Norhrop 18 vs. ISIS Topic

ArlenWilliam
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When Jake Northrop 1918 gets torn up like The Scarecrow in a flock of flying gargoyle monkeys (after the same happens to Dennis Rassmussen 1992) while a fatigued Addie Joss 1908 (at 88) carries the day for the "bad guys."

http://www.whatifsports.com/slb/Boxscore.aspx?gid=24142262&pid=2&pbp=0&tf=12.95

What can ya do?

PS: Craig Kusick? Really?

#TOC
3/9/2015 3:50 PM
ArlenWilliam
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TOC Game
3/9/15 AM
 
 
1
1
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  A.Joss enters the game to pitch.  
  R.Carlyle grounds out to 1B.  
  T.Raines strikes out on a ball out of the zone.  
  H.Rice hits a flyball double to LF.
 
  C.Hickman grounds out to SS.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 1 0
Fletcher's Coverage 0 0 0
1
1
Fletcher's Coverage
  D.Rasmussen enters the game to pitch.  
BH J.Mauer fumbles a slow roller and T.Raines reaches on the error.
 
DPSB T.Raines steals 2B.
 
  B.Roberts hits a groundball single to LF. T.Raines scores.
 
DPSB B.Roberts steals 2B.
 
  M.Dilone hits a shallow flyout to LF.
 
  H.Johnson hits a flyball single to LCF. B.Roberts scores.
 
DPSB H.Johnson is caught trying to steal 2B.  
  C.Jones draws the walk.
 
  D.Rasmussen lets one get away and all runners advance on the wild pitch.
 
  C.Kusick smokes a line drive single to LCF. C.Jones scores.
 
  J.Northrop enters the game to pitch.  
  G.Carter bloops a double to RCF. C.Kusick scores.
 
  R.Scheinblum grounds out to 3B.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 1 1
Fletcher's Coverage 4 4 0
2
2
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  B.Madlock grounds out to SS.  
  H.Johnson pops out to 1B.  
  B.Roberts fouls out to first.  
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 1 1
Fletcher's Coverage 4 4 0
2
2
Fletcher's Coverage
  A.Joss hits a shallow flyout to LF.  
  T.Raines grounds out to 2B.  
  B.Roberts pops out to 2B.  
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 1 1
Fletcher's Coverage 4 4 0
3
3
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  J.Mauer hits a groundball single to RF.
 
CI J.Northrop hits a shallow flyout to LCF.
 
DP R.Carlyle lines out to 2B.
 
  T.Raines flies out to deep LCF.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 2 1
Fletcher's Coverage 4 4 0
3
3
Fletcher's Coverage
BH M.Dilone hits an infield single to 3B.
 
DP H.Johnson hits a bloop single to LCF.
 
DP C.Jones takes ball four.
 
DP C.Kusick grounds into a 1-2-3 double play.
 
  G.Carter lines out to SS.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 2 1
Fletcher's Coverage 4 6 0
4
4
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  H.Rice hits a shallow flyout to CF.  
  C.Hickman grounds out to 1B.  
  B.Madlock grounds out to 1B.  
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 2 1
Fletcher's Coverage 4 6 0
4
4
Fletcher's Coverage
  R.Scheinblum grounds out to SS.  
  A.Joss hits a shallow flyout to LCF.  
  R.Carlyle can't handle a groundball and T.Raines reaches on the error.
 
  B.Roberts flies out to deep RCF.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 2 2
Fletcher's Coverage 4 6 0
5
5
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  H.Johnson hits a shallow flyout to RCF.  
  B.Roberts hits a shallow flyout to RF.  
  J.Mauer grounds out to 1B.  
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 2 2
Fletcher's Coverage 4 6 0
5
5
Fletcher's Coverage
  M.Dilone grounds out to 1B.  
  H.Johnson grounds out to 1B.  
  C.Jones hits a line drive single to LF.
 
  C.Kusick hits into a 4-6 fielder's choice.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 2 2
Fletcher's Coverage 4 7 0
6
6
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  J.Northrop hits a shallow flyout to RCF.  
- R.Carlyle hits an infield single to SS.
 
DP T.Raines hits a shallow flyout to RCF.
 
  H.Rice grounds out to 2B.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 3 2
Fletcher's Coverage 4 7 0
6
6
Fletcher's Coverage
  G.Carter flies out to deep LCF.  
  R.Scheinblum flies out to deep CF.  
  A.Joss pops out to the catcher.  
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 3 2
Fletcher's Coverage 4 7 0
7
7
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  C.Hickman grounds out to SS.  
  B.Madlock strikes out on a ball out of the zone.  
  H.Johnson grounds a single to CF.
 
  B.Roberts grounds out to 2B.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 4 2
Fletcher's Coverage 4 7 0
7
7
Fletcher's Coverage
  T.Raines hits an infield single to 2B.
 
DP B.Roberts grounds a single to RF.
 
DP M.Dilone hits a shallow flyout down the LF line.
 
DP H.Johnson hits a groundball single to RCF. T.Raines scores.
 
DPSB H.Johnson steals second base.
 
II C.Jones draws the walk.
 
DP C.Kusick walks. B.Roberts scores.
 
DP G.Carter grounds it thru the hole to LCF for a single. H.Johnson scores. C.Jones scores.
 
DP R.Scheinblum draws the walk.
 
DP A.Joss hits a shallow flyout to LCF.
 
  T.Raines hits a line drive single to CF. C.Kusick scores. G.Carter is thrown out by C.Hickman in a very close play at the plate.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 0 4 2
Fletcher's Coverage 9 12 0
8
8
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  H.Jennings enters the game at SS to rest the starter.  
  K.Schneider enters the game at 2B to rest the starter.  
  C.Holland enters the game at LF to rest the starter.  
  J.Mauer hits a Texas League single to LCF.
 
  J.Cardenal enters the game as a pinch-hitter for J.Northrop.  
DP T.Raines misplays a lazy flyball and J.Cardenal reaches on the error.
 
DP R.Carlyle grounds it thru the hole to LCF for a single.
 
DP T.Raines pops out to 1B.
 
DP H.Rice hits into a 4-6 fielder's choice. J.Mauer scores.
 
  C.Hickman flies out to deep RF.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 1 6 2
Fletcher's Coverage 9 12 1
8
8
Fletcher's Coverage
  J.Podgajny enters the game to pitch.  
  K.Schneider grounds out to 2B.  
  M.Dilone hits an infield single to 2B.
 
DPSB M.Dilone swipes 2B.
 
  H.Jennings hits a Texas League single to RF. M.Dilone scores.
 
DP C.Jones pops out to 1B.
 
  C.Kusick hits a flyball double to RF. H.Jennings scores.
 
  G.Carter hits a flyball single to LF. C.Kusick scores.
 
  C.Holland pops out to 3B.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 1 6 2
Fletcher's Coverage 12 16 1
9
9
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
  J.Putz enters the game to pitch.  
  B.Madlock grounds a single to RF.
 
DP H.Johnson hits a shallow flyout to RF.
 
DP B.Roberts flies out to deep RF.
 
  J.Mauer is drilled in the knee by a pitch.
 
  S.Alomar Jr. enters the game as a pinch-hitter for J.Podgajny.  
  S.Alomar Jr. hits a grounder to the 3B who steps on the bag for the force.
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism 1 7 2
Fletcher's Coverage 12 16 1
 
 
 
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
Basic View Advanced View Fielding
Player Pos % AB R H RBI BB SO LOB AVG
Roy Carlyle 1B 100 4 0 2 0 0 0 1 .333
Tim Raines LF 100 4 0 0 0 0 1 5 .409
Harry Rice RF 100 4 0 1 1 0 0 4 .192
Charlie Hickman CF 100 4 0 0 0 0 0 3 .325
Bill Madlock 3B 100 4 0 1 0 0 1 0 .308
Howard Johnson SS 100 4 0 1 0 0 0 1 .227
Bip Roberts 2B 100 4 0 0 0 0 0 2 .372
Joe Mauer C 100 3 1 2 0 0 0 0 .371
Dennis Rasmussen P 100 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -
Jake Northrop P 100 2 0 0 0 0 0 1 .000
Jose Cardenal PH 100 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 .200
Johnny Podgajny P 100 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Sandy Alomar Jr. PH 100 1 0 0 0 0 0 2 .200
Game Totals -- 100 35 1 7 1 0 2 -- .200
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
View Basic Advanced View Fielding
Player Pos % AB H 2B 3B HR TB SB CS
Roy Carlyle 1B 100 4 2 0 0 0 2 0 0
Tim Raines LF 100 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Harry Rice RF 100 4 1 1 0 0 2 0 0
Charlie Hickman CF 100 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Bill Madlock 3B 100 4 1 0 0 0 1 0 0
Howard Johnson SS 100 4 1 0 0 0 1 0 0
Bip Roberts 2B 100 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Joe Mauer C 100 3 2 0 0 0 2 0 0
Dennis Rasmussen P 100 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Jake Northrop P 100 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Jose Cardenal PH 100 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Johnny Podgajny P 100 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Sandy Alomar Jr. PH 100 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Game Totals -- 100 35 7 1 0 0 8 0 0
Christmas Cookies Against Collectivism
View Basic View Advanced Fielding
Player Pos PO A E DP SB CS PB + -
Roy Carlyle 1B 7 1 1 1 0 0 0 0 0
Tim Raines LF 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Harry Rice RF 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Charlie Hickman CF 3 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Bill Madlock 3B 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Howard Johnson SS 2 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Bip Roberts 2B 2 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Joe Mauer C 3 2 1 1 4 1 0 0 0
Dennis Rasmussen P 0 0 0 0 2 1 0 0 0
Jake Northrop P 1 1 0 1 1 0 0 0 0
Jose Cardenal PH 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Johnny Podgajny P 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0
Sandy Alomar Jr. PH 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Game Totals -- 24 10 2 3 8 2 0 0 0
 
Batting

2B: H.Rice (1)

RBI: H.Rice (2)

HBP: J.Mauer
Baserunning
 
Fielding

Errors: R.Carlyle (1), J.Mauer (1)
 
Basic View Advanced
Player % IP H R ER BB SO HR PC ERA
Dennis Rasmussen, L (0-1) 100 0.2 3 4 1 1 0 0 22 9.00
Jake Northrop 100 6.1 9 5 5 4 0 0 100 4.82
Johnny Podgajny 100 1.0 4 3 3 0 0 0 22 8.10
Game Totals 100 8.0 16 12 9 5 0 0 144 ---
View Basic Advanced
Player % BFP AB H 2B 3B HR GB FB OAV
Dennis Rasmussen, L (0-1) 100 6 5 3 0 0 0 0 1 .500
Jake Northrop 100 31 27 9 1 0 0 8 10 .250
Johnny Podgajny 100 7 7 4 1 0 0 1 2 .333
Game Totals 100 44 39 16 2 0 0 9 13 ---
 
 
 
 
Fletcher's Coverage
Basic View Advanced View Fielding
Player Pos % AB R H RBI BB SO LOB AVG
Tim Raines RF 100 5 2 2 1 0 0 0 .262
Bip Roberts 2B 100 4 2 2 1 0 0 1 .388
Kenyatta Schneider 2B 100 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 .286
Miguel Dilone CF 98 5 1 2 0 0 0 3 .314
Howard Johnson SS 100 4 1 3 2 0 0 0 .340
Hughie Jennings SS 100 1 1 1 1 0 0 0 1.000
Chipper Jones 3B 100 2 2 1 0 3 0 1 .238
Craig Kusick 1B 100 4 3 2 3 1 0 3 .429
Gary Carter C 100 5 0 3 4 0 0 2 .395
Richie Scheinblum LF 100 3 0 0 0 1 0 1 .000
Cameron Holland LF 90 1 0 0 0 0 0 1 .176
Addie Joss P 88 4 0 0 0 0 0 3 .300
J.J. Putz P 100 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000
Game Totals -- 98 39 12 16 12 5 0 -- .410
Fletcher's Coverage
View Basic Advanced View Fielding
Player Pos % AB H 2B 3B HR TB SB CS
Tim Raines RF 100 5 2 0 0 0 2 1 0
Bip Roberts 2B 100 4 2 0 0 0 2 1 0
Kenyatta Schneider 2B 100 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Miguel Dilone CF 98 5 2 0 0 0 2 1 0
Howard Johnson SS 100 4 3 0 0 0 3 1 1
Hughie Jennings SS 100 1 1 0 0 0 1 0 0
Chipper Jones 3B 100 2 1 0 0 0 1 0 0
Craig Kusick 1B 100 4 2 1 0 0 3 0 0
Gary Carter C 100 5 3 1 0 0 4 0 0
Richie Scheinblum LF 100 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Cameron Holland LF 90 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Addie Joss P 88 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
J.J. Putz P 100 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Game Totals -- 98 39 16 2 0 0 18 4 1
Fletcher's Coverage
View Basic View Advanced Fielding
Player Pos PO A E DP SB CS PB + -
Tim Raines RF 7 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0
Bip Roberts 2B 1 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Kenyatta Schneider 2B 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Miguel Dilone CF 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Howard Johnson SS 0 3 0 0 0 0 0 0 1
Hughie Jennings SS 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Chipper Jones 3B 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Craig Kusick 1B 11 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Gary Carter C 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Richie Scheinblum LF 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Cameron Holland LF 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Addie Joss P 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
J.J. Putz P 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Game Totals -- 27 7 1 0 0 0 0 0 1
 
Batting

2B: C.Kusick (2), G.Carter (3)

RBI: T.Raines (1), B.Roberts (6), H.Johnson 2 (9), H.Jennings (1), C.Kusick 3 (3), G.Carter 4 (8)

2-Out RBI: T.Raines, C.Kusick 2, G.Carter 2
Baserunning

SB: T.Raines (6), B.Roberts (4), M.Dilone (3), H.Johnson (3)

CS: H.Johnson (2)
Fielding

Errors: T.Raines (3)
 
Basic View Advanced
Player % IP H R ER BB SO HR PC ERA
Addie Joss, W (3-2) 88 8.0 6 1 0 0 2 0 97 2.06
J.J. Putz 100 1.0 1 0 0 0 0 0 15 0.00
Game Totals 94 9.0 7 1 0 0 2 0 112 ---
View Basic Advanced
Player % BFP AB H 2B 3B HR GB FB OAV
Addie Joss, W (3-2) 88 31 31 6 1 0 0 10 13 .285
J.J. Putz 100 5 4 1 0 0 0 1 2 .105
Game Totals 94 36 35 7 1 0 0 11 15 ---
 
 
3/9/2015 4:01 PM (edited)
italyprof
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To bad. you could have had a victory celebration - a sort of "Christmas Cookies against Collectivism Party" - or CCCP for short !
 
3/9/2015 4:13 PM
crazystengel
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Too many pitches for Northrop  You''ll notice all the damage came in the final inning of his 100-pitch appearance.  IMO his 5.71 IP/G is good for about 75-80 pitches an appearance.  Beyond that and his in-game fatigue starts to go very low.
3/9/2015 5:06 PM
redwingscup
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They "small balled" their way around in the first with the error and Sbs, grabbed Big Mo and never took their foot off the gas!
3/9/2015 5:09 PM
ArlenWilliam
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Posted by crazystengel on 3/9/2015 5:06:00 PM (view original):
Too many pitches for Northrop  You''ll notice all the damage came in the final inning of his 100-pitch appearance.  IMO his 5.71 IP/G is good for about 75-80 pitches an appearance.  Beyond that and his in-game fatigue starts to go very low.
That's very interesting to me, CS. I'm not aware in my experiences of SLB behaving that way.

I've been using the general rule of dividing IP by GP then multiplying by 18, to give me the very outside edge of pitching fatigue.

Can you show me any more about how pitching fatigue may be divergent from this?

Pretty please?

3/9/2015 6:18 PM
crazystengel
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WIS's number-crunching panjandrums suggest you multiply IP/G by 16.6 for your pitch max.  I used to play a lot of LIVE games here, and based on my observations I go even lover, to 15 for the max. 

For relief appearances made by SP's (which Northrop is), I go even lower.  I could be wrong, but I think SP's used in relief get tired a bit faster than when they're used "properly" (i.e., as starters).
3/9/2015 6:46 PM
ArlenWilliam
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I could be wrong, but I think SP's used in relief get tired a bit faster than when they're used "properly" (i.e., as starters).

Interesting... I'm not doubting you. It's always been amazing what one has to know that isn't published, about basic function for one's money's worth.

About the 16.6 vs. 18, I've just found it at least seems... that some pitchers can be stretched out to 18 or so -- maybe the kinds of guys who have well over 200 IP.
3/9/2015 10:33 PM
ncmusician_7
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1918 Northrop should have a max pitch count of 75 based on the whip, bb/9, k/9, ip/g formula.
3/9/2015 10:39 PM
ArlenWilliam
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Thanks, what formula is that, NCM? Where is it shown -- in a developer chat, or is there a title in the forum about it?
3/9/2015 11:11 PM
ncmusician_7
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Posted by ArlenWilliam on 3/9/2015 11:11:00 PM (view original):
Thanks, what formula is that, NCM? Where is it shown -- in a developer chat, or is there a title in the forum about it?
http://www.whatifsports.com/forums/Posts.aspx?TopicID=154851
3/10/2015 12:10 AM
ArlenWilliam
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Excellent!  And very humorous, since I was the first to congratulate the poster! 

Bookmarked this time!  BTW, by my estimation, Northrop had pitched maybe 65 pitches when he got into trouble, but the first two or three baserunners may have come to the plate without his being fatigued

3/10/2015 11:21 PM (edited)
elbirdo
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Posted by ncmusician_7 on 3/10/2015 12:10:00 AM (view original):
Posted by ArlenWilliam on 3/9/2015 11:11:00 PM (view original):
Thanks, what formula is that, NCM? Where is it shown -- in a developer chat, or is there a title in the forum about it?
http://www.whatifsports.com/forums/Posts.aspx?TopicID=154851
Jake 76 pitches max as starter.  I'm showing a rather low allotment of 13 pitches per real life inning pitched most likely due to his rather low so and bb rates.
3/11/2015 10:52 AM
duece_duece
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But let's talk about the real puzzling part of this story, Joss at 88% to start the game pitches a 97 pitch gem!!
3/17/2015 12:26 AM
ArlenWilliam
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Posted by duece_duece on 3/17/2015 12:26:00 AM (view original):
But let's talk about the real puzzling part of this story, Joss at 88% to start the game pitches a 97 pitch gem!!
Yes, what's up with that? And look at the batters he faced.

There is some language in WIS info that might imply that for fatigued pitchers, sometimes they're penalized and sometimes they're not. I wonder....

3/24/2015 2:16 PM
Norhrop 18 vs. ISIS Topic
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