Twist & Clones Tournament - Writeup Topic

1943 Cardinals: 79-83 (.488), Exp% .550, missed WC by 3 games and R2 by 2 games
Positives: Well, our .550 Exp% was 3rd-best in the NL, so certainly some things went right. Our 13-23 1-run record wasn't one of them. I guess that belongs in the negatives. My two Musials were as good as expected and finished 2-4 in the MVP. Harry Walker put up a .393 OBP and scored 146 runs. The middle infielders even hit a little. 43 Mort Cooper went 22-7, 3.66.
Negatives: 42 Cooper, who should be better, went 15-15, 5.19. The bullpen blew 13 of 47 saves. The aforementioned 1-run record was terrible. Walker Cooper didn't hit much, .270/.302/.384. Overall, a pretty disappointing season for a team that should have been in the playoffs.

1970 Orioles: 90-72 (.556), Exp% .535, won division by 12, currently 1-1 in the WS
Positives: 75 Jim Palmer (17-15, 3.95) and 69 Mike Cuellar (16-13, 3.53) were very effective, even if the W-L records don't reflect it. Only the 76 O's gave up fewer runs than we did. The key relievers definitely did their jobs. We led the league with a .990 FLD%. Don Buford (.298/.398/.481) was a great table-setter.
Negatives: 68 Dave McNally gave up 76 homers and went 16-16, 5.14. Bobby Grich did hit 31 homers but not much else (.229/.296/.423). 66 Frank Robinson (.244/.325/.413) underachieved.

1924 Tigers: 79-83 (.488), Exp% .508, 5 games back in division
Positives: We sure did hit, scoring the most runs in the league. 11 Cobb (.413/.453/.523) and 17 Cobb (.399/.453/.578) racked up 319 and 309 hits, respectively, tops in the league, and were the only players over 200 runs (212 and 213). They also combined for 77 plus plays. Imagine if they hadn't played most of the season at 90-92 fatigue due to batting so darn much! 28 Heinie Manush (285), 21 Heilmann (271) and 23 Heilmann (265) were also in the top 12 in hits. Both my Gehringers topped 200 hits, too. The Heilmanns were 1-2 in RBI with 197 and 193, and Manush was 4th with 187. So, yeah, offense was not a problem. And 14 Dutch Leonard went 17-5, 4.37, but unfortunately he could only pitch 226 innings and that left 1200+ for all the stooges.
Negatives: One hitter disappointed: 37 Gehringer (.293/.368/.390) paled amid a lineup of huge performances. 36 Gehringer hit well, but he committed 47 errors and 14 minus plays out of position at 3B. SS Topper Rigney couldn't hit or field. Every other pitcher was, as expected, execrable.

All told, I have to be happy with a WS win and another team playing in one. I should have had 5 teams advance instead of 4. The Tigers were a lot of fun to play even with virtually no pitching. Despite that team's name, we played only one 13-12 game. But we had 25 games where both teams hit double digits.
12/30/2024 12:54 AM

Picks 9 and 10:
MIN2005
OAK1987

2005 MIN was the 3rd pick in its mini-era, right behind 2007 and 2006, though I have 2005 slightly ahead of the others. Most importantly, I avoided the other two in my division. 2005's biggest advantage is Bret Boone, who will actually play 2B and 3B for me (2006 and 07 have Luis Castillo and either Cirillo or Phil Nevin). 2005 also gets Francisco Liriano. But mostly this is the Mauer/Morneau/Hunter era of Twins baseball, offensively. And of course Johan Santana and Joe Nathan on the pitching staff. I added two Michael Cuddyers and a Jason Bartlett to my clones of Mauer/Morneau/Hunter/Boone. And the pitching staff is Santana clones, Liriano, a strong pen and some innings eaters (Joe Mays and Kyle Lohse). My division spans all the way back to schwarze's 1970 with two 80s teams (1987 and 1988) in the middle, so it should be interesting how it plays out. At least we all avoid the Walter Johnson years.

For the first time, I'm looking at the era of a team and what league/division they're likely to end up in. I'm purposefully putting off the White Sox to make sure I'm out of the NL and don't have to face the deadball era juggernauts. The A's, similarly, have their best teams around 1910 (1908-12) and 1930 (1927-31). Luckily, I got far enough away to avoid them--9 teams were picked from 1931 and earlier but none others from before 1970 meaning 3 of the early 70s teams got pushed to the NL. 1987 OAK ended up with two surrounding teams (1985 and 89) as well as 1976, but is more balanced than all 3 with better pitching than 1989 and better hitting than 1985 and 1976. The bash brothers are both cloned as is adopted bash brother Reggie Jackson. A pair of Tony Phillips plus a Ron Cey and Walt Weiss man the infield with Tettleton at catcher. Canseco is on all 3 of the 85/87/89 teams but McGwire is only on the latter two and Jackson is only on 87 (to be fair, 89 gets Rickey). The pitching staff gets Rijo, Eckersley, Ontiveros, Lamp, and Howell. This feels like the sweet spot between 1985 (Sutton but no McGwire or Rickey) and 1989 (Rickey but no Rijo or Reggie). Hopefully that plays out in our division.

My 2005 Twins team started slow but finished well, with 92 wins and a wild card berth. Although we avoided 2006 and 07 in our division, that ended up being a bad thing--we beat both of those teams but lost the division to schwarze's 1970 Twins. However, our 92 wins were still good for 2nd-best in the AL. This ended up being my 10th-best team, overall was about as expected.

My most (positively) surprising team was the 87 A's. They ended up winning 103 games and getting me my lone Top 16 pick. Part of that was a bit of good fortune with a 21-13 1-run record but our .618 Exp% was still very good and best in the league. We finished #1 in the AL in scoring (155 runs above average) and #2 in defense (76 runs allowed better than average), so this was probably my most balanced team as well.

Picks 11 and 12:
NYY2021
SFG1998

I was the 22nd pick among Yankees teams. As I went to look at them, I was excited because 1933 showed up very highly, but that was because I was counting Ruth separately as a hitter and pitcher, and I guess you can't have 4 Ruths. I still considered them but ended up wanting to avoid the Ruth/Gehrig years (schwarze took 1933 right after me). 2021 NYY ended up in a division with 2016, 2006 and 2005. Those earlier two teams will be tough to beat with a ton of big-name firepower on both sides of the ball. Still, 2021 is no slouch and our pitching should be able to compete with Kluber and Cole leading the rotation and Chapman x2, Green x2, and Britton x2 in the pen. The offense seems good with two Judges, two Rizzos, two LeMaheius, Giancarlo Stanton and two Gary Sanchezes behind the plate. The weakest spot is SS where Gleyber Torres can't hold a candle to Jeter/A-Rod, of course. The other issue is this is a HR-hitting team but with a HR-prone staff (Cole in particular). I played it down the middle and went with Seals Stadium which is +0 to LF and -1 to RF for home runs (Rizzo is my only lefty). We'll see. Feel okay about the chances here given it was one of the last picks for the Yanks.

Again the 3rd-to-last pick but I have 1998 as the 2nd-best Giants season--what gives? Well, 2002 is #1 and I'm likely in their division (and I did end up there). Obviously both have Bonds as well as Kent and Aurilia in the infield. 1998 has Ellis Burks, while 2002 has Kenny Lofton. On the pitching side, 98 has Hershiser vs Schmidty for 2002. 2002 does have Nathan in the bullpen to join Robb Nen (who is available for both years). barracuda3 posted in the league chat that he had 1998 close to his pick of 2002, I agree. I ended up rostering 2004 JT Snow to platoon at 1B with my Jeff Kent clone. Darry Hamilton and Bill Mueller join as well but this is mostly a Bonds/Kent/Burks/Aurilia offense. Hershiser anchors the pitching staff and I went mostly without a true 3rd starter (Russ Ortiz will spot start) meaning Danny Darwin clones of 163 and 122 IP are my next-longest pitchers. The rest of the staff is relievers (Nen x2, Poole x2, Steve Reed x2, Jose Mesa). Optimistic about this group, although may not beat out 2002 for the division title.

For much of the season, my 2021 Yanks were one of my stragglers, but a big late run pushed them all the way into the wild card spot until we fell out right at the end. However, that was still good enough to advance with an 86-76 record that ended up 4th-best in the AL. The pitching was the key, as expected, #2 in the AL but the offense was actually below average. Just so much Yankees firepower. For picking 3rd-to-last among NYY teams, happy to get them through.

Unlike my Yankees pick, I had higher expectations for this 98 Giants team and it ended up being right. We finished with 99 wins, best in the AL and tied for 2nd-best overall for the Giants, just 2 behind schwarze's 1916 team. The offense was elite, #1 overall, and the pitching held its own. I was battling fatigue issues on both sides all season partly because this offense ended up being even better than I thought. barracuda's 2002 team "only" won 90 games but their .585 Exp% was much closer to our .621 mark.

Picks 13 and 14:
BOS1942
BAL1966

Now it's getting tough to find any good options and so mostly looking for a division/league I can advance out of or just a fun team. Boston has all the Pedro years in the late 90s/early 00s plus the Ruth deadball years. I decided to go in the middle of those to the Ted Williams era, although the years right in front of my 1942 selection are all likely as good or better, especially 1941. Unfortunately, I'm in the division with 1941. The offenses for 1941 and 42 are almost identical, but 1941 has Lefty Grove and Nels Potter and 1942 doesn't really get to counter with anything (Bill Butland anyone?). But while this team may not advance, we still have two Teddy Ballgames, two Foxxes (four if you count Pete Fox!), two Cronins, two Doerrs, and two Dimaggios (Dom, alas, not Joe). I stuck them in Fenway and this should be fun.

For Baltimore, I had looked at some of the Ripken years, but the teams just didn't fit great and once schwarze took 1995 and jfranco77 took 1998, I didn't really want to fish in that pond. Instead, I went for a weaker era with 1966 and I actually ended up as the last team in the NL with the weaker St. Louis Browns teams. We'll see if those deadball pitchers hold my offense down but it's not like they have the best of pitching. By ERC#, I have 1966 as by far the best in the NL. I have just two starters--one each of Jim Palmer and Dave McNally--but then 5 pairs of clones in the bullpen--Stu Miller, Eddie Fisher, Dick Hall, Eddie Watt, and Moe Drabowsky. All have tons of innings for relievers with 5 of them over 100 innings and all of them over 65. The offense has tons of pop with two Frank Robinsons, a Brooks, two Boog Powells, two Davey Johnsons, and Mike Epstein. Catcher is weak and Luis Aparicio is all-glove no-hit at SS but the top 7 in the order should mash. For a late pick feel good about this one, though ending up with the deadballers gives some uncertainty.

Somehow, this 1942 Red Sox team ended up cruising to a division title but that was due in large part to our 19-12 1-run record. For comparison, thejuice6's 1941 team had an Exp % almost identical to ours (.537 for me, .526 for him) but went an opposite 12-19 in 1-run games. The offense crushed, trailing only njbigwig's 1940 team and the pitching was below average but reasonable enough to keep us in games.

We ended up choosing correctly/getting lucky in getting the 1966 Orioles into the right division, winning the NL West by 10 games. The offense was below average but the pitching was 2nd-best in the NL and that carried us. One last interesting note is that despite our 24-13 1-run record, indicating good luck, our Exp% was an almost exact match (and in fact, slightly above) our Actual Win%, .528 to .525.

Picks 15 and 16:
CLE1950
CHW2022

I had the last pick in the Cleveland draft and there wasn't much left. I got to pick my league and division, though, and went to the NL with 1950, avoiding the dominant 90s Indians hitters. My division is the year before me (1949) plus two years just outside of the dead ball era (1921 and 22). We're probably the worst of the bunch thanks to the poor pitching--Bob Feller and Bob Lemon bring 4 seasons for 300+ IP and I cloned Early Wynn and Mike Garcia as well but there's not much quality to go with the volume. Our roster should be almost identical to 1949 but they will have Minnie Minoso and/or Ken Keltner. Boudreau at SS/C is always awesome. Two Larry Dobys in the outfield and two Al Rosens and two Mickey Vernons to handle 1B/3B/DH. Bobby Avila and Joe Grodon will fight it out for 2B at-bats. The weak spot is our last OF spot, with Dale Mitchell and Thurman Tucker the best candidates. Not much hope of advancement here unless we luck out and win the division.

I absolutely wanted to avoid the NL and specifically the teams from the 1910s in White Sox history. This was the last pick but I ended up in the weaker league and probably the weakest division. This is not the easiest build, but the pitching staff pieces together into a decent enough group with Cueto and Keuchel providing bulk and a slew of modern relievers headed by Liam Hendriks clones in the bullpen. The offense is a little weird--I ended up rostering 3 catchers with two Grandals who will fill in at DH/1B some. Jose Abreu is the best hitter with AJ Pollock and Luis Robert providing nice OF seasons. The infield is the weak spot--Elvis Andrus, Yoan Moncada, and Josh Harrison are not great starters and I have SS Tim Anderson backing up all 3 positions meaning playing out of position some at 2B and 3B. My valuations say my team should compete for a division title but this doesn't feel like a good team. Maybe all the White Sox teams just suck.

Well, I didn't think my 1950 Indians had much of a chance outside of winning our division. We did not do that, losing by 12 games and missing the playoffs but surprisingly we did sneak into the last advancement slot from the NL with 84 wins. Not my favorite team to manage and with plenty of PA and IP they were pretty much on auto-pilot so I didn't follow this team as closely.

Definitely was right to avoid those deadball Black Sox teams! The top 4 teams in this entire league were consecutive years from 1915-18. My 2022 team actually did win the division though it wasn't as weak as I thought it might be. The strength of the team was the pitching, #1 in the whole league and the offense wasn't pitiful. The most amazing part, however, is we somehow made the World Series and then upset pedrocerrano's 1916 team that won 105 games and had a .700 (!) Exp.

Picks 17 and 18:
ATL1966
MIN1928

When schwarze opened it up to second teams, I didn't have any in mind but figured I'd take a look. One team in particular caught my eye and that was 1966 ATL. They were on the fringe of the AL/NL and I already had 2001 in the AL but I made the provisional pick. It's one of the weaker eras for the Braves, avoiding the 90s/00s dynasty as well as the random Ruth year and a couple deadball teams that twist well. The offense is really really good, which was the draw. Two Hank Aarons, two Eddie Mathews, two Joe Torres...that's a good start. Denis Menke isn't a great fielder but he has two good seasons and one is better at 2B and the other is better at SS and he can hit. I even cloned Rico Carty who has a couple short PA seasons with good pop. I really like how the offense came together. And the pitching isn't too bad--two Phil Niekros and a Pat Jarvis give 750 innings in the rotation. Jarvis also has a nice relief season joining a couple Ron Reeds and Ted Abernathys in the pen. For a bonus pick, this one has a chance.

My other bonus pick is purely for fun. 1928 Senators have all the hitting of the other 20s teams but no Walter Johnson. While I almost lucked out and completely avoided the Big Unit in my division, I ended up with 1927 johning me which is the best team, by far, for this franchise. Garland Braxton can only do so much so I won't even mention the rest of the pitching staff. But the offense is going to be so much fun. My first 6 hitters are two Sislers, two Goslins, and two Cronins. One of the Sams (West or Rice) will fill in an outfield spot. I may even play some guys out of position at 2B/3B just to get all the best bats in the lineup, including a good Joe Judge year. Absolutely zero chance to advance, but I get to manage a team with guys named Muddy, Goose, and Ossie Bluege. That's a win.

My 66 Braves were as average as can be--81-81 record, 1051 runs scored and 1049 allowed. The offense was awesome, 2nd in the whole league. The NL was the weaker league and the West the weakest division so we were in it until the end. We ended up losing the division by 3 games but tied for the wild card, but lost the play-in game. We still advanced, though this ended up being my 17th-ranked team, so I didn't end up using this spot.

Possibly my favorite team of this round, the 28 Senators were fun. With so many PA and IP, plus a ton of offense and no pitching, this was the perfect team to stick in a hitter's park so I put them in Coors. While I was correct that we couldn't compete in the division--1927 beat us by 17 games--I was shocked that we hung around and eventually advanced with an 83-79 record. Our offense was more above average than our defense/pitching was below average, though they were far and away #1 and #24. This actually ended up being my 16th-ranked team so they did secure a spot in Round 2.

=====================

Thanks as always to schwarze (and thejuice6!) for these tournaments. Ton of fun. Looking forward to Round 2!
12/30/2024 11:12 PM

1911 Indians - Didn't catch the post of the tourney until the following day. I wanted to scramble for a good pick right away and I probably made a mistake. I saw 1910 Indians were taken right out of the gate so I looked at 1909 and 1911. It was a choice between Joss and Shoeless. I figured I already had Cy Young and Cy Falkenberg so I'd rather have Shoeless Joe Jackson. I knew it was a good team otherwise with 2x Lajoie. But really this was a dumb pick cause now I have to share a division with the 1910 Indians and the 1909 Indians don't.

Result: 76 wins, 470% exp, 9th in RS, 21st in RA. Missed playoffs
It turns out not having Babe Adams is a big deal. And being in the same group as 1910 where calhoop won 94 games and crushed the rest of us was also as bad as I thought it was.

1913 Pirates - I was finally able to do a bit of research and getting a 2x Honus Wagner, Fred Clarke, Max Carey, Claude Hendrix, Babe Adams, Al Mamaux, Howie Camnitz and George McQuillan was too good to pass up. This team had a good intersection of these players in the same year that 1912 and 1914 does not.

Result: 101 wins, .618 exp win%, 3rd in RS, 4th in RA, lost in WS
This was my best team and I was undefeated in the playoffs until the 3rd game of the WS and then never won another game.

1905 Tigers - Tiger teams were pretty open at this point and they were all later Tiger teams. Since no one was taking very early Tiger teams, I decided to research. The biggest problem is that they lacked any real pitching. However Eddie Cicotte pitched 18 innings here so that was a huge find. I have a 2x Cobb, Crawford, and Hickman (who I found out also played 2B). 3B and SS are weak. I’m using 4 unique catchers and drafted over 3000 innings since they’re all starting pitchers. Should be fun.

Result - 87 wins, .536 exp win %, 6th in RS, 18th in RA, missed playoffs
This was a fun team. The Cobbs hit spectacularly well and even Germany Schaefer hit pretty well. 17 Cicotte had a 4.24 ERA but everyone else had an ERA of 6+. We missed the playoffs, but had a good team overall.

1993 Giants – The Giants team of my childhood. When searching Bonds seasons, starting pitching is an issue. 2007 was already taken by this point. Jason Schmidt could be cloned on multiple squads but you’d be hard pressed to find a real good 3rd and 4th starter. 1993 had “Swifty and Burky” and a journeyman relief pitcher named Dave Righetti who almost gave up no home runs in 1981. Much of the 1989 crew was still there including Will Clark, Robby Thompson and Matt Williams. Also “ET McGee” was cloned for a fantastic outfield.

Result - 92 wins, .517 exp win %, 7th in RS, 18th in RA, eliminated in 1st round of playoffs
This team played better than their expected win. Having a double bonds turned out to be really good and the rest of the crew generally hit well minus SS. My best pitcher ended up being Bud Black and that is not a good thing.

1992 Dodgers – the nemesis team of my childhood. I remember a young Pedro Martinez and Vin Scully talking how he might be better that his older brother Ramon who was already one of the better pitchers in the league. I also remember that it was supposed to be a big deal to have Eric Davis and Darryl Strawberry, two local boys, big stars, play in the same outfield together. Whoops, that didn’t work out. The 1992 team was loaded with talent that also had Hershiser and Piazza, but ended up losing 99 games that season.

Result - 85 wins, .475 exp win %, 12th in RS, 16th in RA, lost in 1st round of playoffs
While the 2x Pedro was good, the bottom of my lineup struggled. Turns out playing Mike Sharperson and Dave Anderson in a league like this is not a very good idea. Still, we made the playoffs but I can't be too mad since this team did better than their expected win %.

1964 Braves – I noticed no one had claimed a mid-century Braves team. I quickly did some research and found that 1964 was the only season when Spahn and Niekro were teammates. And yes, those two and their clones are my whole starting rotation. Add in 2x Torre, Aaron, Mathews and the Beeg Boy and this is one of the best lineups in the mid-century.

Result - 82 wins, .512 exp win%, 5th in RS, 18th in RA, won World Series
A team that was mediocre all season won the World Series. Spahn and Niekro were meh as evidenced by my 18th in RA. Playing in Yankee III is one of those factors why they performed as they did. They got hot in the playoffs and it was pretty fun to play them all season.

1961 White Sox – again, didn’t see anyone taking a Joe Horlen season yet. Like my Braves pick, I researched all of his seasons and this one seemed to have the best intersection of other players such as Peters, Sievers, Minoso, Fox and others. I’m not going to be able to compete vs the Ed Walshes, but we’ll hold our own in our division.

Result - 82 wins, .512 exp win%, 18th in RS, 5th in RA, missed playoffs
This team was in 1st place for a good part of the year but tailed off at the end and missed the playoffs. We lost to calhoop's 1933 team. I've played some of those teams in past tourneys and have done well with them so that's not particularly surprising.

1957 Phillies – There were lots of Alexander teams taken. There were lots of Schmidt and 21st century Philly teams taken. But there was a large empty space in the middle and no one had taken a “Whiz Kid” team. I only need to be the best team in my division, surely there would be other mid-century Phillies teams taken, right? 1957 and 1958 were very similar. Both had Ashburn, Roberts, Hacker, Farrell, Lopata, Hamner, Jones and schwarze’s favorite player, Jim Hearn. Tiebreaker went to 57 which had Haddix and Andy Seminick at the cost of not having Wally Post. Unfortunately, I’m paired with the 1917 and 1930 Phillies with their Pete and re-Petes.

Result - 79 wins, .506 exp win%, 20th in RS, 8th in RA, missed playoffs
As expected, we lost out to the 1917 Phillies and their double Petes. My Ashburns were 2nd and 3rd in MVP voting, but the rest of the lineup had their power sapped from deadball pitchers. Pitching was generally strong but the offense was not enough to lift them out of mediocrity.
1/1/2025 12:54 PM
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