If people saw the same 6-7 people on recruits, and sensed something fishy, it could be reported and looked into....

4th) There will always be cheaters... The answer isn't just "Forget it, if people want to do it, they will"... The idea should be making this game as fair as possible and ensuring the integrity of the game is preserved. Thats the goal...

The real solution, could be as simple as removing the incentive for people to cheat... Stop giving so many credits for teams that don't win. Discourage random team jumping, and encourage guys stick around and build championship caliber teams... No one is spending $12.95 on 2-3 accounts to maybe win $25 in Amazon Giftcards lol.... For those that don't recognize this, there are several players that play ONLY for the chance at Reward Points to get Gift Cards... It's the main monetary incentive for people cheating, and abusing the system.

Again -- We have new people in charge here... Adam has been more vocal than any other admin I've ever seen in 17 years on this site. Perhaps they'll take charge, and make a long lasting impact. I can tell you that I've been largely impressed with his responses and efforts to bring this game back from near extinction, but I still need to see actions before I get ahead of myself. If we're all theory crafting here, then I'm going to provide 2 cents to the theory craft. If we start seeing more active admins, and actual differences being made that impose penalties and enforce rules consistently and effectively, maybe nothing needs to be done at alll... Time will tell.

I mean, lilspike I can make a long last impact by telling you all I don't accept cheating, but our CS tools are built on old *** Microsoft Technology from the early 2000's. If I type your name in there and miss a digit or a character, it gives me no results. There is no magical batch job to compare emails that will automatically flag accounts with similar emails, addresses, or CC's.

While we talk about CC's that information lives on the Sportshub/Fanball site and probably 50-75% of the WIS ID's match the Fanball//Sporthub IDs. So yes I can look for matching CC's and for matching emails, but I am sorry I have to outsource the discovery of these instances to you all. When it is reported I will take it very seriously, investigate and make sure we handle it appropriately, but I have eight games to manage, three communities bigger or just as big as this one of HD players. I don't accept cheating, but Chris and I think bringing more people to these games and improving these games is very important.

I will touch on one thing you brought up which is the HD discounts, GD a couple years back went to scaling world rewards with how full worlds are, it was a disaster from what I heard. With that said, the revenue per coach on HD is 20% lower than any other game because of the reward system. We currently give awards of $3.00 for making the tournament (64 teams) in World's where the division population usually sits around 100, give or take 20 coaches. So we essentially reward the top 60%. Just food for thought...

Like I said if you sense people doing this report it, I take this stuff seriously, but going out and proactively and looking for it is not an easy task lilpike, I am not trying to pass the buck, its just I only have so many hours in the day.

Thanks.

I apologize, if it comes off as me crapping on your efforts... That is not my intention at all. Simply expressing a frustration with WiS, over the past 17 years. Areas that could have and should have been addressed, but weren't due to laziness amongst I'm sure some other reasons.

I am very hopeful, because of your responses and the effort you've shown in the very limited amount of time you've had the reigns. I understand the limits you have with 2000 Microsoft technology, and I understand the problem it may bring. Simply voicing my opinion in how I would like to see things going forward, and explaining to others how this type of stuff "could" be implemented. Obviously there's a business side to this, and a "what does WiS get out of this" on top of "Where does this fall in the list of sh*t to get done"...

Thanks for the reply, and the input. Here's to hoping a better and brighter future for all of WiS :)

Posted by shoe3 on 12/17/2020 4:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by topdogggbm on 12/17/2020 4:18:00 PM (view original):
Bulls 100% signed those players so that someone couldn't piggyback his team and win. I know that with great certainty shoe. Just for the record

That’s what everyone assumed at first. I’m sure that was a happy byproduct, for you, him, and lots of others. But A) that is in no way, shape, or form “cheating”, and that point was never once disputed by anyone, except maybe ab90. And more importantly, B) the actual thing he was doing, which he came clean about, and which he admitted to doing in a number of other instances when he moved on to higher levels, is actually much closer to a fair play violation, and still exists as a viable gameplay option (I could do it right now in Iba, where I plan to move to D2 next season, if I was so inclined).

3) Sportsbulls wasn’t screwing with AB90. He was gaming the system to give himself a better shot at some D2 pool recruits that he might potentially have wanted if he moved to D2.

I was referring to this shoe. Bulls made the choices he made to sign those garbage recruits, 100% in spite of the coach we mentioned. And not because of any other reason period. CS at the time admitted that "the coach was not playing the game in the manner it was intended to be played". But did nothing about it. They SAID they were going to do something. To quiet the uproar, but they didn't follow thru. (Which is along the lines of some of the things lilspike is saying.)

That's also the reason when bulls got a warning for that, the forums had an explosive thread follow up. Those days are behind us and we're on to greener pastures. But I am just trying to be clear here about the intent of that situation. I'm just glad that under the new HD regime, that progress will be made and we can all love each other now...... I mean you do love me, right shoe?

Posted by topdogggbm on 12/18/2020 5:02:00 AM (view original):

Posted by shoe3 on 12/17/2020 4:37:00 PM (view original):

Posted by topdogggbm on 12/17/2020 4:18:00 PM (view original):
Bulls 100% signed those players so that someone couldn't piggyback his team and win. I know that with great certainty shoe. Just for the record

That’s what everyone assumed at first. I’m sure that was a happy byproduct, for you, him, and lots of others. But A) that is in no way, shape, or form “cheating”, and that point was never once disputed by anyone, except maybe ab90. And more importantly, B) the actual thing he was doing, which he came clean about, and which he admitted to doing in a number of other instances when he moved on to higher levels, is actually much closer to a fair play violation, and still exists as a viable gameplay option (I could do it right now in Iba, where I plan to move to D2 next season, if I was so inclined).

3) Sportsbulls wasn’t screwing with AB90. He was gaming the system to give himself a better shot at some D2 pool recruits that he might potentially have wanted if he moved to D2.

I was referring to this shoe. Bulls made the choices he made to sign those garbage recruits, 100% in spite of the coach we mentioned. And not because of any other reason period. CS at the time admitted that "the coach was not playing the game in the manner it was intended to be played". But did nothing about it. They SAID they were going to do something. To quiet the uproar, but they didn't follow thru. (Which is along the lines of some of the things lilspike is saying.)

That's also the reason when bulls got a warning for that, the forums had an explosive thread follow up. Those days are behind us and we're on to greener pastures. But I am just trying to be clear here about the intent of that situation. I'm just glad that under the new HD regime, that progress will be made and we can all love each other now...... I mean you do love me, right shoe?

So you’re saying he made a false confession to something that looked a lot more like cheating in the actual thread, but he was actually just screwing with one guy in particular all along (which no one thinks is cheating), like we all thought to begin with?

You are making no sense, sir.

Here’s the text from the confession, with seble’s response:

Quote post by seble on 8/24/2020 6:29:00 PM:

Posted by Sportsbulls on 8/24/2020 6:16:00 PM (view original):

Posted by seble on 8/24/2020 6:11:00 PM (view original):
How were you targeting recruits for a different school here? You signed them in session 1.

I'll just lay out my steps for my strategy so it becomes clear.

1. Scout D2 in my local area that I'd normally scout and pursue and save $500
2. Get scholarships on guys I'd take at my future D2/D3 team (maybe bump down sims or D2s)
3. Scout FSS D3 around my area with that $500
4. Fill up my openings with those players
5. Get to new school
6. Sign player my old school was at VH with no schollies on

Make sense?

So yes, please stop doing that. While it's certainly a gray area, you're clearing not operating the current school in good faith, which goes against the spirit of fair play. I'm not sure I would ever issue punishment for that, but it's exactly what I mean when I reference people bending the rules in order to gain any small advantage.

This is not the same as a coach recruiting for the current school, deciding to change jobs, then signing some of those players. I understand it's a fine line, and not something that's easy to prove, but intentions should matter. In this case, you're clearly using the current school to gain an advantage at a future school.

Posted by shoe3 on 12/18/2020 12:23:00 PM (view original):
Here’s the text from the confession, with seble’s response:

Quote post by seble on 8/24/2020 6:29:00 PM:

Posted by Sportsbulls on 8/24/2020 6:16:00 PM (view original):

Posted by seble on 8/24/2020 6:11:00 PM (view original):
How were you targeting recruits for a different school here? You signed them in session 1.

I'll just lay out my steps for my strategy so it becomes clear.

1. Scout D2 in my local area that I'd normally scout and pursue and save $500
2. Get scholarships on guys I'd take at my future D2/D3 team (maybe bump down sims or D2s)
3. Scout FSS D3 around my area with that $500
4. Fill up my openings with those players
5. Get to new school
6. Sign player my old school was at VH with no schollies on

Make sense?

So yes, please stop doing that. While it's certainly a gray area, you're clearing not operating the current school in good faith, which goes against the spirit of fair play. I'm not sure I would ever issue punishment for that, but it's exactly what I mean when I reference people bending the rules in order to gain any small advantage.

This is not the same as a coach recruiting for the current school, deciding to change jobs, then signing some of those players. I understand it's a fine line, and not something that's easy to prove, but intentions should matter. In this case, you're clearly using the current school to gain an advantage at a future school.

Sure..... I know what was written. But I talked to bulls all the time. I'm not gonna come here and lie. The "gray area" you guys talk about with some things..... consider what's written above to be gray. I'll just leave it at that.